Beth messed up our elves!

[Kendo 2]

There are a few very pathetic comments of a personal nature in this thread. Calling someone a xenophobe because they do not like the looks of an elven race IN A GAME is just...well...'I think the elves look fine and if you don't agree with me then you are a racist.' That is the crux of a few posts in this thread and that kind of crap is LAME.

 

Okay. For those of you who care about such things, this is the location of the game's racial presets:Data\meshes\actors\character\facegendata\facegeom\skyrim.esm. There are about 2500 nifs. Each nif contains meshes for hair, mouth parts, eyes and eye lashes, and eye brows. The individual head meshes have unique face shapes. The names of the nifs (like '000a0e49') make me think they are hardcoded to the game and cannot be changed in a player-made esp or esm. IF that is the case then we are stuck with the chargen options unless the nifs themselves are modded. Data\meshes\actors\character\character assets contains the game's NPC meshes. There are meshes for the male and female heads of argonians, humans and khajiit. There are no meshes for altmer, bosmer or dunmer. That also tells me we are stuck with above mentioned preset nifs, as the mer ears are part of the head meshes. All of that aside there ARE indeed attractive NPCs in the game that obviously DO NOT use the presets, so making a 'pretty toon' is possible. Making it playable might be another story though.

 

What I think about the preset chargen elves of Skyrim: They are fugly and once the CK is released I WILL CHANGE THAT FOR MY GAME. I like that all of the non-beast races now have distinct looks, but I do not like the cragginess of the elves. That is my personal aesthetic and it does not coincide with what a few game devs at BethSoft think.

[antonkr]

Well lets see... the humans are perfectly fine, save for some weird odds and wrinkles, which were easily fixed with Gimps' blur tool.

 

Argonians are awesome, though I'm disappointed that the females still have breasts when they really shouldn't.

 

Khajiits look cool. Now our favourite kitties can have some individual variation! Yay!

 

Orcs are awesome as well. No longer look like the lime green clay I made for a history class project, now they look like some ludicrously sexy beasts!:wub:

 

Elves, however... Bethesda made a big blunder here.

 

Dear God, they've made elves so ugly it's unreal. I think the way they looked in Arena/Daggerfall/Morrowind/Oblivion was perfectly fine. Why the heck did they have to go and make them look like Klingons? Seriously, those rubber forehead aliens ceased to be attractive or even remotely likeable back in the 1980's.

 

I'm upset. In Oblivion elven men were smoking hawt... now... well... it's the opposite.

 

Thankfully some talented modders fixed the issue with the wrinkles and plastic foreheads, but they still look pretty homely. I pray they release the CK soon. I need to fix this so bad. :(

There's your problem. People actually look realistic for once. In Oblivion everyone looked pretty, even if they were in a Daedric death camp for 6 month. Oblivion elves were horrible.

[Ghogiel]

Well lets see... the humans are perfectly fine, save for some weird odds and wrinkles, which were easily fixed with Gimps' blur tool.

 

Argonians are awesome, though I'm disappointed that the females still have breasts when they really shouldn't.

 

Khajiits look cool. Now our favourite kitties can have some individual variation! Yay!

 

Orcs are awesome as well. No longer look like the lime green clay I made for a history class project, now they look like some ludicrously sexy beasts!:wub:

 

Elves, however... Bethesda made a big blunder here.

 

Dear God, they've made elves so ugly it's unreal. I think the way they looked in Arena/Daggerfall/Morrowind/Oblivion was perfectly fine. Why the heck did they have to go and make them look like Klingons? Seriously, those rubber forehead aliens ceased to be attractive or even remotely likeable back in the 1980's.

 

I'm upset. In Oblivion elven men were smoking hawt... now... well... it's the opposite.

 

Thankfully some talented modders fixed the issue with the wrinkles and plastic foreheads, but they still look pretty homely. I pray they release the CK soon. I need to fix this so bad. :(

There's your problem. People actually look realistic for once. In Oblivion everyone looked pretty, even if they were in a Daedric death camp for 6 month. Oblivion elves were horrible.

Really? I thought everyone looks damn ugly in oblivion.

[antonkr]

Well lets see... the humans are perfectly fine, save for some weird odds and wrinkles, which were easily fixed with Gimps' blur tool.

 

Argonians are awesome, though I'm disappointed that the females still have breasts when they really shouldn't.

 

Khajiits look cool. Now our favourite kitties can have some individual variation! Yay!

 

Orcs are awesome as well. No longer look like the lime green clay I made for a history class project, now they look like some ludicrously sexy beasts!:wub:

 

Elves, however... Bethesda made a big blunder here.

 

Dear God, they've made elves so ugly it's unreal. I think the way they looked in Arena/Daggerfall/Morrowind/Oblivion was perfectly fine. Why the heck did they have to go and make them look like Klingons? Seriously, those rubber forehead aliens ceased to be attractive or even remotely likeable back in the 1980's.

 

I'm upset. In Oblivion elven men were smoking hawt... now... well... it's the opposite.

 

Thankfully some talented modders fixed the issue with the wrinkles and plastic foreheads, but they still look pretty homely. I pray they release the CK soon. I need to fix this so bad. :(

There's your problem. People actually look realistic for once. In Oblivion everyone looked pretty, even if they were in a Daedric death camp for 6 month. Oblivion elves were horrible.

Really? I thought everyone looks damn ugly in oblivion.

Both ugly, and unrealistic. Everyone looked like they had 2 pounds of make up on. :facepalm:

[JimboUK]

There are a few very pathetic comments of a personal nature in this thread. Calling someone a xenophobe because they do not like the looks of an elven race IN A GAME is just...well...'I think the elves look fine and if you don't agree with me then you are a racist.' That is the crux of a few posts in this thread and that kind of crap is LAME.

 

Okay. For those of you who care about such things, this is the location of the game's racial presets:Data\meshes\actors\character\facegendata\facegeom\skyrim.esm. There are about 2500 nifs. Each nif contains meshes for hair, mouth parts, eyes and eye lashes, and eye brows. The individual head meshes have unique face shapes. The names of the nifs (like '000a0e49') make me think they are hardcoded to the game and cannot be changed in a player-made esp or esm. IF that is the case then we are stuck with the chargen options unless the nifs themselves are modded. Data\meshes\actors\character\character assets contains the game's NPC meshes. There are meshes for the male and female heads of argonians, humans and khajiit. There are no meshes for altmer, bosmer or dunmer. That also tells me we are stuck with above mentioned preset nifs, as the mer ears are part of the head meshes. All of that aside there ARE indeed attractive NPCs in the game that obviously DO NOT use the presets, so making a 'pretty toon' is possible. Making it playable might be another story though.

 

What I think about the preset chargen elves of Skyrim: They are fugly and once the CK is released I WILL CHANGE THAT FOR MY GAME. I like that all of the non-beast races now have distinct looks, but I do not like the cragginess of the elves. That is my personal aesthetic and it does not coincide with what a few game devs at BethSoft think.

 

Oh joy, Nifscope hates me, I aged 10 years just porting a few hairs. :(

[ginnyfizz]

Would one possibly be able to Wrye Bash an NPC face onto one's player character?

[RomeoJGuy]

Elves/Mer are not humans..... Elves/Mer are not humans.... What you consider the differences between male and female from a anthropocentric view does not mean that other ethnicities/races have to fit those types of physical characteristics..... Seems to me probably stems from an underlying xenophobia.... These different races you can choose are entirely separate and should not be the silly puddy mess that was the oblivion character creation where everyone looked the same with different color skin.

 

Trolling again. You are accusing me or what amounts to racism and I am not going to stand for that. I live in a multi ethnic community and find that in each ethnic group, the males and females look distinctly different. It's as simple as that. It beggars belief that you and likeitsillegal are now playing the race card just for me pointing out the fact that males and females, and I am talking about HUMANOID races, after all the elves are humanoid though not HUMAN, look different. Really, that is utterly ridiculous and nothing more than an attempt at troublemaking. It's also defamation.

 

I repeat, those of us who do not like what Bethesda has done with the elves are prepared to mod the features we don't like when the CS comes out, those who do like them can leave them as they are. It's beyond dispute that Beth have crippled the chargen and limited the sliders so let's hope a UI mod can put them back in, something similar happened with Dragon Age. So far as I am aware, it is not compulsory to worship everything that Bethesda do, and some of us don't.

 

Well maybe those words are a bit harsh, but you completely ignored the main point.... Mer are not supposed to be Humans.... your concepts of what should be a female type of structure and what should be a male type of structure have no bearing on what that race should be. I say race merely because the mer and humans can still breed with each other making them not distinct species. But the monkeys illustrates my point very clearly. Chimps/Monkeys/Gorillas are all very close to our species and the fact that their differences between male and female are not obvious to us. For reference, the genders of the chimps are male/female/male/female. You are fine to change the game when it can be modded and nobody gives a two craps but this thread is trying to say bethesda did something wrong and that it needs to be corrected by bethesda in likely the next game they make. They didn't really do anything wrong. The ideas presented regarding improved chargen all boil down to trying to force a (imo dont harp on the word) Caucasian aesthetic of femininity unto the elves by driving the sliders far enough to remove the whole unique aspects of their facial structures that makes them elves as designed by bethesda and seen before in morrowind. And put the troll word away... just cause someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them a troll. we all learned in kindergarten that different people can have differing opinions.

 

As to what Kendo 2 said, Gee whiz what is everyone here saying? We all don't care if you mod your game to have whatever the hell you want, but to try and claim Bethesda did wrong with the elves is crazy..... not finding something aesthetically pleasing does not cause error on the side of the designers. and I hope they don't regard this thread in thinking there is a problem with elves.

[Kendo 2]

I'm going to make cute elves in armor-plated bikinis as soon as all the game utilities are up to speed. :thumbsup:

[Axanon]

All is well, there will be many big breasted sexy elf mods in the very near future. Edited November 25, 2011 by Axanon

[ginnyfizz]

Elves/Mer are not humans..... Elves/Mer are not humans.... What you consider the differences between male and female from a anthropocentric view does not mean that other ethnicities/races have to fit those types of physical characteristics..... Seems to me probably stems from an underlying xenophobia.... These different races you can choose are entirely separate and should not be the silly puddy mess that was the oblivion character creation where everyone looked the same with different color skin.

 

Trolling again. You are accusing me or what amounts to racism and I am not going to stand for that. I live in a multi ethnic community and find that in each ethnic group, the males and females look distinctly different. It's as simple as that. It beggars belief that you and likeitsillegal are now playing the race card just for me pointing out the fact that males and females, and I am talking about HUMANOID races, after all the elves are humanoid though not HUMAN, look different. Really, that is utterly ridiculous and nothing more than an attempt at troublemaking. It's also defamation.

 

I repeat, those of us who do not like what Bethesda has done with the elves are prepared to mod the features we don't like when the CS comes out, those who do like them can leave them as they are. It's beyond dispute that Beth have crippled the chargen and limited the sliders so let's hope a UI mod can put them back in, something similar happened with Dragon Age. So far as I am aware, it is not compulsory to worship everything that Bethesda do, and some of us don't.

 

Well maybe those words are a bit harsh, but you completely ignored the main point.... Mer are not supposed to be Humans.... your concepts of what should be a female type of structure and what should be a male type of structure have no bearing on what that race should be. I say race merely because the mer and humans can still breed with each other making them not distinct species. But the monkeys illustrates my point very clearly. Chimps/Monkeys/Gorillas are all very close to our species and the fact that their differences between male and female are not obvious to us. For reference, the genders of the chimps are male/female/male/female. You are fine to change the game when it can be modded and nobody gives a two craps but this thread is trying to say bethesda did something wrong and that it needs to be corrected by bethesda in likely the next game they make. They didn't really do anything wrong. The ideas presented regarding improved chargen all boil down to trying to force a (imo dont harp on the word) Caucasian aesthetic of femininity unto the elves by driving the sliders far enough to remove the whole unique aspects of their facial structures that makes them elves as designed by bethesda and seen before in morrowind. And put the troll word away... just cause someone doesn't agree with you doesn't make them a troll. we all learned in kindergarten that different people can have differing opinions.

 

As to what Kendo 2 said, Gee whiz what is everyone here saying? We all don't care if you mod your game to have whatever the hell you want, but to try and claim Bethesda did wrong with the elves is crazy..... not finding something aesthetically pleasing does not cause error on the side of the designers. and I hope they don't regard this thread in thinking there is a problem with elves.

 

Rubbish, whoever said anything about a Caucasian ideal of femininity? Desist with this racist line. In every ethnic group that I know, the female facial features differ from the male. Bethesda DID get it wrong because by their crippled and dumbed down chargen they imposed THEIR idea of what the elves should look like without any possibility of changing that.

 

It is not the fact that someone disagrees, it is the way they express your opinion, that makes someone a troll. You and another have accused me of xenophobia and racism, which is totally without foundation, is ridiculous because we are talking about a ruddy fantasy game, but nevertheless it is a very serious accusation and imputes to me what is a criminal offence in my country, should anyone just skim and just look at your comments, they could come to the conclusion that I had been spouting racist comments. It is, therefore, defamatory.