LOOT groups issue

[kamikatze13]

LOOT will show a cyclic interaction when a plugin of a prioritized group (e.g. alternate start) has an optional plugin from the default group and references the prioritized plugin as master.

 

so this:

 

 

leads to this:

 

 

The advice that a circular interaction and at least one custom dependency exist is misleading - no custom dependencies have been set up. i also was not able to find a circular dependency by looking through the default rules. none of the rules even include `imperious`:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

recreating the expected load order via rules or setting the loot group `alternate start` on the watercolor plugin fixed the issue:

 

[Tannin42]

The cyclic interaction isn't a bug, if Alternate Start should load after default and a plugin inside default needs to load after alternate start that is a cycle.

 

The error message is pretty bad I will admit, but that message is directly from LOOT, I can't change it. But I'm sure it will be improved, give it some time.

[kamikatze13]

Ah - a cycle not between mod rules per se but between loot categories as well as mod rules. Will have that in mind.

[DarkDominion]

do people who make those rules have ANY idea how many mods use the "default' as group name ?

this is quite ridiculous

 

how are we supposed to know which mod goes in what classification ?

[passionatepilgrim]

I hate Loot right now.

 

I should clarify. I'm a new modder. I started with Skryim SE, using Vortex exclusively. After a week of careful research and planning, I was able to get 94 mods going without any issues. I spent a week getting used to the game play changes and then started my first new play through a couple days ago.

 

Tonight, I load up Vortex, excited about my new play through and bam... all these new error messages out of nowhere. After spending hours spinning in circles, turns out it's this new Loot change.

 

First, it would have been courteous if Vortex had let me know that it had automatically upgraded since I last launched it. Then I would have known to look on the Forums instead of tracing all those rules.

 

Second, even though I'm on version 0.15.0, Vortex gave me an error message saying I'm not on the current version. I went to Nexus, but that wasn't helpful in letting me know if 0.15.0 was the most current version.

 

Third, the priorities were great because they worked in conjunction with the rules I had setup. The categories break all that because they conflict with the rules instead of working with them. Having two levels of rules just adds unnecessary complexity. I'm sure I'll get used to it, but I don't see the added value.

 

Fourth, it sucks to have to re-work everything with no warning and having the priorities deleted so I can't reference them.

 

Overall, I've been super impressed with the modding community in general and very happy with Vortex. I became a premium member to support Nexus. I'm planning on endorsing the mods I'm using and making some monetary donations.

 

Okay, I'll get over it by tomorrow. But for today, in case you haven't gotten the message, this Loot change sucks. Not sure if Loots going to get a donation.

[DarkDominion]

Ah - a cycle not between mod rules per se but between loot categories as well as mod rules. Will have that in mind.

how ?

 

You have dependencies inside the mods, you yourself need to put the defaults into groups WITHOUT knowing whats inside the mod ( the baked in dependencies )

SO : right now you can have multiple mods inside a group, and ONE mod can eff things up for a whole group, because that mod asks for a different dependency, so you need to turn that around but Vortex wont let you because of reasosns.

 

Are you still following me ? great, because I have lost it.= completely.

 

THIS IS THE SINGLE MOST ANNOYING THING VORTEX HAS COME UP WITH. I WANT MY OLD VORTEX BACK !

[Graybark]

Using 0.13 of LOOT in Vortex seems a bad idea to me right now. It makes sorting impossible with certain mods installed without majorly messing with the groups of the plugins involved. Groups is experimental and to force it on people who do not even know how to contribute to the masterlist seems a terrible idea. Then again, I might be missing something.

 

You can read more about it here: https://github.com/loot/loot-api/issues/22

 

Also, LOOT has not changed. This is not the default LOOT but an experimental version. The decision to use it with Vortex was made by Nexus.

[Tannin42]

Well actually this is not an experimental version. 0.13.2 is the official latest release of the loot-api. The loot standalone application is still at 0.12 but I assumed

that was before the UI for this feature wasn't done yet.

 

Anyway, you're using vortex, an alpha application and within the "beta" update channel. If you didn't expect things might break we apparently weren't clear enough about

the development state. This feature is only in the most bleeding-edge version we publish, no one has been "forced" to use it.

[Graybark]

Well actually this is not an experimental version. 0.13.2 is the official latest release of the loot-api. The loot standalone application is still at 0.12 but I assumed

that was before the UI for this feature wasn't done yet.

 

Anyway, you're using vortex, an alpha application and within the "beta" update channel. If you didn't expect things might break we apparently weren't clear enough about

the development state. This feature is only in the most bleeding-edge version we publish, no one has been "forced" to use it.

LOOT calls it an upcoming feature so I think it is fair to say that it is experimental. I was not aware that the update channels actually did different things since the whole app is still in alpha. That's on me then. I can deal with the issues but some people here are new modders - which begs the question why they are using it in the first place.

[Tannin42]

 

LOOT calls it an upcoming feature so I think it is fair to say that it is experimental. I was not aware that the update channels actually did different things since the whole app is still in alpha. That's on me then. I can deal with the issues but some people here are new modders which begs the question why they are using in the first place.

 

For the loot standalone application it's an upcoming feature because it's not included in the current release of the loot standalone application.

But in the loot-api it has already replaced priorities at the beginning of april. The issue tracking the development has been closed end of march (https://github.com/loot/loot-api/issues/20)