CyrusAmell

I think I can safely say that we have all watched that ShoddyCast Episode.

Father was explicitly against transhumanism, and had enough clout to shut down the cybernetics program that had given Kellog extended life. It is quite clear from his logs that Father knew most Institute Scientists would have preferred the cyborg program continue and not stop. If it had actually been a given goal to make a perfect being, or whatever, then the cyborg program should have been expanded upon. I also find it highly debatable that the Institute could make a clean transfer between one of their own scientists and a synth. At most, the scientists would be killing themselves so that a synth that thinks it's them would be made. It would be exactly like Nick Valentine - his own synth but with the memories of a long dead man. At any rate, the Institute seems more concerned with radiation free humans (making them like the Enclave) than it does with any notion of a superior race. Even then, it is still willing to recruit capable scientists from the surface so they might not care much about that either. The whole point of the gen 3 program was to help create a utopia by ensuring that Institute Humans did not have to do any manual labor and could focus on pushing the boundaries of science. To that end, the Institute desires to replace its current gen 1 and 2 synth workforce with gen 3 synths and to have enough gen 3 synths to keep expanding the Institute size underground at a steady pace. This little utopian vision, which many Institute scientists see as close enough to touch, would be severely hampered if the subject of gen 3 synths being sentient people was taken as a serious issue. Ergo, the persistently held belief that synths are not people. Also, the idea of humans or human-like entities existing in a futuristic authoritarian society that represses them has been an important part of science fiction for almost half a century. And the Fallout games reach very far in search of inspiration: - Logan's Run (1967 book - Explicitly referenced in Fallout New Vegas): Mankind's population is controlled by killing anyone who hits 21. Those who try to run and escape this fate are hunted down by elite operatives called Sandmen. One of these elite operatives eventually tries to run himself. - Blade Runner (1982 Film based on 1968 novel - referenced throughout Fallout series): The film depicts a dystopian Los Angeles in which genetically engineered replicants, which are visually indistinguishable from adult humans, are manufactured by the powerful Tyrell Corporation. The use of replicants on Earth is banned and they are exclusively utilized for dangerous or menial work on off-world colonies. Replicants who defy the ban and return to Earth are hunted down and killed ("retired") by special police operatives known as "Blade Runners". - Cloud Atlas (2002 Book & 2012 Film): In the 2144 Neo Seoul section, a prominent part of the story are "fabricants", basically human clones who are used for slave labor and who have their humanity repressed. I won't go into spoilers in case you have not seen the movie or read the book but you get the picture.... Basically, it is a very evocative science fiction premise that was too good for the Fallout 4 developers to pass up.

I think I as level 125. I kept going at it until I had settled 26 settlement locations and now I pop in from time to time.

Frankly, the current manner of encountering high level merchants (barring a few at pre-set locations) is ridiculous if not even feasible for normal players. Some can even die while a player is in the area without any notice being given. It is quite vexing. I mean, we are the ones who are building towns shouldn't they come to us?

Strategically speaking, destroying the Institute quickly was perhaps a military priority. First, the Brotherhood had no way of knowing how many synths would appear from within the Institute to possibly overrun the attackers. Second, the Brotherhood did not just want to destroy any synths they could find they also wanted to destroy any means of creating them, which also included killing scientists and blowing up their laboratories. With the Railroad it made more sense. The Railroad was not an army, they could not hold the Institute against all comers. Instead they chose to evacuate all of the synths and any civilians who did not fight back and then blew up the Institute. This way the surviving Institute scientists would no longer pose a threat - even if they gathered up any low gen synths and coursers that were not destroyed by the blast they would still not have access to the Institute's infrastructure which had gone a long way to making them a force to be feared. And they would certainly have different priorities than recapturing escaped synths. It would be like dropping a bunch of nerds into the desert with a few weapons and no internet and expecting them to make do. Yet the Brotherhood was willing to just kill everyone, so why not just scrap any machinery they did not like and convert the Institute into a new Brotherhood Bunker? Well, then Bethesda would have had to do a little more work for another distinct ending (perish the thought).

Where does it even say that? I keep seeing this pop up on tv tropes.com but I have never seen it personally in game. Was there a memo I missed? Sadly the only source I have at the moment is fallout wiki as last fallout bible installment was at 2002 maybe? But no worries, ever since the first fallout game I always did a thorough gameplay searching for notes holotapes and terminals, Fallout 4 is the first game that deals with the Institute in wider range so if there is a mention regarding their policy and general aim I will find it. Thank you, but you really don't have to. The terminal entries already uploaded to the wiki are quite insightful. But it would be nice to know where this particular quirk comes from.

Where does it even say that? I keep seeing this pop up on tv tropes.com but I have never seen it personally in game. Was there a memo I missed?

1. Synthetic organs for replacements to keep a current human body going are a huge possibility with this technology. Synthetic insects could be used to pollinate plants in the absence of insects that used to do this (which was a pretty big loss following the war). One Bioscience Division scientist proposed synthetic merpeople for underwater expeditions. 2. I said they don't need to eat or sleep. The Gen 3 have some innate advantages that are posited throughout the game. Paladin Danse managed to tank engine fire from a rocket in an early Bortherhood quest which would have toasted a regular human, power armor or not. And as I said, robots are not as smart and able to adapt as humans - they would need constant supervision for even the most basic tasks. This is why robots could have been deemed unsuitable for the construction jobs that Gen 3 synths are expected to do. 3. I do not think it is stated that Gen 3 need to eat and sleep and etc. They are made to think they do so as to fit in with human society when needed. As for how many they need infiltrating the surface, even I can only guess. Robots are more efficient than humans in a single task-to-task basis. But you can't leave a Protectron alone in a room and tell it to build the furniture, paint the walls, and what have you unless you took the time to program it for every single task. In Vault 101 during Fallout 3, a Mr. Handy just like Codsworth named Andy was made a doctor out of the blue and his first task was to take care of sprained toe. He then promptly cut off the poor woman's legs. In short, humans can adapt and articulate the needs of a situation in ways a robot cannot without first programming them for the task. Even then, the robots would still require constant supervision which is something Institute scientists do not wan't to be bothered with. As for asking me to defend Bethesda's daft representation of a group of scientists, I will not. That is because even I do not know why the Institute does half the things they do. Unlike every other faction, their goals are either needlessly complicated or never truly elaborated upon. No one ever sits us down at a table and explains what their core ideology is, if they even have one. Despite being a group of people that has been around for almost 200 years I never really got the feeling that they represented an actual culture beyond science, lab coats and business meetings.

I don't think it's quite so grand or conspiratorial. There are children and humans have shown steady population growths in the years since the bombs fell. It's just that these population growths are kept in check by the dangers of the Wasteland and access to resources. The NCR is rumored to control territory with as many as 700,000 people within its borders. As for the original topic, a few things may have prompted the creation of the Gen 3 Synths and would certainly serve to fill the plothole. 1. Gen 3 Synths are more than just robots, they represent the first actual synthetic organisms in the Fallout universe. This not only showed this feat to be possible but also allows for branching projects as was seen with the synthetic gorillas. This is all just the tip of the iceberg of what synthetic technology could be used for. 2. The Institute expands only through excavations that extend their facilities further underground. This involves constant construction in cramped quarters which regular robots are not suited for. To keep pace with their needs the Institute either had to keep diverting valuable scientists from research to get their hands dirty or import a large number of human laborers (willing or not) at great cost to resources. The Gen 3 synths are the perfect workforce because they don’t need to eat or sleep, they are as capable as regular laborers (if not more), they don't catch diseases (great for cramped quarters), and the Institute can produce them as needed almost instantly. Another bonus to Gen 3 is that they make good test subjects in certain situations (highly unethical situations). The Gen 3 also have the bonus of being more well-put-together as Allie Fillmore herself complained of the older model synths requiring more maintenance (which means wasted time and resources). 3. The Institute, for some off reason, prefers to send synths to the surface for salvage operations or spying. Especially for spying the Gen 3 synths really had to be spot on. A man or woman can be forgiven for not being fertile but they had to be like normal people when it came to every situation. That includes things like eating, bleeding, growing hair, having emotions, having sex and etc. In addition, unlike the Enclave, which prided itself on developing a hardened military force, the Institute seems to have striven to reach a point where it scientists can focus on their research whilst maintaining their isolation and self-sufficiency. They created synths so they themselves did not have to do manual labor or fight. As for why the Gen 3 who were only used for construction had to be to be human-like I suppose the Institute likes to roll their needs into a single project. While the Gen 2 Synths would have been less controversial to use, they are still not as efficient as near-human workers. So in the end, the Institute created a sentient race to do all the work they didn't want to do just so they didn't have to get their hands dirty. Humans were a perfect starting point because as Father said they were already proven to be perfect machines: "walking, talking, fully articulate and capable of anything." Mind you, when they started the project they themselves may not have considered the possibility that their creations would become fully sentient and develop free will. To most, the Gen 3 represent an upgrade to the Gen 2 and that is good enough for them.

Frankly, I think it's ridiculous that Ballistic Weave is hidden behind a wall of faction quests. That stuff is too much of a game changer to ignore. Sure it only add +22 resistance to individual body parts but the head gets the full +110 damage resistance.

Could swear I saw a couple myself. One group got jumped by a deathclaw, though I killed it before anyone got eaten.

Well, I believe that an argument can be made for the Sole Survivor favoring the Brotherhood based on the faction patrol mechanic in the game. It's not perfect, but I think its something. Basically of the four major factions, only three actually contribute patrols: The Minutemen, the Brotherhood and the Institute. The Railroad only has agents at checkpoints. They are not an army and so do not have the numbers to spare for patrols. At least, I have never seen one. The Minutemen send out patrols no matter who you side with. You may think at first that they can do the job fine on their own, but if you actually walk up to a patrol and appraise their armament I guarantee you will not be impressed. The Brotherhood of Steel does send out patrols before the game is beat, and compared to Minutemen patrols are a force to be reckoned with. Two, maybe even three soldiers in power armor along with a scribe and initiate to balance things out. The Institute apparently sends out patrols at the end of the game, for some unknown reason. But these groups, which also command checkpoints, are made of weak gen 1 and 2 units. I also do not know for certain that these synths won’t be hostile to other Wastelanders – including your own Minutemen patrols (I may be wrong here). Frankly, this is the exact opposite of what I would have ordered as Director so we are off to a flying start aren't we? Running the Institute must be like wrangling smart/evil cats. I can see now why "Father" was a bit batty. In sum, a Sole Survivor by midgame can deduce the usefulness of siding with the Brotherhood of Steel if he or she values these patrols. This is because in the Commonwealth Wasteland there is the constant threat of raiders, ghouls, super mutants, rogue robots, deathclaws and all manner of scum threatening travelers. If it’s just the Minutemen patrolling the land then the Commonwealth is in for a few rough years until they can get their act together. But with the Brotherhood tramping around everywhere you can easily imagine that time getting cut by a large margin. Despite Preston Garvey’s early misgivings, I believe that an alliance of convenience between the Minutemen and the Brotherhood would expedite the suppression of the worst elements of the Wasteland. Naturally, this is what I believe a Sole Survivor can assume by gauging the strength of the first Brotherhood patrols he or she sees. Not to mention the constant sorties by Vertibirds, a factor largely undermined by how frequently the stupid things crash. It is not completely unprecedented. I think that Maxson has retained just enough of Lyon’s Doctrine to accept working alongside local forces when convenient.

To be fair, even the survivors said that needed to happen. It was that bad...

Fine - I am joining the Brotherhood of Steel for my second playthrough. Are you happy yet? Incidentally, what are the chances we will be made Elder of a Commonwealth Chapter when Arthur Maxson eventually goes back home? Just asking...

Did you try going to the fancy bar in the upper stands of Diamond City first?

Concerning the original topic, I do not believe it would be feasible to use console commands to change your allegiance in such a manner so late into the game. To do so may very well break your game. As for the inevitable argument between the Institute and the Brotherhood, often a source of contention among players doing a second game, I for one believe that both factions have good and bad qualities to consider. Brotherhood of Steel The Institute

While I have had limited experience with the synthetic gorillas in the Institute myself, I believe that they are partly a re-texture of Yao Guai and use the same attack animations and audio. It is still an interesting asset to have in a Fallout Game but I don't think it is quite the game changer that one would hope for.

Yeah, for that you will want Extra Shipments by IDontEvenKnow at http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/2390/? It is not really a cheat because you still have to pay for the stuff. But it does mean you don't have to go crawling to Moe in Diamond City for more wood shipments after deforesting Spectacle Island. This will save you a massive amount of time, believe me.

Frankly, I just pal around with companions until I acquire their Companion Perk and then send them home or to a settlement. Then I will either opt to stick with a romanced companion or go solo with the Lone Wandered Perk. Especially for some late game decisions, it may be better to go it alone...

Should probably have posted this in the Mod Troubleshooting Forum. I always thought of the Spoiler Section as more of lore and gameplay thread area. Otherwise that is one pretty bad problem. Any personal retexture mods being used?

This is the Discussion Forum, not the Spoiler Forum. Please place confidential info into a spoiler bracket. But yeah, if anything the Brotherhood has regressed from the progressive policies of Owen Lyon. Their little Codex also makes it difficult to enact the kind of long-term change one might hope for. To me they lean more towards neutral than good, but that still makes them better than most groups in the Wasteland. It's just that on this matter I have some difficulty reconciling their stance with my choices.

An angry man who will instead kill said children. Also, there is reportedly a synth colony in the new Far Harbor DLC. We both know what the Brotherhood would do if they caught wind of that place.... And I believe that the Institute ending gives the player possible powers (which I will not mention outside the spoiler section) that actually allows you greater control than in the Brotherhood.

Or is simply bored of their world-state in their Railroad/Minutemen Ending. As I was. I thought at first that my second playthrough would be with the Brotherhood of Steel, because, as you may have bluntly and undiplomatically phrased it, there are certain qualms about joining the Institute. The problem with the Brotherhood is that they are set in their ways, and there are some scruples one may have with them. For one thing, although they seem to leave intelligent ghouls like Hancock alone (with the added racism), they are adamantly in favor of wiping out any synths they find - which means that Curie and Nick are possible targets. Also, don't forget that you literally give them a stolen database of all the escaped Institute synths' DNA and they may potentially use that later. Oh, and they will probably want to eliminate Strong at one point (if that matters to you). The Institute at-least does not care who you pal around with on the surface. My big thing with the Brotherhood was that I could not stomach their goal of just killing all of the synths they could. It was completely unnecessary and a total deal-killer for me. The Institute, at present, is selfish and has done terrible things. And yet, I believe its ultimate course can be set in a new and better direction. Anyone who joins the institute needs to at first accept it for its faults, both past and present, before considering what good may be done in an uncertain future. As Mama Murphy stated in her drug fueled Sight rant, an Institute player "will not be loved, but you will save humanity. However you choose to define it." Institute Vision at 2:26 It is a video-game, not real life.

The Railroad and the Brotherhood would need to be wiped out, whilst the Minutemen are fine with it either way. The only problem is that once the Institute is no longer under the threat of a siege they will start sending out synth salvage parties which I heard somewhere may actually be hostile to the odd Minutemen patrols. So that may lead to a few headache inducing incidents. Also, do not do any quests for the Railroad if you are going to side with the Institute, otherwise you will be locked out of a small nifty side quest. Which is terrible if you really want the Ballistic Armor mods that make regular hats into almost impenetrable helmets but this can be circumvented with mods that allow access to Ballistic Weave without joining the Railroad. Who else thought it weird that the least technologically savvy of the big three main factions (though not by much) had access to the best upgrades? Kind of silly if you ask me.

Oh that's an easy fix. Just give them the "beep beep" voices, they become much less annoying after that. Kinda cute hearing them beep when they are at their guard station.