Why the perk hate?

[DaemonGrin]

I am curious been watching Gopher's FO4 playthrough and something he said caused it. I keep reading or hearing via youtube, complaints about how the FO4 perk system makes character development useless and well I don't see it. Vanilla FO3 you could max out all skills, get 10 in all stats making any specific build moot by level 30. Vanilla FNV again you could do the same especially with the level increases except the 10 to all stats, unless i missed something. This is not about the efficiency of the perks just the perk leveling system. In FO4 I would say by level 45-50 I have the build I was initially working towards which is actually lesser skilled than any of my FO3 and FNV characters which had 100 in all skills by their maxed levels. If I recall to max all perks in FO4 you need to be like lvl 260? Is it just because it is a new system and people are used to the skill system from the many years they played 3 and NV? Again this is not about the perk efficiency just the perk leveling. I look forward to your opinions!

 

Thanks,

Geoff

[RS13]

Gopher has a long explanation of this: he dislikes it because multiple unique skills are lumped into one attribute. Perception, for instance, determines accuracy with pistols, shotguns, sniper rifles and fat mans (fat men?). Wildly different weapons there. Also, because only attributes matter, you can start the game god-like with weapons. Yes, you eventually became godlike in FO3 and FNV, but it's less bad when you've put 50+ hours into a game; it feels earned in that case.

 

The second problem is that the perks mostly just make you more powerful--more damage, more damage resistance, higher crit chance, and so on. There are a few change basic mechanics or add new ones (cannibalism and mysterious stranger come to mind). By and large the perks do what the skill system did.

[DaemonGrin]

It's still that same well to me anyway. In FO3 and FNV I could max out a single weapon skill really quick which not only affected vats accuracy but damage I think. Geez I never really looked into that back when I played. At least in FO4 you have to pick a perk to increase the damage. But if in FO3/FNV the skill doesn't affect dmg it still kinda balances out in that the dmg modifying perks are level restricted which also restrict weapon mods seeing that they are perk related. I mean really VATS in it's self is just a cheat XD. It has always been OP in FO3/FNV/FO4 and that's what perception affects acc in vats (excluding lockpicking and pickpocketing).

 

Every way I break it down in my head and on paper (lies I can't write ; ; it's called chicken scratch) it's pretty much equal. I mean yeah Big Guns, Small Guns and Energy Weapons their acc was partially affected by perception in previous games but mostly by their respective skills but if you break that down small guns affected all automatic and non automatic rifles and pistols vats acc and dmg (just did a quick check and weapon skill does indeed increase dmg for FNV anyway). So yeah it seems balanced to me.

[Boombro]

 

Yes, you eventually became godlike in FO3 and FNV, but it's less bad when you've put 50+ hours into a game; it feels earned in that case.

I can max all my weapons skills much faster than 50 hours in the older games, and earned? You basically do anything, from hacking, crafting etc to earn levels then add a lot of points into skills. I could max out one weapon skill before really fast. Are sure you not using a mod for a very long time?

 

To get every perk in FO4 and max everything. You need more than 30 levels for base stats only. That was the max level of the past games.

Edited May 17, 2016 by Boombro

[RS13]

Look, you asked for an *explanation*. I gave you one. You may disagree, but don't act like it's mysterious.

[TeamBacon]

I would take the Fallout 4 system over any previous Fallout game. It isn't even close in my opinion. It was actually fun developing my character in Fallout 4.

 

I personally think that the Fallout world could do with a lot less menu crawling. I guess that's why most people, my self included, really like Fallout 4 while a minority hate the game.

[RS13]

 

To get every perk in FO4 and max everything. You need more than 30 levels for base stats only. That was the max level of the past games.

 

 

1. You're comparing apples to oranges. Previous games didn't let you get every perk, so of course it takes longer to max your character in FO4. But if you took off the level cap, it would take you to 234 to get rank 1 in every perk in FNV.

2. That's *not the point*. What people don't like is walking out the vault as the terminator. The fact that you can start as the terminator and still spend the next 259 levels becoming even more OP doesn't make starting as the terminator any more appealing.

Edited May 17, 2016 by RS13

[DaemonGrin]

 

 

To get every perk in FO4 and max everything. You need more than 30 levels for base stats only. That was the max level of the past games.

 

 

1. You're comparing apples to oranges. Previous games didn't let you get every perk, so of course it takes longer to max your character in FO4. But if you took off the level cap, it would take you to 234 to get rank 1 in every perk in FNV.

2. That's *not the point*. What people don't like is walking out the vault as the terminator. The fact that you can start as the terminator and still spend the next 259 levels becoming even more OP doesn't make starting as the terminator any more appealing.

 

 

1. Agree FO4 scraps the perk and skill system for an overhauled skerk system.......^^; but still 234 (not every perk had tiers) balances out to the FO4 275 level ups.

2. For me it makes more sense (well if you are Nate which I always play the male) he was in the military not so much for the wife, apparently she is a psychotic lawyer who was secretly being trained by some mysterious organization. Nate finds a clue in the prologue if you interact with the pack of smokes behind Nora next to the liquor while she tries hiding them by standing there all nonchalantly reading the paper and getting you to answer the door "now who left those here?"........Either that or she was cheating on Nate and Shaun isn't his son........What a TWIST!! totally just Shyamalan'd that right there! *flex*

 

Take no offense to anything I say I am serious about the important stuff an if it comes across as being dismissive or anything I not trying to make it that way. I am truly interested in others opinions on this matter.

 

Thanks,

Geoff