BLOG PIECE: Modding as a hobby versus modding as a career, and the position of the Nexus

[LazyAltmer]

It seems the mentality of the paid/curated mods model is the app model for mobile devices: looking at mods as "apps" in some kind of "app store". Thus we see the leveraging of Steam as akin to Google Play.

 

Steam Workshop is an abysmal platform for this, as so many have noted. With game mods, however, there is the further complication of theft due to mods being unsigned and uncompiled (aside from scripts), and thus easily stolen/copied.

 

But aside from the mechanics of this kind of app + appstore model, the collegial dynamics of the mod community would suffer greatly, IMHO. If someone figures out how to get a feature to work and their mod succeeds and they are raking in the dough, there is no incentive for them to share this with the community and thereby potentially dilute the niche for that type of mod and reduce their income.

 

If Beth did go with this kind of model I think it would be a disaster. It would destroy a lineage and following that they have cultivated for so long.

 

If they want to monetize Steam Workshop, then let it be by microtransaction, whereby the mods are free, but downloads (i.e., access to a specific mod on your Steam account) costs 5-25 cents (just for example) apiece. This will incentivize 1) Steam Workshop to become a halfway-decent platform with real functionality and utility in order to compete with other mod sites such as Nexus, 2) Beth will work to get more mods on the Workshop and to keep the new mods flowing even years after a game's release, 3) allows the mod makers to focus on providing free mods while using donations to make some kind of money if they so choose.

 

I think keeping Beth/Steam monetization (via microtransaction) uncoupled from mod monetization (via donation) is the only way to prevent a hellish result from monetizing mods. Otherwise, mod makers will need to have the ability to uniquely sign and compile mods to prevent piracy, and it will no longer be an open community - it will be a staid developer forum.

 

Further, let us not forget mods such as SKSE, which are not mods in the usual sense, but add functionality that supersede the game's innate functionality, and are an enabling technology for thousands of other mods. Would SKSE-like programs be part of a curated model? TES5Edit? etc. I think not.

 

What the open modding community has done, let not Bethesda/Steam sunder.

Long live the Nexus. :)

 

Edited March 20, 2015 by LazyAltmer

[Kylehac673]

Hi everyone,

I've never really posted on the Nexus before, but I've been here for a while.

Pretty much all I wanted to say is imho money ruins everything don't let it ruin

mods too, the only reason money even has worth is because we make it that way.

At the end of the day money is paper or numbers and it drives me nuts seeing people

go buck wild over it.

 

Now if you want a solution, money can still be earned in a way that leaves modding

somewhat alone.

For instance The bigger mods like Falskaar (Mods big enough to be a small game) could

just be considered User Created DLC or something along those lines.

Then any Modders that want their Mod to be a UCD could submit a form to the developer(or Valve or whatever) with a description, list of features, and a sample.

Also for something like this though I would say that any proceeds should be split 50/50.

 

Again this is just my opinion.

 

Edited March 20, 2015 by Kylehac673

[donta1979]

I have to agree, modding is going to change if we want it to or not... I also see it becoming more competitive, and secretive among modders, I see lawsuits on the horizon, competition becoming even more fierce. I do have a problem with this there are modders here and other places that make our models, animations and other things from scratch. Valve, and no company out there paid for our software packages, our time, power to run our machines, and they get a say 75% of the profits something is wrong there... I see this causing more harm to the modding community honestly, just not rivals becoming arch enemies, to friends hating each other, the list just goes on and on. There is a market for it yes... What valve and other companies are about to do is going to shake the very foundations of the modding community everywhere. The big companies are coming, and once they are here there wont much the little guy can do to stop it.. If you want to see great examples where modding will be headed, download UE4 or Unity5 and check out their online in engine asset store... Or in games now that have an in game store, Dead Space 3, Evolve, and so on... any game that uses DLC micro transactions... Edited March 20, 2015 by donta1979

[elezraita]

First off, I am fine with people charging for their mods, though I shudder to think what that could do to modding resources such as script extenders, mod managers, tools like FNIS, ENB/Sweetfx, xEdit, etc, whose value to modding far outweighs that of any individual mod that makes use of them, and the installation of which is not possible using the black box approach of the Steam Workshop. If Chesko were to start charging for Frostfall, would the SKSE team start charging for SKSE, or would they demand a cut from Chesko's mod and of the profits from any mod that requires member functions they've created? If they do, will SKSE have to be uploaded to the Steam Workshop in order for them to get paid? The potential legal ramifications make my head spin, to be quite honest. The Steam Workshop doesn't install things into the game folder, as far as I know, so the automatic installation of the script extender would be impossible as things currently stand. If the SKSE can't make money but people using their work are, will the SKSE team still be willing to help the rest of us make better mods?

 

Apart from all of that, I have never trusted the Steam Workshop for Bethesda games. I see it as a place where lazy people who can't be bothered to learned how to mod their games safely and correctly go. Maybe this view is unfair, but I see great opportunity for shoddy mod installation when the process is made into a black box the way the Steam Workshop does it. I have a friend who only mods with the Steam Workshop. He has no concept of load order, conflict resolution, safe updating procedures, or any of the amazing tools talented and dedicated people have made to help others mod more extensively and safely. He says that the technical side of modding goes over his head. I'm preaching to the choir here about the dangers not using a proper mod manager, and not setting up a proper load order, etc.

 

So, while I'm okay with the the concept of charging for mods, I'm not sure about implementation for TES and FO mods, because it would be a disaster if Steam, as it currently operates, became the primary (or, in an unlikely turn of events, the only) option.

Edited March 20, 2015 by elezraita

[zzjay]

if they close open modding...then there'll be only one thing left to do...stop modding at all!

 

i never used steamworksho and i'm never gonna do it...i dont care...skyrim's not even a good game...its this popular only because of modding...and userfixes...oblivion is better without mods...

 

if they want to cut this out then i shall cut out bethesda from my list of games...i bought skyrim only because i could mod it and use my own textures...customize it and stuff without having to do complicate stuff like in dragonage

Edited March 20, 2015 by zzjay

[elezraita]

In response to post #23623379.

Also, if it comes to money, I'll still share anything I figure out with the community, not that I have a lot to show for my efforts yet. It's just money, but apart from that, assuming that modders can set their own prices, collaboration is often the more lucrative approach anyway. If not, why would corporations exist? I'm pretty sure that modding teams will not need business licenses, so anti-trust laws will likely not apply. Maybe I'm just trying to be hopeful that collaboration won't die.

[Rovlad84]

tl;dr if mods aren't going to be free, they'll just be pirated. it's already easier in some ways to mod a game which isn't tied to steam or whatever, even if you do have a legitimate copy.

[Legotrash]

When money gets into the picture,no matter what the subject,things get ugly/uglier. That's pretty much it but I already know that the gaming community can't wait to shoot itself in the foot as it usually does. So be it.

 

I like nexus and that means a lot so I hope it stays the same. If not then "another one bites the dust",I'll move on and forget about it.

 

IMHO modders don't care to get paid for the mods. It's those who wanna get paid and start modding for it who care. There's a difference because the latter group will move on if they'll find a chance for more money in something else.

 

Personally I've released only one mod (WIPs everywhere but finished mods? Just one :P ). Nothing big or fancy but it feels nice to know that someone else has it included in their load order. That's why I also try to remember to thank other modders and upload pictures whenever I can. I find it weird when someone wants more for it,especially money.

 

I never liked steam and I was suspicious of valve. They proved me right and I'm not thrilled about it. Oh well.

[MotoSxorpio]

This piece is anti-Workshop because, of course, the Nexus is being directly threatened by this.

 

That said, there is no point in discussing whether it's a good or bad thing because it will be a thing, like it or not. After all, it makes Valve money, and Valve runs PC gaming. And when it hits, mod creators will compete against each other for market share and try their damnedest to ruin each other, and the winner will be the guy who "donates" to the right youtube personalities.

 

The real question should be: how to adapt?

 

I do think that modding communities could be threatened by all this. But, adaptation is the answer.

 

 

In response to post #23598784. #23599049, #23599254, #23599614 are all replies on the same post.

@EnaiSiaion or doing an EWI and uploading bits of it on a daily basis.

 

 

Let's not start that again....

 

As far as I am concerned, a paid-for mod is no longer a mod, it is DLC -- developer is getting three quarters of the money. It's been coming for a long time, and now we will see...

 

Here's where I might get off the ship completely. If I have to pay for some of the best mods out there, I'm not sure I want to sail with Steam Curator Shops, or whatever they end up calling them. Can you imagine the cash SKSE team might be rolling in.....? But I can't just think on the one side.

 

We all have to look at the whole of what this means, not just one game.

 

I found Nexus because I was looking for mods that didn't mean hacking, hexxing, or otherwise fouling up a game to adjust its functions and features. As long as Nexus stays up, and doesn't turn into Steamworks II, I can't help but surf here...sometimes for any game just to see what has been developed.

 

In the long run, it might be a good idea for Nexus to make hosting some of these Curator Shops. Dark0ne could use hosting for a bit of coin to put back into the site...

 

One thing is for sure: if I do pay for a mod, that mod better work, better be clean and should have compatibility. :P

[myztikrice]

In response to post #23623854.

Many Workshop mods are not pirated and can't be found elsewhere.