Steam Service Providers, and some how needing to clarify the Nexus stance again

[ScenicGaming]

In response to post #24640209. #24640274, #24640649, #24640694, #24640819, #24641869 are all replies on the same post.

Roguespear wrote:

Amelli wrote: I bet you won't even get your money back to your bank either. It will sit in your steam wallet.

Warrior84 wrote: This is true, sadly. Your "money"/credits is tied to steam wallet, you cannot send it to your bank account.

Iceciro wrote: You would be correct; all the refund monies just goes right to your Steam Wallet.

Once Valve has your money, they have your money forever.

Amelli wrote: And if I read right, steam have already washed their hands of any responsibility concerning whether or not a mod is fit for release. Therefore the only warranty you have is from the mod author. And the small window in which you can request a refund if your not happy.
Of course there will be many that will blindly subscribe without thinking about those aspects, checking reviews etc. There is no real protection for the buyers other then their own common sense and others warning them.

WinsomeMinotaur wrote: This is why a Curated space makes sense, where mods that have been vetted and deemed worthy are the ones that have a price tag. That said, I assume you pay a dollar for a mod, and it's buggy, when the author releases bug fixes you are going to get the new version for free, the same way most software works.

However if you unsubscribe do you have to re pay to re sub?

[Eiries]

Read the whole thing out loud to my significant other, almost couldn't finish it. Got real dramatic towards the end.

 

...Money aside, I think its more important than ever that the Nexus is on the list of service providers. More than ever this place needs representation.

[gastovski]

In response to post #24639104.

riverreveal wrote:

This is what i'm trying to say. He said all these stuff like early access, silly preorders, microtransactions yet he stands neutral on this one. He must fight against it altogether. Edited April 25, 2015 by gastovski

[ScenicGaming]

In response to post #24640949. #24641209, #24641459, #24641589, #24641639, #24641819, #24641904 are all replies on the same post.

steveling wrote:

MangoMonkey wrote: Why? This doesn't make any sense? He's entirely transparent about the process. I can kind of understand the notion that you believe he is tacitly "supporting" the Workshop and Valve's move, but his posts have made it clear he doesn't.

At the same time, surely you can't think that he should've actively refused to list the site as a partner? The Nexus requires money - and from my previous experiences with websites and server costs, likely an awful lot of money - to support the modding scene (the free modding scene, I hasten to add) in the way that it does. To continue to develop this site as an alternative to the Workshop, it would've made no sense at all to dismiss Valve's proposal. He did all the leg work he had to to ensure his opinions and site itself remained free to operate.

Amelli wrote: Because he knew about the fact that Valve and Beth would rake in the bigger part of the modders money before he decided he would also take 5% of valves. Why support that? Instead support your community of modders better by providing better tools in which they can be recognised and donated to for their hard work and in so doing raise kudos and therefore more visitors and subscriptions for nexus. At the end of the day, instead of helping the modders get 100% of what they deserve, he has supported valve so he gets a 5% cut of the money for his own site.

Its like a spider telling a fly, we'll let you live so long as you tempt other flies into my web.

Just because it makes a tiny amount of revenue for nexus does NOT make it right.

zzjay wrote: woul'd youu rather have nexus marked as illegal? cvause valve can do that...

Amelli wrote: No Valve cannot do that so long as the mods are not behind a paywall. They cannot do anything about free given mods.

EDIT: Also if they did that they would have to do the same for other sites that allow downloading of mods such as curse.

MangoMonkey wrote: He's done exactly that? He's raised the profile of the donation button, added support for permissions and donations right there in the download button, all within a few days? The tools you wanted are already there, and no doubt more will come? This is directly because of these revenue streams.

Just because Valve is involved at all does not make it wrong, either. The Nexus itself is in no way effected by this deal, other than receiving a trickle of revenue from the Workshop if the author opts into the scheme. Fundamentally: if an author chooses to add a paid mod to the Workshop, and then chooses to support the Nexus, he receives that support. By making the choice to participate, the author has already agreed to Valve's ridiculous 25/75 cost divide. The Nexus doesn't even factor in here?

You want him to take an outright stand against their actions that he doesn't want to take. He supports his site, and his site supports free modding with donations and exposure? You're directing your ire at the wrong people for the wrong reasons, surely?

WightMage wrote: Oh yes they can. At any time, Bethesda can make use of a clause in the Creation Kit which states that they own the copywrite of anything made with CK in perpetuity.

Anything.

They just haven't yet, but people seem to forget that that exists.

And that's the sad truth of it all. At the end of the day, its all about money.

[weijiesen]

In response to post #24641749. #24641849 is also a reply to the same post.

macintroll wrote:

Amelli wrote: I know. Its like they have all suddenly discovered the power of flight and nose dived off a cliff while the modders stare at the dust accumulating on their donation buttons. Sad really.

They won't donate, nor get premium nexus membership, but they'll pay for mods on steam.

[gastovski]

In response to post #24641749. #24641849, #24642044 are all replies on the same post.

macintroll wrote:

Amelli wrote: I know. Its like they have all suddenly discovered the power of flight and nose dived off a cliff while the modders stare at the dust accumulating on their donation buttons. Sad really.

weijiesen wrote: They won't donate, nor get premium nexus membership, but they'll pay for mods on steam.

Mods should be free by it's nature. The more Dark0ne stays neutral the sooner we will lose this fight. Edited April 25, 2015 by gastovski

[Warrior84]

In response to post #24640209. #24640274, #24640649, #24640694, #24640819, #24641869, #24641924 are all replies on the same post.

Roguespear wrote:

Amelli wrote: I bet you won't even get your money back to your bank either. It will sit in your steam wallet.

Warrior84 wrote: This is true, sadly. Your "money"/credits is tied to steam wallet, you cannot send it to your bank account.

Iceciro wrote: You would be correct; all the refund monies just goes right to your Steam Wallet.

Once Valve has your money, they have your money forever.

Amelli wrote: And if I read right, steam have already washed their hands of any responsibility concerning whether or not a mod is fit for release. Therefore the only warranty you have is from the mod author. And the small window in which you can request a refund if your not happy.
Of course there will be many that will blindly subscribe without thinking about those aspects, checking reviews etc. There is no real protection for the buyers other then their own common sense and others warning them.

WinsomeMinotaur wrote: This is why a Curated space makes sense, where mods that have been vetted and deemed worthy are the ones that have a price tag. That said, I assume you pay a dollar for a mod, and it's buggy, when the author releases bug fixes you are going to get the new version for free, the same way most software works.

Amelli wrote: However if you unsubscribe do you have to re pay to re sub?

No I do not think you need to, since you already own it. Just re-sub.

[Deleted3507349User]

Here's the thing; the results from all this will shape the industry as a whole from now on. I feel it's important to make a complete stand on the matter. I don't blame a modder for putting his mod behind that paywall (who wouldn't want some extra cash?), I just think it's ultimately going to prove to be destructive to gaming and modding as a whole. Therefore, I feel my stance must be firm and complete. I cannot support a modder who I feel is contributing to the eventual destruction of modding. It's neither a statement on the quality of the mods in question nor a personal criticism of the authors of those mods, it's my way of stating "I do NOT want this to happen this way!". As a mod user and mod author who is %100 behind the model used by the Nexus, the only valid way to make that statement is to neither use nor endorse any mods by authors who choose to put a mod behind Steam's paywall.

 

As a mod user, I'm saddened that this means I cannot allow myself to enjoy many truly excellent mods. Ultimately, however, I need to point out that there is no such thing as a truly 'essential' mod; just as there is no such thing as a truly 'essential' game. If things devolve to such a state that I deem it necessary, I'll do other things with me free time instead of playing and modding games. I *do* have other interests, as I'm sure most of you do as well.

 

I personally will continue to make a stand for what I think is right, as respectfully and politely as I can manage. I salute Dark0ne for continually striving to take the high ground and stand for what is right both from a legal viewpoint and an ethical one.

[gastovski]

In response to post #24641674.

jbvertexx wrote:

Everything you said is completely unnecessary. This thing shouldn't even exist at the first place.

[Vulkin96]

In response to post #24641229. #24641539, #24641734 are all replies on the same post.

Vulkin96 wrote:

MangoMonkey wrote: That power largely resides with the consumer, and the modder. If you don't buy the mods - and I doubt many will - then the business model doesn't work and it doesn't stick.

There's also the counter-argument that paid modding might actually increase the availability of free mods. If a prospective mod author wishes to persuade people to buy his content, that means the content has to be of a certain quality. Learning how to make mods of that quality mandates experience and learning, both of which can be gained most readily with active and supported communites like the Nexus. If anything, if modding begins to require a certain amount of "professionalism", it might actually spur the community on to increase the quality of the free mods to help get them to that level.

I'm not saying it will for certain, but it's something to think about.

WightMage wrote: Surprisingly, over the past 48 hours, more modders have come out clarifying they will remain free rather than switch to a payment system.

At the same time, modders are reporting receiving more donations than before.

There will always be people who will buy mods, DotA items were bought, Cs-go items were bought and so on, why wouldnt people pay for mods.
Yes those mods will require to be of a certain quality and that may lead to new authors learning and getting known by creating free mods, but in the end that will just be a starting point, when the author reaches certain point of skill he will place his now known and better work on sale.
Here on nexus there are many really great mods, that required much time and lots of skill and experience to be made, and they were free (and lots of them will be, so i thank the authors for that) but now with paid modding option people will rather invest their skill and time somewhere where they can profit.

For example if i am a starting modder, throughout my learning path i can create mods and put them here for free, people could like my mods, use them free of charge and then at point where i think that my skill is good enough that i can profit from it i would go and create paid mods, or versions of my old mods that now cost money, making that a loss for the people that dont want to pay for mods, as they didnt have to till now, because my mods would have to be free as there was no option for me to charge them.