Steam and Bethesda remove paid modding from Skyrim Workshop

[tem1980]

In response to post #24732344. #24732604, #24732704, #24732709, #24732774, #24732869, #24732879, #24733044, #24733464, #24733739, #24733824, #24733844, #24734224, #24734679, #24734879, #24734924, #24735019, #24735179, #24735629, #24736304, #24736494, #24736934, #24737124, #24737349 are all replies on the same post.

CelticPaladin wrote:

calfurius wrote: I know quite a few modders became disgusted with the way some members of the modding community treated them. I'm mostly concerned if Chesko is coming back or not, he didn't deserve anywhere near the level of hate that he got.

phantompally76 wrote: I hope that's not the case.

I do, however, hope that in future they think twice about arrogantly condescending mod users looking for assistance with their mods in comments sections, like they have in the past. I'd stopped using some of their mods before this crap ever started because of that.

Riprock wrote: Hopefully time will make him realize that words on the internet are just words. We put way too much stock in typed messages.

CelticPaladin wrote: The number of vitriol and death threats were insane. I couldn't blame them for leaving this community behind. It'd be depressing, but there you go.

meredithmiles wrote: What I don't understand is why Arthmoor, Chesko and Isoku don't already have job offers in hand. Seriously, they are all three hardworking, dedicated and skilled. If I ran a game company I'd have snatched them up ages ago.

This is a great time to donate to them, I think.

jfisha wrote: Each team only lost a handful of endorsements. Yes, there was some angry vitriol, but most people respectfully disagreed with what they did. No more, no less.

BarnabasCollins wrote: I don't even see why people were targeting the modders anyway. For me this was never even about the modders, but the future of modding itself. The modders are innocent.

oblivion104 wrote: I stayed away from the melodrama and only sign the petition,but what happened to chesko??

Also, what happened to the paid mods? Did they take it down?

phantompally76 wrote: heh, apt user name there.

Wait, there are mods for Skyrim??????

Noortje wrote: They would never have updated skyui if it wasn't for the pay offer. I doubt they will finish skyui 5.0 and release it now, but it's not like it was ever going to be free in the first place.

Saije wrote: f*#@ that... We weren't black hearted. They were when they gave us a big green middle finger.

SNSDLOVER wrote: Honestly if they love modding and love sharing their mods to us, I doubt theyll leave. Modding could be their hobby or passion so Im certain this wont make them go away.

redrat07 wrote: there were d-threats to people who left to go to the paid system ?

phantompally76 wrote: @redrat, not in the quantities that people here want you to believe.

There was certainly some of it.....there always is. But the vast majority of butthurt mod authors and white knights are including irate mod users who posted "uninstalled and unendorsed, shame on you" along with any amount of criticism in that category. And THOSE comments grossly outnumbered any sort of threats, and were perfectly fair and justified.

BluemaxDR wrote: Oh, they won't stop developing mods. Just stop posting.

Arendella wrote: Chesko I don't have a problem with.

Isoku and SkyUi? definitely will never use their mods again *Will just use old version of SkyUi*. Was just a big slap in the face when he was all giddy about putting his mods up on Steam Workshop just pissing everyone off even more.

jfisha wrote: Thumbs up, Phantompally.

There are some mod authors that are going pull an Anita Sarkeesian and chastise our entire community because of a very small amount of very angry comments, but if you go back and look at comments, you'll notice most of them are people just saying they're disappointed and unendorsing.

Azulyn wrote: jfisha + phantompally76
Amen.
Most of the comments I saw were reasonable criticisms and/or remarks of disappointment, not frothing rage and threats of death and venngeeeaanncceee as all these white knights would have you believe.

tem1980 wrote: Unfortunately, that's the nature of the internet. 90% outrage and ass-holism, 5% controlled nonsense, 5% rational measured thought.

Its actually a pretty decent mirror of the real population, except real people only say the s#*! they do on the internet in RL when they dont think they can be identified or held accountable. Or you know, what the internet allows.

Everyone should try and tune out all the rage and insane s#*!.

jfisha wrote: I'll actually disagree with that, tem. I just think the very angry among us happen to also be the most inclined to write a comment.

WarfighterShaun wrote: May I ask what Isoku did? I have heard of Arthmoor kind of taking the piss out of some people.

sovs wrote: Chesko I don't have a problem with.

Isoku and SkyUi? definitely will never use their mods again *Will just use old version of SkyUi*. Was just a big slap in the face when he was all giddy about putting his mods up on Steam Workshop just pissing everyone off even more.

Same here, Midas Magic was by far one of the most popular mods in Oblivion, i have a hard time believing that he only received enough donations to barely cover fraps as he said.

rickerhk wrote: They made a quite normal assumption that they could get some compensation from their hours and hours of hard work. But the self-entitled toxic Skyrim 'Community' would have nothing of it.

@ jfisha

I just meant the quality of the expression of the anger, not that the 90% were the only ones angry.

[Vhaltyrr]

Can we remove the obvious joke mods now? >_> I miss actual mods and it hasn't even been that long. Edited April 28, 2015 by Vhaltyrr

[haydon111]

In response to post #24736589. #24736754, #24737024, #24737159, #24737319, #24737354 are all replies on the same post.

Vesuvius1745 wrote:

Brasscatcher wrote: Agreed. I posted somewhere back in one of the other topics that I disagree with forcing mods behind a paywall. User funding for this hobby should always be voluntary. BUT. Bethesda (under Zenimax pressure, I'm sure) has released games in terrible condition for a AAA title. If anyone should be profit-sharing with crews like SKSE, SkyUI, Unofficial Patches, it should be Bethesda. Sure is nice having a devoted and skilled-enough fanbase to make your game run for you.

I decided with Skyrim to not preorder the next Bethesda game for this very reason. There's no point, if the friggin thing isn't going to work out of the box.

WightMage wrote: You mean aside from the fact that, in a year or two, they'll be selling the "Legendary Gold Assault Armageddon Omega Supreme Edition" with over $200 worth of DLC clothing, weapon, and texture packs in a bundle for 80% off?

Brasscatcher wrote: Oh Wight. You so crazy!

...Except it could happen. :D

protttt wrote: Totally agreed. In fact the reason why people are still playing Skyrim today is because of the mods, and the mods alone. Trust me I tried playing Skyrim without mods and I couldn't stand 15 minutes! It might be the best game in 2011 but just a no-more-than-s#*! in 2015 comparing to other RPG games in NO MODs type (Dragon Age Inquisitions is a good example).

phantompally76 wrote: @Vesuvius1745, have you forgotten Skyrim was Game of the Year on 3 platforms without a single mod?

Don't exaggerate. Skyrim plays just fine without mods, and still has a huge following on consoles.

Mods are great. But they're not mandatory.

+1
You defo need mods to have Skyrim playable even if you want to play vanilla.

Although who would want to play the lazy mess that is vanilla (even if it worked) which was basically a lazy console port at best if it wasn't for mods?

I and many others would never buy a beth game if it wasn't for great mod support.They need modders and mod users alot more then we need them imo.

phantompally76

You so silly,it got a following on consoles because console players don't know any better and I'm no expert but they got a stable version of the vanilla game.
For any master race gamer mods are mandatory for a Beth game. Edited April 28, 2015 by haydon111

[Zaflart]

Dark0ne, Again has shown grace and decorum. I thank you. I'm old and jaded, a pessimistic realist, if you will. His candor has softened this old grizzled soul. Again, thank you.

 

I'm make mods for myself, (my work isn't polished enough and I don't have the time, the community deserves, for support), I'm just an old user. However, I am extremely grateful to this community. Thank you.

 

That being said...

 

To those who threw their fellow community members under-the-bus, (be they modders, or users), because of differing opinions, should reflect upon the last few days and learn from this experience. The rage and vitriol, (yes I know that word has been overused, these last few days, but it fits so well), which had spewed forth, was totally uncalled for. Please use this as an opportunity for growth.

 

However, I am still not convinced the intent of Bethesda and Valve was totally unselfish. This "roll-out" was among the worst implementations, of an ill-conceived concept, I have ever seen, in over twenty-five years of being part of modding communities.

 

The complete lack of accountability, on the part of Valve and Bethesda, only proves these companies only care, as little as needed, to make a profit. They made the inaugural hand-picked group of modders sign a NDA... Then gave, at least one of them, (Chesko), terrible legal advice. I understand, neither Valve's, nor Bethesda's legal teams are beholding to anyone, except Valve and Bethesda, but in the spirit of community, they should have done a much better job.

 

I hope this experience was a wake-up call, for Valve and Bethesda. They need to understand customers are more than mere credit card numbers. They also need to learn they can't take a lion's share of the profit and zero responsibility.

 

Another hope is; That users, whom can afford to, will now donate to their favorite mod makers.

 

 

Edit: typo

Edited April 28, 2015 by Zaflart

[Deleted3507349User]

There was plenty of absolutely outrageous behavior from both mod authors and mod users. I would like to point out though, that the majority of people on both sides managed to keep some control and maintained varying degrees of reasonableness. I base this statement on the fact that I've more-or-less been glued to this since it all went down (gawd, I need a real life).

 

It will take a while for this to truly settle down, and even longer for trust to be restored between us all. The truth is; it never again will be like it was in the modding community. BUT, and let's all keep this in mind, we as a community have a golden opportunity to make things better and stronger than they were before this.

 

I for one would like to see the Nexus disable the donation function, at least temporarily to let things cool down. Once we've regained a significant portion of our equanimity, then we can begin a dialogue again on the subject, taking into account lessons learned from all this.

[Anduniel]

In response to post #24736644.

UberSmaug wrote:

I quite agree with your "craft fair" analogy. Well said, all :)

I have no problem at all with modders wishing to make a little money on their art. People don't HAVE to buy it, it's still totally your choice. What I definitely DON'T like is that the modder would only get 25% (or less) of the price. The modder who does the work should get AT LEAST 50%, maybe 60%. But distribution doesn't work like that, unless the artist/modder does it all themself.

There are a great many mods I think are amazing and which I would have paid a few bucks for. And just to be clear I am NOT against free modding in any way. If not for that I would never have become a modder, OR gotten into voice acting. May free modding live on! Edited April 28, 2015 by Anduniel

[Brasscatcher]

In response to post #24732584. #24734194, #24736024, #24736399, #24736849 are all replies on the same post.

WightMage wrote:

Brasscatcher wrote: High five, Wight. It was a pleasure to make your acquaintance. I include popcorn and phantom in this list too. I'll be chucking out a few friend requests today.

Asside from all the namecalling asshats, you people debate WELL. Even those of you making a case for the pay2mod marketplace. Salute.

I guess I have to stick around and be social now...it's kind of hard to go back into the cave after all this! Besides, with my confidence restored, I have mods to get back to work on!

ceilidhachaos wrote: Here, here! :)

jfisha wrote: I'll have to wait until next payday. I dropped a little too much in donations over the past few days. Wife's not happy

WightMage wrote: @Brass Damn right you should, lemme know if you ever need a voice actor or a script writer for a quest. ;)

And @jfisha, LOL, tell her you can write them off on your taxes or something. :P

@Wight I just may do that, sir. I'm terrified of papyrus right now. I haven't programmed anything more complicated than a simple website before! But I see all these gorgeous house mods, with hidden stuff, and NPCs, and you open a door in the basement and get sucked off on a 12+ hour questline and...damn, how could you not want to try doing that?! It's like having a chance to make your own version of the Goonies!

Maybe in the aftermath of this, we'll see some other crews form from people debating and sharing ideas in these threads. What can I say, I'm an optimist. If I can get past the creation kit and the various other tools the game offers, I'll definitely give you a holler! :)

[JJgoodtimes]

I'd like to say we should all be a little more generous with the donations now after all that has happened. You never know how much you appreciate someone/something until you've lost it.

[Blademaster1215]

I'm going to be quick here. The only way for any kind of "premium" mod system would work would be an ad revenue system like youtube. From my understanding bitfly is used by a few modders even on the nexus to gain profit via ad revenue. Mods have been free from the beginning and they should cost the end user anything. That's my stance. For the modder to profit off mods is fine, but it can't be done by charging the user.

[Brasscatcher]

In response to post #24737464.

digitaltrucker wrote:

We cannot control the obstacles life places before us, only how we react to them. You debate well, sir. It was a pleasure meeting you here. Cheers!