Redesign Launch - Stage 2 in progress

[twowolves80]

Both of you are wrong, and demonstrably so. That 20% includes people that use both the mobile and the regular site. So there's no "us vs. them" in this at all. It's just that some people don't have time to sit at home all day and pore over mods. So people will check in on their lunch breaks or from wherever they are in the day. Honestly, I don't get where this "us vs. them" idea came from, but it's a cancer, period.

 

Moreover, that 20% is a moving number because it's steadily increasing, and there's nothing that can be done about it. What, are you going to demand that Nexus users never use their phones to look at the site? That's ridiculous. Vortex is being designed to take advantage of this and implement it in a way that is more efficient for both mobile and site users.

 

This is where Dark0ne, if we hadn't run him off, would chime in to break it down for you real quick and short. I have personally witnessed him address this very issue in other threads, and have just paraphrased what he would tell you. In fact, here he is now:

 

  On 11/1/2017 at 12:02 PM, Dark0ne said:

 

In response to post #54799858. #54800528, #54805933, #54818428, #54818433, #54834513, #54841248, #54865923, #54869793, #54870233, #54872678, #54875248 are all replies on the same post.

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vcgrant wrote: On first blush, I find it ironic, and a bit telling, that a web site that owes it's very existence to PC Games and its fans, optimize's it's web design for mobile platforms.

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Dark0ne wrote: Why is that ironic? A few people have commented on this and I've yet to have someone explain why it's silly to code a site with mobile optimisation in mind as part of the process.

18% of our traffic comes from mobile. A number that grows every single year as smartphone usage continues to rocket. It would be stupid to do a new design and not take that into account, just like it would be stupid to do a new design and not take in to account the 17% of people who browse the site using FireFox or the 5% who browse using Edge.

With your (and some other users') line of thinking, websites for console games should be most optimised for Televisions, because that's the platform on which you most play console games. Makes no sense, right? How you play your games has no relation to how you browse the internet and finding a happy medium for both desktop and mobile users, that can make both as happy as possible was, and still is, the most prudent course of action.

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Rigmor wrote: New site works great with the 0.0001% of "Brave" browser users :tongue:

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vcgrant wrote: It is ironic because the functionality that can be had with a web page optimized for a PC processor and graphics is much greater than any mobile platform. Most mobile sites in look and usability are about where computer platforms were in the earliest days of the Net. Most apps are dumbed down to enable them to run on mobile devices and any 3D depth has been lost to flattening everything out to make it smaller and quicker to load.

Bottom line from my perspective, this is a PC site., make it look and play as one.

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vcgrant wrote: Double Post

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Sonja wrote: While it's very nice that people on mobiles can more easily window shop for mods, when they come to actually download (and install if they're using NMM) them, they will be doing so on PC.
As I have stated, the new layout has really started to grow on me after my initial apprehension; there is much that I like. However, in terms of PC functionality, it does need some tweaking.

Moreover, even if it's steadily growing, 18% doesn't comprise a majority. I'm abysmal at mathematics, but even I can calculate that much. While far too many comments here have been little more than pitchfork level incoherent wailing, gnashing of teeth or just generally rude, there has still been a lot of constructive feedback, and I really hope you guys take it under consideration before releasing a final version. Aside from the obvious benefits to those (the majority) on desktop, this would probably reduce alienation and toxicity dramatically.

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fireundubh wrote: Nearly 20% is a huge number of users. If you think that's trivial, I'd hate to see how you run your business.

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Karolus_ wrote: To be honest, that means the other 80% are PC and Mac users basically(80%>20%). The users that go here with the phone I bet do it basically when they want to interact within the community, being pms, forum, or commenting mods at most. Every other part, from uploading mods to images is done with a PC/MAC, and offcourse the part where you download mods. Being that the main site functionality is (as of now?) uploading and downloading mods, there is not "much" point in giving priority to phones. Most probably the ideal solution would be a phone version with a focus on the social part of the site, with the tile based UI, and a main version focused on PC/MAC and usability on mod uploading/downloading/managing with a more "conventional" UI. At this point this is probably an echo in the wind, as the launch is inminent, but food for thought.

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fireundubh wrote: Mod users and mod creators together eek out a minority share of any game's player base. Should Bethesda, RED, etc., stop supporting mod users and creators? Maybe developers should make installing and create mods harder or impossible, so they can spend more time on features the majority of their players want? What's the point in building and updating systems and tools for mods when most players don't use them and don't care that they exist?

This is rhetorical and intended to illustrate why nobody competent, given the availability of the necessary resources, designs for a single audience.

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KasperSky44 wrote: When I'm on mobile I deliberately use desktop versions of websites wherever possible. The new layout is, functional, but looks terrible and clunky even on a 1080p screen. It seems foolish also to change something for 20% of a customer base, because chances are, it's going to alienate the actual majority. To be fair, I won't ever stop using nexus mods, but this push for everything to look "metro" makes everything look like a shitty gui in an early 2000's flash game.

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vcgrant wrote: "This is rhetorical and intended to illustrate why nobody competent, given the availability of the necessary resources, designs for a single audience. "

I agree in with the sentiment. However, in practice the site is not designed to be 25% mobile friendly, vs. 75% PC friendly. To make it work for mobile platforms, you need to program the entire site entirely for mobile platforms. In essence, doing exactly what you are advocating against, i.e. only designing for a single audience.

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fireundubh wrote: "To make it work for mobile platforms, you need to program the entire site entirely for mobile platforms."

Speaking as a web developer, that's not true at all.

Let's break down some stats:

70% of visitors to Nexus Mods use Chrome
17% use FireFox
5% use Edge
3.5% use Opera

Because every browser renders HTML and CSS differently, when designing and making the site we need to take in to account how the site looks on all those browsers and ensure it works and looks right on all of them. Case in point, we made a change to the font weight recently which looked fine in Chrome, but definitely not as good in FireFox or Edge.

Because Chrome is the most popular browser by far, should we simply ignore how the site looks in the other browsers people might use and say "oh well, you should just use Chrome"?

Of course we shouldn't.

As such, we have to code with all the above browsers in mind.

This is exactly how it works with mobile too. In the same way that we code with FireFox, Edge and others in mind, we now also have to think with mobile in mind. It's not that mobile takes precedence, it's that it has to be considered, just like all the other options.

If you don't think we should code with mobile in mind you must also think we should not code with FireFox or Edge in mind, which is obviously silly. People need to change their thinking on this one and adapt to the changes in how internet content is being viewed -- like we have.

 

Edited February 5, 2018 by twowolves80

[modal1]

  On 2/5/2018 at 5:38 PM, twowolves80 said:

 

This is exactly how it works with mobile too. In the same way that we code with FireFox, Edge and others in mind, we now also have to think with mobile in mind. It's not that mobile takes precedence, it's that it has to be considered, just like all the other options.

 

If you don't think we should code with mobile in mind you must also think we should not code with FireFox or Edge in mind, which is obviously silly. People need to change their thinking on this one and adapt to the changes in how internet content is being viewed -- like we have.

 

 

Redirect mobile users to http://m.nexusmods.com

 

Just checked on mobile.. the site's usability no better there, worse IMO.

[NCRForever]

It's not about "sitting at home" on our asses. I work long hours, I rarely take a day off. When I come home, I just want to sit at my computer, find a mod or three or whatever and just veg out. I use my mobile for text and calls. Period. I don't use it for browsing mods. Nor do I have any social apps on my phone. Am I saying that Vortex and mobile is a bad idea? No. I'm just saying that the new design is bad on a 4k monitor. Plus it's very hard to work with. I've also done my own research on all of this and you CAN incorporate another design into the new site without changing the mechanics on the new site. All you need to do is create a fallback theme/design and incorporate it. Adding a theme layout button in the profile area. This way you keep the new site mechanics working with Vortex and the fallback theme design. No need for two different sites as people keep saying.

[twowolves80]

No, I get it, NCR. I do. There's some issues with the new site, and I'll be the first one to point it out, and I'm pretty sure Dark0ne would, too. Buuuuut... :) There's a schedule because Dark0ne heard us loud and clear waaaaay back when on the NMM issues and saw a chance to work hand in hand with Tanin (I think that's his name--apologies if it isn't!) who designed MO to give us something that is going to be better than sum of its parts if all they did was combine the two. This will be cutting edge, and once it's released, Kit will go to work and address some of the more technical stuff that will make it look better on 4K screens. Dark0ne freely admitted last year in October, I believe, that they'd tried to do things on their own and it hasn't worked out quite so well. They do work on the site bugs actively to the extent of their abilities as seen on GitHub. Just be patient. When Kit goes to work, she'll probably have a few nights of hard work to catch up, so kudos to her. But Vortex comes first, and it's going to be something special.

 

At least, that is what I have put together by following three threads and reading everything.

 

And look! They even put in a graphical interface to track the bug killing in real-time!

 

 

:tongue:

[NCRForever]

At least someone gets it. Everyone seems to think that all I'm doing is crapping on the new design. If I was, I would've stuck with my original "The new site sucks and needs to be killed with fire." statement that I made before. Well, not word for word, but close enough.

I still feel the new design has it's place. I understand that 20% use their phones for the site. But, these are probably the same people who has and live on apps like Facebook, Messenger, Twitter and a melange of other apps. Me, I'm just old school. My phone is purely for communication. Text and voice. I don't have a Facebook, Twitter or even a Pinterest acct. It's not for me. All I've ever been saying is that we(the PC users) need a little consideration and have a PC friendly theme. I don't think it's too much to ask for.

The new site dynamics/mechanics are sound. Yes, there are still quite a few bugs, but, slap an old school/old site theme on top would be awesome.

[Darnexx]

Looks like the Upload of files doe not work on the old Layout anymore?

Nexus was a nice palce to be.. but that new Layout is just a big no!

Thanks for nothing on this one...

[SeraphielAU]

I'm late to the comments party, but I've been watching and waiting to see how the site would look once all the fixes had been done and the only thing I can add is that IMO the images for the mods should be solid without the gradient effect overlay on them that makes it hard to see the image. If that poor obscuring effect could be removed the site would look quite a lot clearer (and better) IMO.

 

Just my two cents.

 

Edit: Just hopped onto Nexus this morning to find that the gradient effect has gone! Nice clear images showing on the mod lists. Looks much better, thankyou! I highly doubt this was changed just because of my comment, but thankyou anyway. :)

Edited February 12, 2018 by SeraphielAU

[zweigarvel]

Please keep an "old site" design option. I hate the new site design and I know i'm not the only one :(.

[spoonsinger]

Bang goes the neighbourhood :-(

[Darnexx]

R.I.P old Layout... you will be missed... still hate the new one. Thanks for nothing, Nexus Team.