Railroad Extreme Hypocrisy

[HeyYou]

Really, you have not experienced memory repression and implantation ? Its a thing in real life !

 

EDIT: nah, you've clearly been wiped already.

Hhhmmm..... I hope I didn't pay too much for the memories I have now then...... Some of 'em just suck. :D

[ToroMontana]

The Railroad quest was a total fail. I mean hello?? your best agent is now the Director, Shaun is almost dead anyway, and you have more than enough military force to simply kill off all the division heads and start over, why do you need to blow it up?

[SKKmods]

why do you need to blow it up?

 

Because most of the game's audience grok the immortal *"Nuke them from orbit ..."* lines, so this gives us clean and crisp closure to roll the credits and find our car keys.

[BlazeStryker]

Ehrm... what? The Railroad will flip their lids at you if you don't pull the emergency evac lever.

 

Furthermore, the stuff Amari does is entirely voluntary. It does in fact sit uneasily with some members. Glory isn't keen on it, yet... look at her. Die-hard Railroad heavy.

 

</factual reassertion>

 

There's the simple fact that Bethesda's plotting is... inconsistent. Modders do a lot to help with that. That said, the Railroad is not all that cohesive. It goes beyond worries of AI human equivalence to the points of view of Synth members like Glory. Glory knows full well that the option of memory wipes is extended as a favor for those wishing to basically do an in-game Start Me Up but she also recalls the unwilling memory wipes undergone by G5-19. She's also hardly stupid; those forced wipes by the SRB are almost certainly why the voluntary one left G5-19 non-cognitive.

 

(For those that missed or forgot it, G5-19 is a former friend and comrade of Glory whose noncognitive frame was later made the new body for CVRIE)

[montky]

re post #14

well said, and thanks for the recollecting of that poignant scene with G5-19 and CVRIE.

yeah, it's like a robo-version of 'organ donation';

 

 

 

"Giselle" aka G5-19, had difficulty with software & some hardware,

though the body was repairable... whereas CVRIE had more of the opposite.

Software or main computing was fine though chassis was degrading. (in cut content with rusty)

perhaps, in other circumstances, the funerary rites of the androids would have taken precedence

though, without the ability to form whole new androids...

 

-------

It's not the Railroad's fault entirely that, G5-19 came to be that way,

it's moreso the SRB, for putting failsafes into units to try and prevent them from leaving the Institute.

 

 

 

[MarkusTay]

Just doing the first few RR quests again today, and I noticed something. I've noted it before, but I think each time I play-through it gets more glaring. Doctor Carrington is an actual DOCTOR - he heals you. He is a MEDICAL doctor. Tinker Tom is the 'Nutty Professor' - the guy who INVENTS THINGS.

 

So why the hell does the first quest - Tradecraft - have you retrieving 'Doctor Carrington's Prototype' (which just looks like a Railroad Stealthboy). I think that is a HUGE lore blunder.

 

Personally, if it were me, I would have had it that you had to retrieve the P.A.M. AI unit. It was originally in a computer (if you read the terminals it says so), and the gov't later put it in an assaultron. So what if after the bombs dropped it was put back into the computer, or in storage, OR the assaultron that it was in was destroyed... WHATEVER. And Doctor Carrington and Tinker Tom were working together on trying to retrieve it without damaging it (either from the comp, storage, or the broken bot) when the attack came. Since you don't interact with P.A.M. until after this mission is done, it would have made perfect sense, and been more lore-friendly (because NOTHING ever comes of that stupid prototype - it was just a MacGuffin you have to get to be in the Railroad. it would have been SO much better if it actually meant something.

 

But like so much of Bethesda's story-telling, it was all completely pointless.

 

Also in that same (first) mission, Deacon tells you Glory won't run missions involving destroying other synths, even gen1's and gen2's. Yet, the only time she teams up with you, she has absolutely no problem blowing them away (she does make an off-hand comment' - "it has to be done" - but that is it). She is literally shooting apart two of them before you even arrive.

[RGMage2]

I finished the railroad quest line last night. I've had this game from day one but this was the first time I took the railroad through to the end... I was saving it. I've got to say it was the least satisfying ending so far. Having to kill defenseless female scientists after relaying into the institute and then rampaging through the main atrium felt very much like I was a terrorist.

 

Father was right, Desdemona needed to be killed. Those people were kooks, siding with programmable synths against human beings. Makes me wonder if this was actually Bethesda making political commentary on eco terrorists.

 

After completing the mission and teleporting to the top of that very high building and talking to Desdemona, I felt that my only sane response would be to walk over to the edge of the building and jump off and kill myself, which I did, and immediately started a new game with the intent on not playing the Railroad. I still haven't play BoS through to the end and I think I'll save that for a while longer, I'm not ready for another disappointment so soon after this one.

 

The only way I can rationalize the writing is to view it in the context of the game. The fallout world isn't reality based. It's an insane over the top exaggerated cartoon universe where stupidity rules, and yet... not so different from our own. Hmm, just maybe it's brilliant.

[ozmods]

yesterday,. i saw exactly how pathetic and stupidly delusional they are,

 

i had just gotten help from them, regarding the courser chip, and instead of bowing to them to build the transporter i used a coc console command (i'm having a conflict with a mod, so the molecular relay wont work).. anyhoo, i did the gabriel retrieval mission, and then bunker hill started up, and as soon as i went there to tell them they needed to act fast, they're gone.. there is no one there.. they perceived me as a threat, yet i was willing to do something for the synths on their behalf.. but because i didnt join their shitty group, they lock me out...

[Moraelin]

 

Ehrm... what? The Railroad will flip their lids at you if you don't pull the emergency evac lever.

 

Furthermore, the stuff Amari does is entirely voluntary. It does in fact sit uneasily with some members. Glory isn't keen on it, yet... look at her. Die-hard Railroad heavy.

 

</factual reassertion>

 

There's the simple fact that Bethesda's plotting is... inconsistent. Modders do a lot to help with that. That said, the Railroad is not all that cohesive. It goes beyond worries of AI human equivalence to the points of view of Synth members like Glory. Glory knows full well that the option of memory wipes is extended as a favor for those wishing to basically do an in-game Start Me Up but she also recalls the unwilling memory wipes undergone by G5-19. She's also hardly stupid; those forced wipes by the SRB are almost certainly why the voluntary one left G5-19 non-cognitive.

 

(For those that missed or forgot it, G5-19 is a former friend and comrade of Glory whose noncognitive frame was later made the new body for CVRIE)

 

 

The G5-19 scene goes beyond that. The whole dialogue with Glory has the tone as if you're about to kill G5-19. Even afterwards, Glory comments something along the lines that she hopes G5-19's sacrifice better be worth it.

 

And that's really what it is: a sacrifice. When you use G5-19's body to hold Curie's memories, she simply ceases to be G5-19. She's now Curie in a new body. Have you EVER thought of her as G5-19 after the memory transfer? Nah, didn't think so.

 

Well, same applies when they replaced B5-92's memory with that of "Gabriel". That's no longer B5-92 in any meaningful sense. It's just a body for the "Gabriel" person they created.

 

Or think of your travelling with Nick Valentine. Whatever the Gen 2 synth's designation may have been before that memory download, once it has Nick Valentine's memories in his head, he IS Nick Valentine in a new body.

 

But anyway, let's get back to the point of hypocrisy: Glory seems to know full well what replacing memories will do to her old friend G5-19, and it's a major problem there. In fact, in that case, she seems to even be thinking it's a violation of the stated duty to protect synths. (Actual dialogue line: "You know she's a synth. We're supposed to protect them.") BUT she seems to ONLY care about it when it's her old friend G5-19. Other synths, she has NO problems with goading to have the exact same done to them.

 

Now think of Doctor Amari's lines in that conversation. Yep, Dr Amari has NO argument to the effect of "nah, it'll still be G5-19." In fact, Amari's relevant line on the topic is: "Glory, she wanted new memories. She knew her personality would be all but erased." Oh, I guess that makes it ok then :wink: