overclocking cooling question

[grandpauj1]

First off, I know this is not a computer tech forum. Just thought I would throw that in before someone got ......you know.

I just upgraded from a I5-6500 to a I7-6700k and a 650w PSU to a 850 so naturally I had to start messing around with the overclocking thing. Did do some research first as this is my first attempt at doing it. Right now I have a Hyper 212 evo with two fans (push/pull) and have it set at 4.2 GHz. Under stress with Aida64. it runs at about 70-80c @ 1.33v. If I try to bump it up to 4.3 it jumps up in to the 80-90c range, which from all I have read, that's too hot. So should I change my cooling to water or maybe a more efficient air cooler? Which would be better? In the price range of $100-$150

My Specs are as follows

MoBo - Asus Z170-a

CPU I7-6700k 4.0GHz

GPU EVGA GTX960 SC 4gb X2 SLI

PSU EVGA 850G

RAM Corsair vengeance 2400MHz 32GB 4 x 8 C: SSD 240GB (OS)

F: SSD 500GB (Storage and stuff)

G: SSD M.2 500GB (games)

I'm sure there is a bunch of info I left out, But if you reply and ask, I will do my best to answer.

Thanks in advance (o:

[soupdragon1234]

Get a better air cooler. Water coolers are no better unless they're custom loops which are really specialist items. 70-80 is too hot never mind 80-90. For the latest generations of Intel chips 73 is about the maximum recommended temperature iirc as it'll degrade if kept at excessive temperatures for long periods.

[grandpauj1]

Thanks for the reply. Ok so this morning was kinda messing with it again after seeing your reply and the 73 degrees part. So I went in and changed every thing back to default, recalibrated the fans to optimize, ran the test again and at 4.000 was at some points above 75c. Now to make sure I am on the right page here, There are temps for the "CPU" and temps for the "CPU Cores". which one am I supposed to be looking at? I will include a screenshot of my 4.00 test. My concern is if I am at 70+ at stock running speed, I will never get it to overclock!!

Thanks again for the help

[HalloweenWeed]

Cores. The package temp is irrelevant. However, keep in mind the BIOS settings regarding fan control temperatures are package temperature, which typically are about 15C cooler than the cores when exercising all cores equally - and it varies with the specific models and cooling.

 

I differ in opinion about coolers, there are some excellent AIO closed-loop water coolers out there, but you have to do the homework to find out which is best. But it's all moot if you don't have room to mount a dual-fan radiator, and don't want to upgrade the case. That said, it does only give a small difference (prob. about 10C) in temp from your excellent entry-level Evo. I've been using a Corsair H100 for 5 years, upgraded from a Megahalem (strictly air tower). But my CPU is a SB-E 6-core i7-3930K so it generates A LOT of heat when all 6 cores are in use (being exercised). AIO coolers are easy to install, compared to custom water loops. When I did mine, I did homework to find fans with good static air pressure, and settled on CM Excalibur 2K RPM fans in push-pull, meaning 2 on each side of the radiator, all controlled by the motherboard automatic speed control (Asus Rampage series has it's advantages) with custom adjusted settings for low and high temperature (availability was a factor in choosing my fans too). Also the noise was heavily considered when I chose my fans. When my computer is idle, it is pretty quiet, but when I get into a demanding 3D game like Fallout4, it is noticeable. I could probably have them set to run slower, with just a little higher CPU temp, but I want my CPU to run cool (hmm, perhaps I should tinker with it now that it is >5yr. old).

 

 

If you really want to learn about cooling and overclocking, try the EVGA forums. In particular, the one for "overclocking." IMO they are a lot more active and informative, especially for beginners, than other overclocking/cooling forums. There is a great deal there you can read without even joining/posting. Overclockers usually know a great deal about cooling.

 

Also, modern (Intel) CPUs have automatic throttling, unless you don't have a cooler correctly mounted you almost can't burn them up even if you tried - unless you have it overclocked way too far and then that's another issue altogether. It's more of an issue of preventing temperature throttling when playing or running your application.

 

http://www.evga.com/community/modsRigs/images/sm_mods_off.gif

Edited August 8, 2016 by HalloweenWeed

[grandpauj1]

Thanks for the reply, kinda checked out those links, looks like there could be some very helpful info there. Will get a better look when I have a bit more time. Another thing that crossed my mind, the thermal paste I used looked a bit funky, (it is probably 6 or 7 years old, opened and resealed) Like it was not.....creamy???at a loss for any other word. Going to order a new SLI bridge tonight (tired of looking at that crappy ass, cheap looking flexible one from Asus) so will order a tube of paste, pull the 212 off and clean it up (with alcohol) put on some new stuff and see how that works. Not really looking for 4.7 or nothing, would be happy with 4.4 happier with 4.5, but happy with 4.4 (0: Oh and just because...... Gel, paste or grease??? which one works better or is it just a preference thing? I have only used paste (not like I have done it hundreds of times)

Thanks again for the help, You guy's rock

[LeddBate]

Thermal paste should have a "putty-like" consistency. Too liquid and the coat will be uneven (and will squeeze out between the CPU and cooler contact point.) To chalky and it will crack and not transfer the heat efficiently.

 

You should never re-use thermal paste. Even re-sealed really well, I would not use paste that was that old. Get some new thermal paste, clean off your cpu and cooler and re-seat with a new layer. Do NOT wipe off paste with your fingers. You do not want body oils on the contact points. This should be obvious, but I caught a friend of mine wiping off thermal paste with his finger.

[HalloweenWeed]

Well, now that you mention it: that's called Thermal Interface Material (a.k.a. "TIM"), because it is not always a paste. There are a few other alternatives, such as thermal transfer pads and actual metal sheets that have a little squish to them to allow for errors in flatness - the latter one is rather exotic. Pads are generally used in production builds where transfer efficiency is not paramount - such as ultrabooks or voltage regulators for instance. TIM brands have varying efficiency, and this is taken very seriously by overclockers, as it can easily make a few degrees C difference in CPU temperature. Back in 11 I settled on Arctic Silver 5 (AS5), as it was cheap, easy to use, and very effective. Some TIM's are not meant to be removed - ever - and harden like epoxy. Some brands are very thick and don't spread easily when a moderate pressure is applied (such as Diamond IC). Some others are just a PITA to remove. But the method of application is what's most important - the grain of rice method is best IMO. Never use the credit card (or knife) method - causes air pockets.

 

And if you remove (or even move) the cooler after/while mounting, never continue to use the TIM application, always clean it off and start anew. I recommend alcohol to clean off most TIM, including AS5, using cotton balls & Q-tips. Unfortunately I am not at my computer right now, I have a URL to a great (albeit old) EVGA thread depicting TIM applications (better than the one that the link above leads to). EDIT: the pics are probably gone now anyway. But as far as TIM brands, my notes are from 2011 and things change, there are plenty of reviews of TIM out there, remember thermal conductivity is not everything, ease of use and permanence counts just as much. The review that I used listed and rated 83 of them, and since them AS has released an even better TIM (but it's all for just a very tiny difference in CPU temperature). There should be some pretty good youtube vids out there of application instructions, find one that also shows how NOT to apply it too - and shows you why. It is very easy to fall into fallacies of method that can allow trapped air (pockets) in the application (this is bad). And remember, you don't need to cover the ENTIRE top of the CPU with TIM, only a small area in or very near the middle is all that matters, only about 50% coverage is necessary.

Edited August 8, 2016 by HalloweenWeed

[grandpauj1]

Thanks, I am kicking my self for doing it now. I ordered the CPU $350 and the PSU $130, but not the $5 paste )o: haven't got around to ordering it yet, been hella busy with work ( self employment does have it's draw backs) but hope to get to it tonight. Where I live you just can't run to the local Fry's or anything like that, it has to be ordered.

@ LeddBate like you said "This should be obvious" I knew this but if someone down the road has this issue and reads this, they may not. Using it after it was sitting around that long was just being anxious, Kinda stupid, but anxious to get it installed and running.

@HalloweenWeed think I will get the AS 5, pretty sure I have used that before, name rings a bell. as far as the amount to use....I have seen videos with "the grain of rice" method and seen some where they say ANY contact between the two surfaces will make real bad s#*! happen. I have seen it applied with a small paint brush and have seen once the cooler is on the Cpu to move it slowly to disperse the paste evenly. not saying your wrong, not saying they are wrong. saying.......will do a little more research on this, will take a few day's to get the stuff anyhow.

Thanks again.

 

PS. LeddBate "If you want to test your spouse's patience, Play Skyrim" that is some funny s#*! :laugh:

[HalloweenWeed]

Found it (at home now), it wasn't an EVGA thread after all:

YouTube: How Thermal Compound Spreads

 

Takes 2 minutes to watch. Don't miss the last one either.

Edited August 9, 2016 by HalloweenWeed

[HalloweenWeed]

BTW, that's one heck of a nice system you have there.