The shaming of non-premium users needs to stop!

[twisted630]

i paid for premium before, multiple times. but if you're going to keep redirecting people to a page that looks like it's straight from an illegal, shady file hosting website on every mod that people want to download? might as well go the whole nine yards, dog. have multiple fake download buttons too. ask for credit card, say they're the millionth visitor too while you're at it. might as well redirect straight to the donation page too and ask for a tip on top of that.

 

After all, the path you're on is surely going to sit well everyone and garner you more money and support. gg.

[Reneer]

Gotta love all the slippery slope arguments in this thread.

[Sakorona]

 

Some people, for example, might only have 30 spare dollars a month after bills.

 

Premium is US$2.99 for a month. $30 > $2.99. When Premium expires, you'll be a Supporter for life.

 

But if you can't afford Premium, that's fine. Nobody's being forced to buy Premium. If you can't afford the items in a store, do you complain to the store manager that you can't afford anything? No, you just don't buy anything. Affordability is the most ridiculous argument I've seen here.

 

"Free" today never means free. You always pay something.

• Want free social networking? You pay with your information.
• Want free access to a media outlet? You pay with your attention.
• Want free file sharing? You pay with your time.

Free users have had a good run of the Nexus for more than a decade, but it's not sustainable. Nexus has grown significantly over the years and yet, as of April 2019, only 0.7% of the Nexus' 18 million users were paying customers. Something had to be done to course correct. Now, free users pay with their time. This is good for everyone.

 

 

Uh-huh. Man, I didn't realize I had to treat everything as a transactional resource. Good to know that the Nexus thinks of itself as a business, and not a community.

 

 

In any case, the problem here can be seen as two fold- making an appeal that one should support the site as a matter of morality ignores the fact that people may not view things the way you do, and the second issue is that people may not agree that they received 50 of value from the site. The costs of the site are irrelevant when customers make a purchasing decision - they look at their value.

 

.. And that ignores the fact you may not wish for people to be making purely transactional decisions when they use a community website.

 

I don't mean to pick on you in particular, but I've seen several people make similar comments in this thread, and I'd like to address those sentiments.

 

The Nexus offers its essential services free-of-charge; it always has and hopefully always will. It gives mod authors a place to share the fruits of their labors with an international audience of eager recipients in an atmosphere where their intellectual property will be respected and supported, and a knowledgeable community will be there to help support would-be users who experience issues trying to get the mods to work for them. It offers a massive catalog of game enhancements of every kind imaginable, tools to manage them, and tools, examples, and support for those trying to create their first mods. It hosts forums where people can discuss a wide variety of topics - some gaming and technology related, some not - and maintains a staff of moderators who show up day after day to tidy up the place.

 

For some, the Nexus serves as pseudo cloud storage for the mods they use. It's stability and longevity means that users who typically employ hundreds of mods can delete them to temporarily free up disk space, and retrieve them again as desired.

 

They charge nothing for any of this, yet they have expenses to cover. Expenses covered by those who voluntarily contribute to keep the doors open, lights on, and mods freely flowing. They also monitor monetary exchanges between authors and end-users, discouraging commission offers while providing the means for users to freely contribute to authors. Overall, they've taken a number of steps to keep mods freely available to all.

 

For my part, I purchase very few new games, preferring to instead re-play games already in my library, and Nexus mods greatly enhance my ability to do that. Instead of buying a new game this year, I chose to purchase the premium membership here, as I want this site to continue to thrive.

 

It's not about the premium features. The increased download speed means nothing to me, and I still have a link at the top of the page inviting me to Buy Premium. I use Firefox and block ads on most sites. As far as I'm concerned, the premium features afforded to those who contribute are really just minimal minor perks, token appreciation so the Nexus can say they give something to users who contribute.

 

I'd also like to say how very grateful I am to those members who have built and supported the site long before I came along. And I'm especially glad the Nexus has never resorted to fund-raising campaigns or slapped annoying banners on every page begging for donations. Instead, they (mostly quietly) offer premium memberships, which comes across to me as much more professional and business-like.

 

(Note: I can't comment on the current state of pushing premium memberships, as I haven't downloaded anything recently.)

 

All that said, to those trying to justify their "reasoning" for not contributing - just don't. If you can afford games and the hardware to play them on, you can probably toss some money at the Nexus. Yes, there are exceptions. Some people have internet and sophisticated hardware for work. Some people have banking / credit / identity / general payment issues. Thing is, most mods are luxury additions to luxury goods. They aren't food, clothing, shelter, or health care. First world problems, eh? If you - or the dictates of your situation - have determined not to contribute cash up to this point, just own it. The Nexus will serve you mods, tools, and support regardless.

 

TLDR: The point of supporting this site with actual cash is not the premium features offered, but keeping it open for business.

 

 

 

Nexusmods is a for-profit entity, it's not a charity.

 

They have to pay for their staff, taxes, bills, and scalability and these things do not run cheapily. Money doesn't simply grow on trees.

 

Sadly, if you are a regular user then you're using their platform without giving anything in return to the site. You could argue that you're contributing with mods and goodwill, but at the end of the day that won't and doesn't keep the lights on at night. It's money. And in that respect, they have their own right in how they conduct their business in order to keep it all afloat. Again, I must emphasize money doesn't simply grow on tree. You can argue that you've enabled and perhaps even clicked on the ads, however there's only so much revenue you'll be able to generate as a repeated site visitor (ad-revenue generates most its money from the new visitors and even then, adblock being prevalent as it is, it's pretty little).

 

At the end of the day, this isn't a shaming issue, it's the lack of funding or Nexusmods addressing their budgeting issue.

 

Okay, so I wanted to address these in a go. The problem with the ad is that you're basically going "It's for-profit, so it has the right to do this." Sure, it does. The entire point of this thread is people going "Maybe you shouldn't.". And sure, I guess I get the point that I don't have to view this as a community site. And I don't think I'd have chosen the choice to go "we're just a business". But hey, you do you.

 

 

 

Yes, but the way the change was implemented has directly added an extra step to an existing process.

Oh, no! One more button!? Whatever shall we do! THE SKY IS LITERALLY FALLING. :rolleyes:

 

And you could also argue that it is advertising, which I as a supporter have paid to not see.

You could also argue that "ad-free" applies only to third-party ads in the ad rotation.

 

Premium memberships have always been promoted well enough in the integrated banners

As of April 2019, only 0.7% of the Nexus' 18 million users have Premium accounts.

 

 

1. You should look up UI/UX stuff. Adding extra clicks is usually a bad idea.

 

2. I'm pretty sure it just says "ad-free" not "third party ad-free"

 

3. Assuming that all 18 million users are active (I feel this is a foolish assumption), let's see what that yields : 18 mil * .007 is 126000 users. A quarter of that is still 94.5k a month. (and in this scenario, assuming 90% of the rest paid for their premium in a lump sum of roughly 60 dollars, given sale prices: that's 5.67 mil in cash. I'm REALLY worried why the Nexus needs more money than that aside from "they're a business, they want more money."

 

However, when I looked around for "freemium" conversions, I saw that 1-3% is considered the standard. So... let's return to the calculations. From the 2018 end of site, we get this interesting nugget:

 

"Nexus Mods averaged 4,996,242 unique users each month in 2018, up from 4,582,755 in 2017, representing a 9% increase in users."

 

126k premium members in 5.1mil (added some more to give a margin) is .. 2.47%, well within average freemium conversion rates.

 

Imagine that

 

The point of this breakdown? If Nexus is unable to stay afloat at this monetization rate (note this didn't even factor in monthly supporter microtransactions) .. uh.. words. Words need to be had. In any case, you can see now my doubt as to why this premium screen is needed.

 

 

 

1. I just think it's disheartening that a site built around a passion we all share, be it using or making mods, can be so easily changed to favor users based on whether they pay or not.

 

Of course I am owed nothing by this site, nor have any grounds to demand anything, especially as a free user myself. I understand it costs the owners money for servers and that the staff should be paid for the time and effort they put into maintaining and updating the site for all of us. If I have come across as entitled or complaining for the sake of it in my previous posts I do apologize as that wasn't the intention, I am just genuinely concerned by the connotations behind the change.

 

2. I just wonder what has caused the sudden and abrupt push for users to upgrade to premium, if not money. These last few months of my time on the site, first with the banners and now the download redirect, has been the only real push on premium memberships I have seen in my several years here but with no reason why. Yet again I understand it is the choice and right of the owners to do whatever they want, but when a site that is usually so open and engaging and asking feedback from all of its users stops doing so and implements a change that impacts the majority of us it is concerning.

 

And if it is money related issues, why didn't the owners feel as though they could call upon the community and ask for donations rather than a change like this, which clearly does favor paying users and which has sadly caused a clear divide in the user base just by reading the replies in this post alone. I, and I am sure the majority of other users of this site, premium or not, would most certainly help the site, and more important the community that uses it, in a time of need.

 

Like I said before, it is disheartening, even scary, that such a large part of the modding community, and certainly the part that introduced me to the hobby, could be changed like this for no obvious reason. Of course in the grand scheme of the site this is a small change, but it just feels odd that I myself was asked for feedback in the site redesign and was kept updated with news posts throughout that whole process and made to feel like part of the community with absolutely no mention of the fact that I am a free member, to be met with a change like this that is now suddenly reminding me that I am just that. And no whilst I am definitely not being forced to pay, it certainly seems as though the suggestion is there if I want to go back to the same experience I have had for years prior.

 

It also makes me think that if changes like this can occur, and that anybody who is speaking out is constantly being told to either pay up, deal with it, leave etc., then that in the future access to these sites could just as easily be taken away from non-paying users completely and without warning, in the same way this change has come about, and that those who have paid simply wouldn't care, even though in reality we are all just as equally invested in what is arguably the largest community of enthusiasts in the modding hobby as a whole.

 

3. I would hate for this to be the beginning of the end of the very inclusive community and hobby that I have had the pleasure of being a part of for years here on the Nexus.

 

1. A passion you don't care enough to pay for.

 

2. Well if my math is correct, (Somebody correct it if I'm wrong, math is not my strong suit) as firendubh has said 0.7% of Nexus' 18 million users have Premium accounts, that means that 126,000 people actually PAY to support this site while 17,874,000 just use the site for free.

 

Right there is your answer as to WHY NExus has made it more obvious that the other 17,874,000 of you should help out the site so it can stay online.

17.8 million free users uses an awful lot of bandwidth, and 126,000 users paying for the site, isn't enough to keep it online.

So, all of you keep arguing about WHY you don't have to pay, while this site is drained away bu all of the people taking the site for granted.

 

3. But, you're going to stay a non-paying member right, as you said in your other post, right?

 

I don't pay for a lot of my passions. I shouldn't be expected to. Not everything you do in life should be reduced to the monetary value of the transaction. This is a terrible mindset.

 

AS FOR THE REST, see my above breakdown.

[Reneer]

3. Assuming that all 18 million users are active (I feel this is a foolish assumption), let's see what that yields : 18 mil * .007 is 126000 users. A quarter of that is still 94.5k a month. (and in this scenario, assuming 90% of the rest paid for their premium in a lump sum of roughly 60 dollars, given sale prices: that's 5.67 mil in cash. I'm REALLY worried why the Nexus needs more money than that aside from "they're a business, they want more money."

Â

However, when I looked around for "freemium" conversions, I saw that 1-3% is considered the standard. So... let's return to the calculations. From the 2018 end of site, we get this interesting nugget:

Â

"Nexus Mods averaged 4,996,242 unique users each month in 2018, up from 4,582,755 in 2017, representing a 9% increase in users."

Â

126k premium members in 5.1mil (added some more to give a margin) is .. 2.47%, well within average freemium conversion rates.

Â

Imagine that

Â

The point of this breakdown? If Nexus is unable to stay afloat at this monetization rate (note this didn't even factor in monthly supporter microtransactions) .. uh.. words. Words need to be had. In any case, you can see now my doubt as to why this premium screen is needed.

All that effort and you didn't even try to estimate what Nexus has to pay for in taxes / expenses each year.

[AugustaCalidia]

 

I don't pay for a lot of my passions. I shouldn't be expected to. Not everything you do in life should be reduced to the monetary value of the transaction. This is a terrible mindset.

 

This line of reasoning is a non sequitur. Nobody is putting a monetary value on passion. Rather, one is putting a monetary value on the resources needed to support that passion. In some cases, no money is required. In other cases, money is required. I have a passion for learning the Latin language. To fulfill that passion I had to pay educational costs and buy dictionaries, grammars, and Latin texts. I have never assigned a monetary value to this passion of mine, but I was not able to fulfill this passion until I spent some hard earned cash.

Edited December 16, 2019 by AugustaCalidia

[Sakorona]

Assuming my low ball estimates hold: 94.4k per month is a yearly income of 1.132 *million* before the lump sump shots and supporter buys and what little ad revenue they get. Are you *trying to tell me that the Nexus has expenses in excess of 1.1 million!?*

[Reneer]

Assuming my low ball estimates hold: 94.4k per month is a yearly income of 1.132 *million* before the lump sump shots and supporter buys and what little ad revenue they get. Are you *trying to tell me that the Nexus has expenses in excess of 1.1 million!?*

Maybe? Have you taken a look at the overview of their expenses at all? Nexus is clearly spending a lot of money on bandwidth.

[HadToRegister]

 

 

Some people, for example, might only have 30 spare dollars a month after bills.

 

Premium is US$2.99 for a month. $30 > $2.99. When Premium expires, you'll be a Supporter for life.

 

But if you can't afford Premium, that's fine. Nobody's being forced to buy Premium. If you can't afford the items in a store, do you complain to the store manager that you can't afford anything? No, you just don't buy anything. Affordability is the most ridiculous argument I've seen here.

 

"Free" today never means free. You always pay something.

• Want free social networking? You pay with your information.
• Want free access to a media outlet? You pay with your attention.
• Want free file sharing? You pay with your time.

Free users have had a good run of the Nexus for more than a decade, but it's not sustainable. Nexus has grown significantly over the years and yet, as of April 2019, only 0.7% of the Nexus' 18 million users were paying customers. Something had to be done to course correct. Now, free users pay with their time. This is good for everyone.

 

 

Uh-huh. Man, I didn't realize I had to treat everything as a transactional resource. Good to know that the Nexus thinks of itself as a business, and not a community.

 

 

 

 

 

I love how you call this a Community, but refuse to contribute to it.

Nexus Mods is a business model, always has been, as far as "community" goes, how can you consider it a "community" when the only time people who use the site for free contribute, is to complain about the free stuff they're getting?

Especially for having to click an extra button and wait 5 seconds?

 

 

[3aq]

Nexusmods is a for-profit entity, it's not a charity.

 

They have to pay for their staff, taxes, bills, and scalability and these things do not run cheapily. Money doesn't simply grow on trees.

 

Sadly, if you are a regular user then you're using their platform without giving anything in return to the site. You could argue that you're contributing with mods and goodwill, but at the end of the day that won't and doesn't keep the lights on at night. It's money. And in that respect, they have their own right in how they conduct their business in order to keep it all afloat. Again, I must emphasize money doesn't simply grow on tree. You can argue that you've enabled and perhaps even clicked on the ads, however there's only so much revenue you'll be able to generate as a repeated site visitor (ad-revenue generates most its money from the new visitors and even then, adblock being prevalent as it is, it's pretty little).

 

At the end of the day, this isn't a shaming issue, it's the lack of funding or Nexusmods addressing their budgeting issue.

 

Okay, so I wanted to address these in a go. The problem with the ad is that you're basically going "It's for-profit, so it has the right to do this." Sure, it does. The entire point of this thread is people going "Maybe you shouldn't.". And sure, I guess I get the point that I don't have to view this as a community site. And I don't think I'd have chosen the choice to go "we're just a business". But hey, you do you.

 

As I've stated, they (Nexusmods) have their right in how they conduct their business in order to keep it all afloat. It's in their own interest after all, and I hope yours as well, to keep the their company (and site by extension) operational. Nexusmods haven't cut off access to mods so it's quite pitiful for this cry of injustice. And look, if you don't care one way or another about the well being of this site, that's fine too-- just don't complain about the changes they make to keep it running because at the end of the day, it's not you who is footing the bills for all of this.

 

If every site owner followed the sort of mind set you and so many others like you have proposed that being treating business as a charity, then more than likely those sites would go belly up in due time. Please, just stop with the entitlement, it's getting old and fast.

[Sakorona]

 

Nexusmods is a for-profit entity, it's not a charity.

 

They have to pay for their staff, taxes, bills, and scalability and these things do not run cheapily. Money doesn't simply grow on trees.

 

Sadly, if you are a regular user then you're using their platform without giving anything in return to the site. You could argue that you're contributing with mods and goodwill, but at the end of the day that won't and doesn't keep the lights on at night. It's money. And in that respect, they have their own right in how they conduct their business in order to keep it all afloat. Again, I must emphasize money doesn't simply grow on tree. You can argue that you've enabled and perhaps even clicked on the ads, however there's only so much revenue you'll be able to generate as a repeated site visitor (ad-revenue generates most its money from the new visitors and even then, adblock being prevalent as it is, it's pretty little).

 

At the end of the day, this isn't a shaming issue, it's the lack of funding or Nexusmods addressing their budgeting issue.

 

Okay, so I wanted to address these in a go. The problem with the ad is that you're basically going "It's for-profit, so it has the right to do this." Sure, it does. The entire point of this thread is people going "Maybe you shouldn't.". And sure, I guess I get the point that I don't have to view this as a community site. And I don't think I'd have chosen the choice to go "we're just a business". But hey, you do you.

 

As I've stated, they (Nexusmods) have their right in how they conduct their business in order to keep it all afloat. It's in their own interest, and I hope yours as well, to keep the their company (and site by extension) operational. Nexusmods haven't cut off access to mods so it's quite pitiful for this cry of injustice. And look, if you don't care one way or another about the well being of the site operation then that's fine too-- just don't complain about the changes they make, at the end of the day, it's not you who is footing the bills for all of this.

 

If every site owner followed the sort of mind set you and so many others like you have proposed that being treating business as a charity, then more than likely those sites would go belly up in due time. Please, just stop with the entitlement, it's getting old and fast.

 

 

Holy extrapolation, Batman!

 

Anyway, this is a great example of my argument (can-should), and I usually duck out when people start strawmanning what I mean, so I'm .. just going to drop it.