Steam Service Providers, and some how needing to clarify the Nexus stance again

[Reaper0021]

In response to post #24652689. #24652809, #24653034, #24653509, #24653644, #24653689, #24653834, #24654009, #24654164 are all replies on the same post.

modskyrimtopieces wrote:

Reaper0021 wrote: Seriously? Ad revenues make money for Nexus as do donations and memberships and.....oh why bother your just another damn Conspiracy Theorist with his mind made-up. Go somewhere else then and good luck.

WhiskyTime wrote: You forgot to differ the members that are acutally part of the community, and members like me, who write their 2nd post ever on Nexus although registered since 2008. I guess people like me just don´t give a ... .

Whatever the Nexus people do with the money they earn - in my oppinion, the site´s running good and after all, we can be happy that there´s things like this community. Getting mods for a game was not that comfortable some time ago.

Anyway, what i wanted to say is - i don´t need "to-the-point" answers and there´s surely a good amount of people who think the same - as long as everything´s running well there´s no problem.
For the record - the only thing i was asked for is to turn off my Adblocker - nobody told me this site would not run without a £1.29 "donation".

Brasscatcher wrote: Wooow.

What flavor is your Kool-Aid, man? You're supposed to dilute that stuff with water, y'know?

Psijonica wrote: Reaper you are just becoming a troll! People are allowed to have different opinions. There is no need to start with the insults. I thought you said you were an adult? ACT LIKE ONE PLEASE!

Obviously modskyrimtopieces I support everything you have stated here today.Keep fighting.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Thing is, the guys behind the Nexus sound as bad as Steam. They have turned modding into a business for them, but not the modders. I understand the need to accumulate funds for running a large website, but the numbers don't add up to me.

Is this site actually registered as a business? Because it seems clear now that people behind this site are actually profiting and this steam drama lately has exposed this.

hellosanta wrote: As far as I know, that's how much money it costed to run this site, not that they make that much out of this site. If you have read previous posts and all, you'd know that Nexus was in serious financial problem and Dark0ne has to put his own money to make the site running smoothly. And the ad we see on the site? That wasn't there when I first joined the community. Modding community got bigger, or at least there has been huge influx of people who want to mod their games in recent years, so Nexus has to upgrade its server and database. That costs a lot of money. Well, you can still come up with all sorts of conspiracy based on distrust for everything everyone says in Nexus. But, I understand Dark0ne taking small portion of cut from paid mods if the modders deem Nexus to be service provider and want to express thanks. Cause, you know, while admitting that modders should be compensated for their works and efforts while denying the time, work and money put into providing space where people can share mods and information for free is just dirty double standard.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Still, offering someone around £20,000 for a simple job seems a bit odd to me if the site was in "financial difficulty".

Oh and to even offer a salary like that, this website would have to be registered as a business and pay tax accordingly.

This isn't a conspiracy theory at all, I'm just looking at this site in a logical, analytical and lawful way.

WhiskyTime wrote: I don´t even know why you insist on an answer. What does actually change for you, as a customer, if this site is registered as a buisness (and I guess it is, since the owner of Nexus is listed as "Black Tree Gaming Ltd.). As long as this site provides Mods for free, i just don´t see a problem - and I don´t think that will change.

Seriously don't call me a "Troll" for stating the obvious. I'm sorry your mad and upset about the modding situation and your thoughts of Dark0ne being on the take, but no need to bark at me. YOU are the one all over the damned forums accusing Dark0ne of being in some sort of cahoots with Valve. You need to relax. Your the one that has to tell us all about your house and kids and partner and how responsible you are AS IF that will make your senseless babble any more sensible. Edited April 25, 2015 by Reaper0021

[MoonSpot]

Thank you for this post. It's helped inform some of the concerns I have and have been discussing with others. Too soon indeed, but being worried about what could be a poison pill is difficult not to do.

 

Not that I've any right as I've not yet supported anyone (Life's a particular shade of shitty atm) but it is on the to do list.

 

Thanks for the source links, they're helping.

[Psijonica]

In response to post #24650844. #24651244, #24651614, #24652419, #24653429, #24653759, #24653984 are all replies on the same post.

Godlybosshog wrote:

gastovski wrote: Dark0ne should have said that "I'm against paid mods altogether regardless of who gets money. But he is staying neutral about this and this is most disturbing news. I couldn't believe my eyes after reading the last post.

Godlybosshog wrote: If he would of done that, he would of had to reject the 5% offer valve made. But as I stated before, we could of came to another ends. There are plenty of other viable options. Watch Ted Talks The Art of Asking with Amanda Palmer. This site and creators could of lived off donations if it was executed properly with Bethesda. But let bygones be bygones. I just hope it can be resolved in the future, which is why we are all here I presume.

gastovski wrote: It won't be i'm afraid. When money involves it will flow a river without hitting any barriers. I know he is getting %5 from Valve so he is neutral at this but it's totally wrong.

Psijonica wrote: You guys explained your selves much better than I did and somehow avoided all the trolls and insults. i agree with everything that has been posted here... I will just add that there is a reason why Dark0ne doesn't take a position yet and that is because he doesn't have to. He makes money off of the Valve Pay-for-Mods system and if it goes away he can then say, "see I fought for you guys." But if you read what he has been posting it is very clear that he is ok with Pay-for-Mods. He makes a lot of money from this website and he deserves it. It is a good website and he offers a good service, the best really but he lied and he got caught with his pants down.

SOPA is next now... So quickly has this turned against us, so quickly has this generation accepted Pay-for-Mods... the consequences from this terrible mistake are going to reverberate fro a long, long time.

gastovski wrote: I've read your post too and i agree completely, Psijonica. This isn't about only Skyrim modding but people won't realize it. These times are dark and getting darker day by day for us PC gamers.

nekollx wrote: I can see some of your points but if the site promoting the mods (ie Valve) is involved then they have every right to a cut, they are building exposure, is 35% to much, probably but they deserve a cut, as for Bethsoft, well LEGALLY you are making money off their IP, by not giving them a cut your basically breaking IP law and they can sue your ass and take 100% plus your soul, so a cut to Bethsoft is perfectly logical if it prevents mod authors FROM GOING TO JAIL. That said mod authors deserve more then 25% since they are doing the lions share of the work, and larger mods often have teams i mean honestly lets say Falscarr is sold for $4, that means the modder, voice actors, and any one else in the team that expects a cut gets a portion of $1

HANK YOU. That means so much to me. it was very hard not to fall into the TROLL TRAP that Dark0ne started with me. They love to do that here so that they can have a reason to ban you. Then all the kids join in and suddenly the moderators turn the other way because I am choose to take a different position and stand up for my beliefs.

yes you are right, the consequences from this are going to be terrible. The children and most adults don't understand European law or Copy Right LAw. When people complained about STEAM in the UK they turned around and banned all of their accounts. It is a power grab plain and simple.

There are no refunds from STEAM. You only get credit,you can purchase the game and mods and they can ban you at any time and you loose everything.

All the other gaming companies wiill follow this setup. If people like us just shut up like all the trolls want us to then we loose. We MUST KEEP YELLING our displeasure all the while keeping in mind that although our opposition will will try to bait us in a flame war we must keep our heads. Since they don't have a real good argument their only strategy id to try and bait us into a flame war.

[Penfold187]

Looks like someone has DMCA'd Isoku's Wet and Cold....

[2much4l1]

Thank you Dark0ne... For everything.

[Saerileth]

In response to post #24645544. #24646089, #24649659, #24649709, #24651129, #24651814, #24653749 are all replies on the same post.

jmeks23 wrote:

PharCry wrote: "HOWEVER, I don't think that means compensation is deserved. Not to say you shouldn't be able to donate to these creators and what not, but I just don't feel like I should be forced to pay for any type of mod."

So they can't ask for money, for something they created, put their own hard work into? They absolutely must allow everyone to have it for free if they have shared it with the community? For something they've poured tens, hundreds or more hours into? Testing with other users, gathering feedback and data, troubleshooting, etc? All the while doing their day job and or whatever else they may have to contend with in regards to life?

"The thing about mods is you can have up to 200+ running at a time, and most people here probably play with somewhere between 25-100. Imagine even paying $.99 for 100 mods? And most mods I'm seeing on the workshop are charging more than $.99. Why would I ever do that?"

They're not making it a requirement to charge money for mods! Too many people are used to the idea of just having mods for free. This introduces a way that content creators can actually make a little money for what they are doing (hell maybe consider downloading Blender and NifSkope and the Creation Kit, learning how they work and making your own mods? WOW WHAT A CONCEPT). Why is this a bad thing?

I'm not saying it again after this: IMO Valve needs to reconsider how much they are taking as a cut from mod makers, but the mod makers do deserve some compensation IF THEY DEEM IT NECESSARY. We can pay for it if we like it (there is a 24 hour policy, probably should be 48 but again, something that needs dealt with on Valve's end, and something WE as a community can respond to). Stop crying about this, give input as it evolves, and stop acting like this only benefits Valve and Nexus!

locomotive1236 wrote: Our of curiosity, do some of the tools used to make mods, such as blender, nifskope, photoshop, have a disclaimer saying that not to be used for commercial products? If you do you have to buy a licensed one for a prolonged period? I know most don't really care if you use it for personal stuff, but once it's out in the market they have rights to the products too?

sunshinenbrick wrote: Very important point made above!

Saerileth wrote: It's interesting how most of these detailed explanations of "what modding is all about" come from people who have not uploaded a single mod of their own. How can you judge the "right" reasons to mod, and who should (or shouldn't) be modding in the first place? I'm a mod author myself, and I still don't presume to know the motivations of all the others. I can only speak for myself.

locomotive1236 wrote: @Saerileth, I speak for no other as well. I do not have the skill or want to mod SKyrim because there's already so many mods out there available that do the same thing that I desired. And you're fairly limiting modding to only Skyrim and not looking at the big picture. There are other games with mods as well and this is one of those platform that supports modding community. I've made some popular and some not so-popular mods/addons in the past for some games I don't care to mention. I have also create stuff for myself that share to my friends.

I feel that your attack on those that haven't put up a mod and have no say is unwarranted. Most that do not have a mod participated in one way or another with the creation or perfection of some mods, whether by inputs or feedbacks. To say they have no right to to say what modding is about for themselves is a little shortsighted, no?

If I have mistaken your point then I apologize, but modding community is not just about the authors who has hosted at least 1 mod. This is not to be taken as the authors don't deserve any praise, as they should definitely be. All I'm saying is the "beta testing" helps the modding community more than anything.

Tanniss wrote: actually you are correct in most instances they have two versions of a product one for personal use (which is usually free) to wit you arent allowed to use those for commercial gain and then they have the professional produce (which you have to buy to use ) which even then still only has a limited commercial availability usage of
Not to mention the use of copyrighted material which is in alot of mods that is a no no and will end up getting dmac'd out the ass

My issue with this is simple dark one calls it cutting his nose off to spite his face which if he was all for paid modding would make sense but your stand point is such that you fear that free modding and the COMMUNITIES that support such endeavors will go the way of the do do. That you allow yourself to be construed as a supporter of said paid practices when whether you choose to admit to yourself or not you are a champion for freed modding why would you send such a mixed signal because whether you believe it or not you are by no means being neutral being neutral means you have no opinion one way or the other...
when in fact you are taking money from valve's cut (which if you were to send to the top modders on here as a donation to help keep them modding for free would be giving only one clear signal) while also saying you fear that this will cause free modding to go away seems to be giving out confused and mixed signals...
I do not have any doubts that you take valves money thinking to do good with it but we all know valve is only doing this to take your legs and your integrity from you when they decide to come out with harsher rules for the modders to upload to them if you make waves they will just use the "You were not opposed to this course of action before as you gladly accepted our money stance" i love the nexus and in many many forums today i have posted that the alternative to this valve fiasco is to come here that being said being neutral means not doing anything to promote a sense of side taking and sorry taking money from valve while stating that you are afraid the way this will go could make our home for everything modding go away is taking both sides

I did not attack anyone! I merely made an observation. You cannot deny that the most resounding and outspoken response to this topic comes from the users, and not the mod authors of this community. And I'm having a hard time believing that not at least part of the outrage come right down to "I don't want to have to pay for all these lovely mods that I'm used to have for free". And I can totally understand that sentiment! Knowing that some of my favourite mods will no longer be freely available to me makes me sad, because lets face it no one enjoys giving away money. I'm just getting very tired of seeing people talk up this grand cause of how they don't support paid mods out of principle, when it is usually simply that they do not want to pay for them. Call things by what they are.

No one has the right to define what "modding is all about", that is something each member of the community has to decide for him/herself (much as no one can claim to objectively define what is "art" and what is not, to give you a better example of what I mean). You can't set down "right" or "wrong" reasons for sharing mods, that would be looking a gift horse into the mouth. Every author has their own reasons for doing what they do. There are some things that the community as a whole has a say in - this is not one of them.

[TBoneTones]

I can see both sides of the argument. However, whilst it could be argued some of the fantastic mods should receive a payment, I cannot but help feel a trickle will result in the dam bursting; PC gamers are now in the greedy sights of console companies and game developer teams making no money from some of the fantastic PC mods. They wish all that to change, and like many bad things, it starts off in very small steps, insidious, so as not to make big alarming waves and draw people's attention to what is really happening if it were all done in a big push.

 

Personally, I had misgivings when - as a very mature newcomer to gaming - , I bought my first game, skyrim, and was puzzled why a game I bought in a game shop, developed by a software company bethesda, necessitated internet connecting to this other 'Steam' company to facilitate validity and what not. I could see what was going to happen, sooner or later.

 

The current furore has, of course, been anticipated by Steam or Valve et al, and is why it will be phased in in small steps, with reassuring messages each step. Only we are not that stupid, are we? :O)

 

Consequently, while I can fully understand Dark One's position re. revenue, I am reassured he is fully aware of the importance of both free modding and some mod authors entitlement to some revenue for their efforts and skills. It is the balance, that will be the critical factor, methinks.

[bigdeano89]

In response to post #24652689. #24652809, #24653034, #24653509, #24653644, #24653689, #24653834, #24654009, #24654164, #24654199 are all replies on the same post.

modskyrimtopieces wrote:

Reaper0021 wrote: Seriously? Ad revenues make money for Nexus as do donations and memberships and.....oh why bother your just another damn Conspiracy Theorist with his mind made-up. Go somewhere else then and good luck.

WhiskyTime wrote: You forgot to differ the members that are acutally part of the community, and members like me, who write their 2nd post ever on Nexus although registered since 2008. I guess people like me just don´t give a ... .

Whatever the Nexus people do with the money they earn - in my oppinion, the site´s running good and after all, we can be happy that there´s things like this community. Getting mods for a game was not that comfortable some time ago.

Anyway, what i wanted to say is - i don´t need "to-the-point" answers and there´s surely a good amount of people who think the same - as long as everything´s running well there´s no problem.
For the record - the only thing i was asked for is to turn off my Adblocker - nobody told me this site would not run without a £1.29 "donation".

Brasscatcher wrote: Wooow.

What flavor is your Kool-Aid, man? You're supposed to dilute that stuff with water, y'know?

Psijonica wrote: Reaper you are just becoming a troll! People are allowed to have different opinions. There is no need to start with the insults. I thought you said you were an adult? ACT LIKE ONE PLEASE!

Obviously modskyrimtopieces I support everything you have stated here today.Keep fighting.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Thing is, the guys behind the Nexus sound as bad as Steam. They have turned modding into a business for them, but not the modders. I understand the need to accumulate funds for running a large website, but the numbers don't add up to me.

Is this site actually registered as a business? Because it seems clear now that people behind this site are actually profiting and this steam drama lately has exposed this.

hellosanta wrote: As far as I know, that's how much money it costed to run this site, not that they make that much out of this site. If you have read previous posts and all, you'd know that Nexus was in serious financial problem and Dark0ne has to put his own money to make the site running smoothly. And the ad we see on the site? That wasn't there when I first joined the community. Modding community got bigger, or at least there has been huge influx of people who want to mod their games in recent years, so Nexus has to upgrade its server and database. That costs a lot of money. Well, you can still come up with all sorts of conspiracy based on distrust for everything everyone says in Nexus. But, I understand Dark0ne taking small portion of cut from paid mods if the modders deem Nexus to be service provider and want to express thanks. Cause, you know, while admitting that modders should be compensated for their works and efforts while denying the time, work and money put into providing space where people can share mods and information for free is just dirty double standard.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Still, offering someone around £20,000 for a simple job seems a bit odd to me if the site was in "financial difficulty".

Oh and to even offer a salary like that, this website would have to be registered as a business and pay tax accordingly.

This isn't a conspiracy theory at all, I'm just looking at this site in a logical, analytical and lawful way.

WhiskyTime wrote: I don´t even know why you insist on an answer. What does actually change for you, as a customer, if this site is registered as a buisness (and I guess it is, since the owner of Nexus is listed as "Black Tree Gaming Ltd.). As long as this site provides Mods for free, i just don´t see a problem - and I don´t think that will change.

Reaper0021 wrote: Seriously don't call me a "Troll" for stating the obvious. I'm sorry your mad and upset about the modding situation and your thoughts of Dark0ne being on the take, but no need to bark at me. YOU are the one all over the damned forums accusing Dark0ne of being in some sort of cahoots with Valve. You need to relax. Your the one that has to tell us all about your house and kids and partner and how responsible you are AS IF that will make your senseless babble any more sensible.

You do realize, not only how many mods are on Skyrim nexus, but on the ENTIRE Nexus database, right? Servers arent cheap, especially ones that need this much space allocated. Do some research before you claim there is something "fishy". The Nexus in its entirety literally could not run without ad revenue and memberships. Dont forget you are getting FREE access to literally hundreds of thousands of mods over a vast multitude of games.

[hellosanta]

In response to post #24652689. #24652809, #24653034, #24653509, #24653644, #24653689, #24653834, #24654009, #24654164, #24654199, #24654404 are all replies on the same post.

modskyrimtopieces wrote:

Reaper0021 wrote: Seriously? Ad revenues make money for Nexus as do donations and memberships and.....oh why bother your just another damn Conspiracy Theorist with his mind made-up. Go somewhere else then and good luck.

WhiskyTime wrote: You forgot to differ the members that are acutally part of the community, and members like me, who write their 2nd post ever on Nexus although registered since 2008. I guess people like me just don´t give a ... .

Whatever the Nexus people do with the money they earn - in my oppinion, the site´s running good and after all, we can be happy that there´s things like this community. Getting mods for a game was not that comfortable some time ago.

Anyway, what i wanted to say is - i don´t need "to-the-point" answers and there´s surely a good amount of people who think the same - as long as everything´s running well there´s no problem.
For the record - the only thing i was asked for is to turn off my Adblocker - nobody told me this site would not run without a £1.29 "donation".

Brasscatcher wrote: Wooow.

What flavor is your Kool-Aid, man? You're supposed to dilute that stuff with water, y'know?

Psijonica wrote: Reaper you are just becoming a troll! People are allowed to have different opinions. There is no need to start with the insults. I thought you said you were an adult? ACT LIKE ONE PLEASE!

Obviously modskyrimtopieces I support everything you have stated here today.Keep fighting.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Thing is, the guys behind the Nexus sound as bad as Steam. They have turned modding into a business for them, but not the modders. I understand the need to accumulate funds for running a large website, but the numbers don't add up to me.

Is this site actually registered as a business? Because it seems clear now that people behind this site are actually profiting and this steam drama lately has exposed this.

hellosanta wrote: As far as I know, that's how much money it costed to run this site, not that they make that much out of this site. If you have read previous posts and all, you'd know that Nexus was in serious financial problem and Dark0ne has to put his own money to make the site running smoothly. And the ad we see on the site? That wasn't there when I first joined the community. Modding community got bigger, or at least there has been huge influx of people who want to mod their games in recent years, so Nexus has to upgrade its server and database. That costs a lot of money. Well, you can still come up with all sorts of conspiracy based on distrust for everything everyone says in Nexus. But, I understand Dark0ne taking small portion of cut from paid mods if the modders deem Nexus to be service provider and want to express thanks. Cause, you know, while admitting that modders should be compensated for their works and efforts while denying the time, work and money put into providing space where people can share mods and information for free is just dirty double standard.

modskyrimtopieces wrote: Still, offering someone around £20,000 for a simple job seems a bit odd to me if the site was in "financial difficulty".

Oh and to even offer a salary like that, this website would have to be registered as a business and pay tax accordingly.

This isn't a conspiracy theory at all, I'm just looking at this site in a logical, analytical and lawful way.

WhiskyTime wrote: I don´t even know why you insist on an answer. What does actually change for you, as a customer, if this site is registered as a buisness (and I guess it is, since the owner of Nexus is listed as "Black Tree Gaming Ltd.). As long as this site provides Mods for free, i just don´t see a problem - and I don´t think that will change.

Reaper0021 wrote: Seriously don't call me a "Troll" for stating the obvious. I'm sorry your mad and upset about the modding situation and your thoughts of Dark0ne being on the take, but no need to bark at me. YOU are the one all over the damned forums accusing Dark0ne of being in some sort of cahoots with Valve. You need to relax. Your the one that has to tell us all about your house and kids and partner and how responsible you are AS IF that will make your senseless babble any more sensible.

bigdeano89 wrote: You do realize, not only how many mods are on Skyrim nexus, but on the ENTIRE Nexus database, right? Servers arent cheap, especially ones that need this much space allocated. Do some research before you claim there is something "fishy". The Nexus in its entirety literally could not run without ad revenue and memberships. Dont forget you are getting FREE access to literally hundreds of thousands of mods over a vast multitude of games.

I don't know whether Nexus registered as business or not, but managing server for massive website and all is legitimate IT job. It looks easy if and only if there is no problem. And £20,000? That's average salary of college graduate in Canada. So, yeah, I don't think hiring someone at £20,000 for IT job sounds anyway fishy, especially, considering that IT jobs usually have higher than average salary. It's actually pretty disturbing of you to accuse some jobs are very simple. Looks simple to YOU, innit? Well, don't jump into conclusion purely based on how it appears to be.

[phantompally76]

In response to post #24654264.

Penfold187 wrote:

Which means no one is legally getting the latest version, ever, except for the 517 users who bought it on Steam.