Rovole Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 The whole idea of paid modifications is unbelievably grotesque. The game modding tradition was built on making mods pro-bono for the sake of enjoyment of the game; a mod you made was a testament to both your ability as a modder and as a tribute to the game you were modding for. The time you put in was given freely for the benefit of the community that shared mods, not as a career. If you honestly can't afford to make a certain mod and make it available for free, honestly I'd prefer that mod never be made no matter how wonderful or amazing it might have been, an outcome prefereable to the commercialization of the hobby of game modding. If you as a modder really had such talent to make a game mod worth paying for, you'd have done better to put your time into something worth buying, such as an actual videogame, instead of trying to piggyback off of a popular game for what amounts to beggar's change. Paid mods are harmful to the community. Money becomes a barrier that prevents certain people from enjoying certain works of labor, and draws lines that will bitterly divide the playerbase. Paid mods will become the bone of contention that turns users against modders, not to mention what would happen if Valve is allowed to have a monopoly on the distribution of unoficcial modifications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terramaris Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) In response to post #24598054. WightMage wrote: Forbes has come out on our side.Cor Blimey!Yesterday I didn't have much hope Valve would listen but with a line from Forbes saying "The pros are technically “modders get paid, the game maker gets paid,” but past that, there are too many cons to count.This will prove to be a disaster, and may damage the PC the modding community irreparably if the practice spreads."...I am speechless from excitement. I mean... if we hold our ground, we could kill Unofficial DLC before it spreads.Edit: Just saw that it was in the opinion section...Eh I will take whatever victory I can. Edited April 24, 2015 by freedom613 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rohok Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 My biggest issue with this is really the sharing of ideas and content. When money is involved, people want to protect their assets. I want to protect my money and whatever earns me money. If a mod that provides a lot of great features is on the market for real cash and another set of mods that are for free could really benefit from the coding or assets of that mod, what happens then? Tough luck? Nobody benefits from commercialization except the big companies. It's like how we can't use Morrowind or Oblivion assets in Skyrim. Imagine if we could. Imagine if that was legal. Now the same restrictions will apply to mods. Did anybody think of this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thestoryteller01 Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 In response to post #24586459. #24586589, #24587144, #24587234, #24598609 are all replies on the same post.OH72 wrote: boulegue wrote: in the EU you have the freedom to do your own contracts... accepting the terms steam has written by buying stuff is accepting them period... youre as well protected as you choose to no more no lessfipse wrote: Steams Terms of Use are not overwriting EU or national law. boulegue wrote: the national law for example in germany is that youre free to make your own contracts the terms dont overwrite the laws they work together the laws give you a framework to work intoggsuk wrote: You don't understand boulegue. In the EU no contract or agreement is above actual law, It doesn't matter what you agree to in a contract, rights granted by law trumps all. The onus is on Steam to comply with those laws if they want to do business in the EU.Actually consumer protection law in the EU has the highest standard worldwide. You can sign a contract and if the terms you signed are colliding with EU or national law (whichever offers better protection) you are free to step back and are entitled to full payback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terramaris Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 In response to post #24595504. #24595544, #24595689, #24595884, #24596144, #24596219, #24598224, #24598659 are all replies on the same post.insaneplumber wrote: Arendella wrote: Are you kidding me....freedom613 wrote: I want to say it is a joke, but Cities: Skyline made a joke at the beginning of the month about Unofficial DLC and yesterday it came true...Salzber wrote: Well f*#@...piratebay hello I'm back.freedom613 wrote: @Salz I wouldn't talk on Nexus about digital piracy...windu190 wrote: Wat....empiric wrote: "Promissory estoppel". People keep rendering this as an issue of mod developers having a right to make money off of their work. They do, this is the weaker argument, and it's not what applies here. What this is analogous to, is you giving me a book which I need as a reference to do X other things, by the methods given in the book. Those methods are the only ways that work to make use of those X other things. I invested my time based on your presentation that the book was free--now, in effect, you are blackmailing me to not be able to do those things I've invested time into unless I now pay. That is theft of my time, as nobody's time is worthless. That's the real objection here, not whether mod authors have a right to get paid. And it is why it is far more ethical to say up-front "this is $10, take it or leave it" then to have people commit their time to you under false pretenses.insaneplumber wrote: Quote Source So, i did a little bit of calculation of the approximate sales and profit made on the first day, so people can see how much money the content creators actually get. These stats were made assuming everybody who subscribed to the item has paid the lowest price option available, and it does not include the price in the bundle (as it is unknown) Gifts of Akatosh [Corvalho] - $731.59 revenue, $100 personal profit Shadow Scale Set [sebastian] - $644.49 revenue, $100 personal profit Sange Sword [T_Vidotto] - $88.25 revenue, $0 personal profit Yasha Sword [T_Vidotto] - $104.00 revenue, $0 personal profit Butterfly Sword [T_Vidotto] - $55.75 revenue, $0 personal profit Lambda Locator [Jimo] - $118.09 revenue, $0 personal profit Purity [Laast] - $1055.47 revenue, $200 personal profit Blazing Ringsword [Fido] - $122.50 revenue, $0 personal profit Scrib Crusher [Fido] - $53.00 revenue, $0 personal profit iNeed [isoku] - $88.11 revenue, $0 personal profit Wet and Cold [isoku] - $229.68 revenue. $0 personal profit Shezrie's Bleakden Town [shezrie] - $344.27 revenue, $0 personal profit Firelink Implements [Vermilion Wlad] - $209.88 revenue, $0 personal profit Midas Magic Gold Edition [xilverbulet] - $615.94 revenue, $100 personal profit The Watcher Staff [Jeremy Klein] - $151.47 revenue, $0 personal profit Blind Raven [RadLyte] - $193.50 revenue, $0 personal profit Arissa - The Wandering Rogue [Chesko] - $499.93 revenue, $100 personal profit Castle Volkihar Rebuilt [Arthmoor] - $471.15 revenue, $100 personal profit Totals $5777.08 Total Revenue $700 paid to 6 content creators $744.27 content creator revenue being withheld $1733.12 Profit for Valve $2599.69 profit for BethesdaI did the maths last night and it was a tad under $4000 and I was doing if everyone paid the max.The fact our numbers are so similar with over 13 hours time apart and myself going for max and you going for min, shows that Valve isn't making much money out of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovole Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) In response to post #24598054. WightMage wrote: Forbes has come out on our side. Cor Blimey! Yesterday I didn't have much hope Valve would listen but with a line from Forbes saying "The pros are technically “modders get paid, the game maker gets paid,” but past that, there are too many cons to count. This will prove to be a disaster, and may damage the PC the modding community irreparably if the practice spreads."...I am speechless from excitement. I mean... if we hold our ground, we could kill Unofficial DLC before it spreads. Valve and Bethesda don't care, its up to the community to think about all the problems that will arise. And up to us to do something about it. Edited April 24, 2015 by Rovole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terramaris Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) In response to post #24599229. Rovole wrote: The thing is, getting called out by Forbes Magazine (though I now learned the article was in the opinion section) would put tremendous pressure on Valve/Bethesda. Forbes is a well respected magazine on Business and Finance, and if they officially said "this will prove to be a disaster", it would hurt Valve and Bethesda's bottom line. Edited April 24, 2015 by freedom613 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyael Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) In response to post #24586459. #24586589, #24587144, #24587234, #24598609, #24599064 are all replies on the same post.OH72 wrote: boulegue wrote: in the EU you have the freedom to do your own contracts... accepting the terms steam has written by buying stuff is accepting them period... youre as well protected as you choose to no more no lessfipse wrote: Steams Terms of Use are not overwriting EU or national law. boulegue wrote: the national law for example in germany is that youre free to make your own contracts the terms dont overwrite the laws they work together the laws give you a framework to work intoggsuk wrote: You don't understand boulegue. In the EU no contract or agreement is above actual law, It doesn't matter what you agree to in a contract, rights granted by law trumps all. The onus is on Steam to comply with those laws if they want to do business in the EU.thestoryteller01 wrote: Actually consumer protection law in the EU has the highest standard worldwide. You can sign a contract and if the terms you signed are colliding with EU or national law (whichever offers better protection) you are free to step back and are entitled to full payback.don't worry about european consumer rights, the EU is about to blow them to pieces with that TTIP crap. Edited April 24, 2015 by Danyael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rovole Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) http://i338.photobucket.com/albums/n437/Gespenst_sam/17%20v%20-%20VALVE%20MAKING%20A%20DUMB%20ASS%20MOVE%20THAT%20MIGHT%20KILL%20THE%20MOD%20COMMUNITY%20-%20Mozilla%20Firefox%20-%20Copy.jpg Edited April 24, 2015 by Rovole Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoDebate Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 I can't open any of the 'paid mod' Workshop pages. "This item is no longer for sale, but if you have purchased it, you will still have access to it." Anyone else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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