Mod Author Donation System

[twowolves80]

Yeah, I knew he had said something to that effect--one thing about Dark0ne is he don't miss much. I was just being a lazy-ass and didn't want to go on a snipe hunt for it. lol Thanks for that breakdown, though! :)

[lillian]

Thank you to all the modders that share their wonderful creations with us on Nexus. I think this is a great idea! However, atm I can't afford Nexus premium or to donate for mods. As my dad would say, "No money, no funny." =( Therefore, as I've hit the donation pop-up wall, I'll return next month when my financial situation might be a tad more flexible. Much love and peace always.

[KatArus]

In response to post #56843861.

AGreatWeight wrote:

 

It seems that you have a personal conflict of interest on this matter. My opinion still stands. You've expressed yours too.

The feature you're requesting serves no useful purpose whatsoever, and has been proven to be open to blatant abuse. Besides, that is what endorsements and comments pages of mods are for... although it seems you've not done a lot of endorsing yourself in 5/6 years.

Demagogy. Don't bother.

[KatArus]

In response to post #56846101.

FrankFamily wrote: If you want a metric that takes into account the actual user satisfaction with the mods, that would be endorsements, right?. What's the point of adding another thing? As for shouldn't endorsements dictate where donation points go then? Dark0ne has answered to that. In the end the majority of mods have similar endorsement/download/views ratios, what are the chances of a mod's downloads being inflated by users that simply tried it out to the point that the assigned amount of donation points would be "unfair"? Not many, people like a mod, they endorse it, it goes into hot files or higher in the top mods lists, more people see it, more download, etcÂ

The only real metric is whether the mod stays in the load order after it was installed or not, but that one has privacy issues and situational circumstances like merging.etc.

Take the only unhidden mod that I currently have published, as an example: it's a port of my script for Vanilla Skyrim. it has 300 downloads and 7 endorsements first 4 of which were given when it was not effin working because I uploaded old script file from the wrong folder that had same name. Stuff is bad enough as it is. If stuff like AFT, Project Nevada, Flower Girls, or multiple complex elaborate mining and dragon overhauls will have the same reward weight not only as titty slider mods, they will just drown in easy to make retextures and simple one-two line config mods. I've seen enough good mods just die out and, as it is, this new system won't help at all. Edited January 19, 2018 by KatArus

[Hydreigon]

First time I've read this article in its entirely. I think it's a great idea! And as to "Please, however, really take note of what I wrote in regards to the use of the unique download counter as the metric being used.": Just want to say, as a mod author myself (though not super active), I completely agree that's it's a fair metric to use. Also agree with the need for this system to be as hands-off as possible. Edited January 20, 2018 by Hydreigon

[lukelavablade]

From a personal standpoint, this would make me afraid to try mods that I'm not sure are gonna be good.

 

I often like to download mods just to give them a try. A lot of the time they're bad, so I delete them. But in such a situation, I've still given the author a unique download for their mod, even though I don't think they 'deserve' any DP that my unique download will have contributed towards. And there's no way for me to say "Hang on, don't give this author something I don't think they deserve." Not that such a feature would help much.

 

But if the mod is great, I want to endorse, and comment about how much of a diamond in the rough it is! And I won't be able to do that if I never download it to check it out.

 

So it has the potential to reward people more than they deserve, or otherwise cut off a reward from people that do. The system would encourage "download-bait" descriptions because of this issue.

 

A somewhat more meta-problem would also be that this system could potentially eliminate competition from other sites that wish to foster a modding community. The Nexus is already considered to be one of the best sites for modding any game, and I'm sure rivals have struggled because of this. There was a kind of similar problem raised with Steam Workshop Paid Mods: It would drive people away from the Steam Workshop. This could have the opposite effect of making authors only want their work on the Nexus because that is the platform that will best reimburse them for their effort.

 

Now, obviously some rewards for the dedicated modders in the community is better than no rewards, especially since a significant amount of it is gonna be from your own coffers, but I think this concern of a potential monopoly is worth noting. If modders choose the Nexus for their mod to be hosted on purely for the monetary aspect, rather than the features of the Nexus that make mods accessible and help the modding community grow, then that might mean if some hypothetical competitor site that offers better features would not have people put their mods on it, even if that site would be a good place for them. In a probably more realistic argument, this system might also discourage modders from hosting their mods on their own site (such as what Enderal did), even if having their own site would be the best way to get the mod to work properly and deliver the information about it. The Nexus is already the standard place for modders to distribute their mods (as far as I'm aware), and this system might reinforce that even more strictly, to the point where the alternatives will struggle to flourish even if they offer things the Nexus doesn't, which might be detrimental to the modding community as a whole.

[Psieonic]

In response to post #56963306.

lukelavablade wrote: From a personal standpoint, this would make me afraid to try mods that I'm not sure are gonna be good.

I often like to download mods just to give them a try. A lot of the time they're bad, so I delete them. But in such a situation, I've still given the author a unique download for their mod, even though I don't think they 'deserve' any DP that my unique download will have contributed towards. And there's no way for me to say "Hang on, don't give this author something I don't think they deserve." Not that such a feature would help much.

But if the mod is great, I want to endorse, and comment about how much of a diamond in the rough it is! And I won't be able to do that if I never download it to check it out.

So it has the potential to reward people more than they deserve, or otherwise cut off a reward from people that do. The system would encourage "download-bait" descriptions because of this issue.

A somewhat more meta-problem would also be that this system could potentially eliminate competition from other sites that wish to foster a modding community. The Nexus is already considered to be one of the best sites for modding any game, and I'm sure rivals have struggled because of this. There was a kind of similar problem raised with Steam Workshop Paid Mods: It would drive people away from the Steam Workshop. This could have the opposite effect of making authors only want their work on the Nexus because that is the platform that will best reimburse them for their effort.

Now, obviously some rewards for the dedicated modders in the community is better than no rewards, especially since a significant amount of it is gonna be from your own coffers, but I think this concern of a potential monopoly is worth noting. If modders choose the Nexus for their mod to be hosted on purely for the monetary aspect, rather than the features of the Nexus that make mods accessible and help the modding community grow, then that might mean if some hypothetical competitor site that offers better features would not have people put their mods on it, even if that site would be a good place for them. In a probably more realistic argument, this system might also discourage modders from hosting their mods on their own site (such as what Enderal did), even if having their own site would be the best way to get the mod to work properly and deliver the information about it. The Nexus is already the standard place for modders to distribute their mods (as far as I'm aware), and this system might reinforce that even more strictly, to the point where the alternatives will struggle to flourish even if they offer things the Nexus doesn't, which might be detrimental to the modding community as a whole.

Mods such as the ones you describe that you could consider 'bad' that you only tried once and removed, tend to not earn much of a following. They might earn some points, but not enough to really be worthwhile. They should still receive a small pittance of points, because after all, they did attempt to publish a mod, but in reality the system will be self-regulating in this regard, as bad mods garner bad comments and a bad reputation if they're well-known enough, to the point that people still start steering clear of it and stop downloading it in any considerable numbers.

Good mods on the other hand, will continue to gain attention, positive comments and word of mouth will continue to encourage its growth. As I'm sure you're aware, this often happens through mod spotlights on YouTube and being featured in popular mod lists. Thus, as the popularity of a mod grows, so to does its point earnings.

It's also worth pointing out, that for a person who tends to download many mods at a time, their unique-download-count for each mod is intrinsically worth less. As the total downloads across all mods opting in to the scheme is used to divide the donation pool, you're dividing the value of your count amongst all of those mods. Less so than 'rewarding bad mods' you're technically actually penalising good mods. However, as mentioned before, comments, reputation, endorsements and all other reputation influences that you contribute to the system will still have an effect on how well a mod can continue to earn points, however slight, as it may and probably will, affect other people's "click votes".

Overall I think the system is pretty well thought out and covers the widest range of possibilities it feasibly can. Don't forget also, this is all essentially a "Value Added" deal. It's a little something extra for everyone involved that essentially, does not require any more participation from you than downloading a file. If you want to be more involved, you can always contribute to the donation pool, or donate directly to the mod author yourself. :)

Edit, Addendum: Regarding the concerns for creating a monopoly, it has positives and negatives.

On the positive side, providing a rich and diverse community of modders a place to call home helps collaboration efforts and visibility/publicity for their mods. Nexus thus far has proven to be a trustworthy caretaker and nurturer of that community, and in my opinion, will continue to be for the forseeable future.

On the negative, nothing says they might not start screwing with what people like, and a company can always 'turn bad'. (Don't be Evil, Google! .... damnit.)

Pragmatically speaking however, nothing stops competing community sites from implementing their own similar systems, regular old direct donations are still a thing, and if Nexus really does go Full Overlord Evil, (you never go Full Overlord Evil!), or something 'better' comes around, nothing is stopping people from voting with their feet and walking. It happened to MySpace, it happened to Yahoo, it happened to Digg, it definitely, certainly could happen to Nexus. Edited January 23, 2018 by Psieonic

[Deleted5364899User]

Try adding an advertisment page where users of your site go to and charge their account with donation tokens, then they can (or forced?) to donate those tokens to modders, later you redeem the tokens (Donation Points) from modders with money. This way (or around it) might work.

 

1- Users makes money from advertisment page or referral links/codes/CryptoMiners.

2- Users pay modders who the users support with Donation Points gained from point 1.

 

Note: I never used advertisments, so I can't tell how profitable this will be.

 

My 2 cents.

Edited January 28, 2018 by Guest

[blackrat99]

I have no problem with the basic concept. My main issue is that many good mods get missed because users tend to look only at the biggest and most popular, which makes them even bigger and even more popular, meaning that the rewards are unfairly concentrated in a few hands.

 

My only other worry would be that this sytem might further encourage modders to desert the older games and just go and mod the latest game. The few modders still supporting older games are likely to miss out on any rewards.

 

I wonder if it would be possible to add to the reward system, whereby new mods get a small set points reward if they reach a certain download number, just to encourage people to keep releasing mods for less popular games.

[Trosski]

In response to post #56262141. #56262426, #56262576, #56262581, #56262936, #56263031, #56263146, #56266491, #56267106, #56267256, #56274311, #56277726, #56280516, #56292401, #56330506, #56342966, #56613381, #56645096, #56709596 are all replies on the same post.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: So basically the Nexus will decide who is rewarded in this elite group of modders? One thing us Americans hate the most is when others create elitist groups and give them what they want while crapping on the rest of the people. I'm absolutely certain when all is said and done this will drive away American users.

Ethreon wrote: You don't really help brighten the image Americans have outside.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: lol i don't exactly make the best poster child I suppose

Ashes2Asherz wrote: lol i don't exactly make the best poster child I suppose...

err it double post.. maybe they should focus on optimizing this new site to not be so slow and buggy before taking on their version of paid mods.. ;)

Ethreon wrote: It would be in your best interest to read the article again, carefully.

Zodiac19 wrote: American here and not driven out. It just means that if a mod author is really good with what they do and keep making mods worth downloading then they have the potential to be compensated for it eventually. that means it's not set or fixed whether or not a modder will receive a reward, or that it will only remain a certain group of modders each time because as soon as one mod has support from every user on the site then the modder has to start over just to get points, meaning the next top modder with the points will be next etc.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: it would be your best interest to read in between the lines.. Who do you think this will hurt the most? Most likely the modders that rely on 3rd party assets to create mods and those that use them.. There is already much more greed on the Nexus than any other modding site.. They introduce a money pool to certain users then you better believe that many of those modders that once shared their work to be used in other peoples projects will clamp down and stop giving permission in hopes to gain more of the money pool for themselves.. It would definitely stun the growth of the modding community and make it so only a very few will benefit while the rest will lose interest and move on..

Augusta Calidia wrote: Nexus doesn't decide who is rewarded - we the people do by downloading mods. Each unique download of a participating mod is a vote cast for that mod. That's not a policy that would drive this American user away.

Furthermore, who comprises "this elite group of modders" of whom you speak? Am I supposed to exercise an ability to "read in between the lines" and discover that Nexus is in cahoots with a core group of favored mod authors on whom Dark0ne wishes to shower gifts? This, of course, is nonsense, because Nexus doesn't decide who participates in the Mod Author Donation Program. The individual mod author decides that for her/himself.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: What's wrong with donating to the author you like to begin with? Why does the Nexus or Nexus community have to make that decision for you?

Ethreon wrote: Again, go read the article. You obviously haven't.

CluckenDip wrote: Strayaaa!!!

iubee wrote: sure bring a little heat to this post

HomicidalGrouse wrote:

What's wrong with donating to the author you like to begin with? Why does the Nexus or Nexus community have to make that decision for you?

Nothing is preventing people from continuing to not do that after the implementation of this system.

Airbreathers wrote: As an American, i am well versed in spotting fear mongering. Ashes, your post is fear mongering, your post take this system out of context completely. The people decide not the nexus, and for your read between the lines idea, the authors can decide how to split the points. think about it like this you have a great mod that works a a base of key feature of many others, we can all think of a few. Now lets say that author tells people that if they want to use that mod they need to give them 50% of the reward points. That might be steep to most, at some point another author will create an alternative and maybe ask for like 10% or 5%, that mod becomes the norm, the community stables out, I mean it becomes a free market of ideas, where they rise and fall based on quality and value not just popularity and "elitism".

the way i put it may sound scary to some, but i put on my big "scary" American capitalist hat ( I don't think its scary) to lay it out in another very American way. You know seeing as we are a wide and diverse nation with many people with differing ideals, like like everywhere else likely in that regard, meaning it's hard to speak for everyone, Basically impossible.

Dark0ne wrote:

Nothing is preventing people from continuing to not do that after the implementation of this system.

You made me laugh out loud while eating breakfast. Congrats.

JoeBlow90 wrote: You must be joking about 'Mericans creating "elitist" groups.... lmao...

What do you the "American way of life" means???

If there is something that 'Mericans are good at, is creating ELITIST groups...

Ashenfire wrote: WTH?
Whats with the nationality hating?

Any person who wants to scam, be elitist, a hater, comes from anywhere. How are we going to rationally discuss ANYTHING, with this mantra? Please refrain from bashing our nationality.

TehKaoZ wrote: Please don't come on here and report to speak for all Americans. I have zero issue with this system and don't buy into that "creating elitist" group crap.

wato39 wrote: Thank God a bit of sense at last. I felt like it was ground into the dust before we got a chance to see it work ,,, or even fail.

If anything this system would encourage mod authors to improve their modding skills. One thing that I have found to be true all across this community is no one is stingy with knowledge, and everyone is willing to help others. I can't tell you how many brains I have picked since I started creating mods, or how many tutorials I have read and watched. The reason all of this exists is, because we all have a passion for the games we play, and and a drive to make them better than the original creators ever envisioned... And large breasted women... But I digress.
As a hard working, red blooded American, I can say, without a doubt, that this would not drive me away. And as Ethreon suggested... Go back and read the article again. This is not designed to create some elitist group of mod authors hogging all of the rewards. It actually levels the playing field for new authors to come in with great ideas, and compete with the big names, because everyone starts at 0 on day one.
I like this idea. I'm sure it will have it's issues, and growing pains, but it can't have any more bugs than a Bethesda game.