Upcoming AMA with Elianora

[Ethreon]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

:rolleyes:

[Ombragine]

No hatred, no disrespect against her.

 

It looks like : "Use my mods if you wish, read description and learn how to do but do not ask, do not criticize, do not complain and please endorse."

 

May be i wrong but it makes me feel she has a low opinion against end users.

 

Of course all is not false for her ant others great authors. When you have to manage lot of mods, a strong notority, different games, you can not spend your time to answer to everybody and often the same question, same request, same issue, bla bla bla...

 

It is impossible to do it for any author who has a lot of success. No time.

 

Just disappointed how she handles her mod pages and relationship through Nexus. Looks like Nexus is just a great tools to spread mods to compare with http://geekdominthenorth.net/

 

Does everything can be managed in a nicer way ? Less harsh. It would be good.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Ombragine

[Dark0ne]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

[JimboUK]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495, #46409765 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

Dark0ne wrote:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

@wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities.

[StankyDoge]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495, #46409765, #46410010 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

Dark0ne wrote:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

jim_uk wrote: @wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities.

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites?

Obviously my experience using the site. Kind of a pointless question, don't you think?

EDIT: Sorry if that came off as hostile, by the way. Didn't intend that.

Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did?

Why is that relevant? Obviously no experience, and average knowledge about the topic.

If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

Yes, I would, actually. It's a very hyperbolic expression to get across a general idea. It's like someone calling a moderator who deletes posts for being in the wrong forum the "fun police". Obviously that person is not a member of law enforcement. Obviously they're not trying to kill your fun. It's an exaggerated expression, just not on the same level as this. As for the Godwin's law bit, I don't see how that's relevant at all, but it's nice to know.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

I haven't seen as much moderator presence on the Nexus lately, so fair enough.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Fair enough, though I personally disagree with a mod author having the ability to censor free speech simply because they can't handle it. Nobody should feel like they can't share their thoughts (so long as it's constructive). We may just have to agree to disagree due to a difference in core opinions on the topic.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

Honestly? I think I kind of just had a brainfart while typing. Ranting while tired is confusing. The point before that is what I had intended, I think I just stopped thinking for a moment and contradicted it like a moron. :(

I'll edit it with a strikethrough and a reason why but leave it so I don't look like I'm editing s#*&#33; out of my post for the sake of looking less stupid.

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod. Bringing up skimpy mods again, some people may find a type of robe that shows the character's thighs and cleavage but covers the rest and isn't clearly 'sexualized' gear (IE something like BDSM or clearly intended to look like a sexy armor set) to be fine, whereas others may consider to be super skimpy. Thus, the mod author won't tag that as skimpy and it won't get filtered out. Vice versa, a mod that genuinely *isn't* considered to be skimpy by some will be tagged as skimpy and will be filtered out, leaving you oblivious to it ever having existed. The only way I know how to solve this issue is to block a mod author, and that's more of a band-aid than a solution, and, on top of that, if that mod author suddenly does a 180 and releases something right up your alley, you won't even know. If there's something I'm missing here, please let me know as this issue has been my single biggest issue with the Nexus for years.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it.

Yeah, and I'm sure a lot of people *dislike* it too, but because it's what's popular, it's what people will create if they're looking for recognition. See: social media in general. You have to at least acknowledge that a fair amount of a Mod Author sharing their mods is for the recognition of it. They could just as keep it to themselves and upload the mod to a private area in case it's lost.

What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

First off, I want to clarify something. When I say a "thumbs down" type system, I don't mean a system where you click a button similar to an endorse button and it counts towards any sort of true effect on the mod (IE having it less likely to be hidden, hurting its chances of going to the hot files, or becoming a top file, etc). Literally no effect whatsoever on that for the mod. I mean a system that's displayed similar to "Total Downloads", which is there *purely* as a visual statistic. Nothing more. The positive effect? People who disagree with the mod and would like to voice their opinion can do so, even if they're unconstructive about it. On top of being able to simply block an author, I feel like this'd cause a lot of the older, more salty people of the community who aren't happy with it ease up a bit now that they have a way to actually voice what they feel. Being the Nexus, I figure it'd probably be best to allow the mod author to *hide* this statistic, as I know it'd discourage some modders. It'd just be a nice feature, is all.

As for the analogy, if it affected the statistics of that article and it was a well-written article with effort put into it, sure, that's shitty. But the key point there is if it effects the statistics. If it doesn't, you have *every right* to downvote that article. Why? Because other people who dislike those types of articles will do the same, and newer people writing articles, if they want to, will potentially write an article that appeals to what people want, thus making more people happy. The football fans will keep their articles (As that's just a silly statistic and they enjoy doing what they do), and the other writers who want to appeal more to what seems popular (or are just seeking recognition) will write the rugby/cricket articles. Hopefully that actually *explained* what I'm trying to say, as I'm starting to feel as if I'm just bad at illustrating my point (and I don't mean that in a hostile way, btw.)

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

So rather than people having a (optionally removable) harmless way of expressing distaste without actually attacking anyone, you'd rather they are completely silent and thus the opinion of what is popular never really shifts? I mean, really. How long has skimpy armor mods been a popular thing for Beth games? Don't you think, in all these years, the general opinion has shifted a bit? Yet nobody is allowed to express this, and thus that's still one of the most popular genre of mods on the Nexus, so much so that for Skyrim, it's almost difficult to find non-skimpy mods (if you, like me, have issues with overly specific tastes, borderline OCD-level type s#*&#33; where the smallest detail can ruin it) because your choices are to endlessly wade through thousands, maybe even tens of thousands of mods looking for something, or filter out a lot of these options, most likely filtering out a potential choice for yourself.

That kind of loops back to my previous point, which, again, the conclusion of that is "Maybe I'm doing something wrong, and if I am, let me know.".

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

I agree the *quality* of the mods would not improve, or if it did, it'd be marginal at best. I'm saying that I think a genre shift could occur, or at least more genres will become a bit more popular and thus everyone will be happy.

Though, again, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. Ultimately it's your site and what I say doesn't really matter, you'll run it how you want, and that's fine. I just like being able to voice my opinion to *hopefully* see change implemented, even if that opinion could actually be harmful (and yes, I do understand how the concept of downvoting mods could be abused). It's like how venting to a friend can help you feel better. Just a bit salty with seeing the state of Nexus mods in general over the years. It seems like some things improve, like the Nexus moderators (Which I'll admit, I was wrong about. They HAVE improved, I just haven't noticed it as I don't go out of my way to look for it, which is, in itself, a testament to how it's improved.), while at the same time some things stagnate (Like the current popular genre of mods, which has remained the same for a very long time) Edited January 8, 2017 by wolfrevan5555

[Druundev]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495, #46409765, #46410010, #46411275 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb. (EDIT: Brainfart, contradicted what I had just said after stating what I had meant. My bad. Leaving it there with a strikethrough to indicate what part it was, though.)

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

Dark0ne wrote:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

jim_uk wrote: @wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities.

wolfrevan5555 wrote:

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites?

Obviously my experience using the site. Kind of a pointless question, don't you think?

EDIT: Sorry if that came off as hostile, by the way. Didn't intend that.

Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did?

Why is that relevant? Obviously no experience, and average knowledge about the topic.

If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

Yes, I would, actually. It's a very hyperbolic expression to get across a general idea. It's like someone calling a moderator who deletes posts for being in the wrong forum the "fun police". Obviously that person is not a member of law enforcement. Obviously they're not trying to kill your fun. It's an exaggerated expression, just not on the same level as this. As for the Godwin's law bit, I don't see how that's relevant at all, but it's nice to know.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

I haven't seen as much moderator presence on the Nexus lately, so fair enough.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Fair enough, though I personally disagree with a mod author having the ability to censor free speech simply because they can't handle it. Nobody should feel like they can't share their thoughts (so long as it's constructive). We may just have to agree to disagree due to a difference in core opinions on the topic.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

Honestly? I think I kind of just had a brainfart while typing. Ranting while tired is confusing. The point before that is what I had intended, I think I just stopped thinking for a moment and contradicted it like a moron. :(

I'll edit it with a strikethrough and a reason why but leave it so I don't look like I'm editing s#*&#33; out of my post for the sake of looking less stupid.

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod. Bringing up skimpy mods again, some people may find a type of robe that shows the character's thighs and cleavage but covers the rest and isn't clearly 'sexualized' gear (IE something like BDSM or clearly intended to look like a sexy armor set) to be fine, whereas others may consider to be super skimpy. Thus, the mod author won't tag that as skimpy and it won't get filtered out. Vice versa, a mod that genuinely *isn't* considered to be skimpy by some will be tagged as skimpy and will be filtered out, leaving you oblivious to it ever having existed. The only way I know how to solve this issue is to block a mod author, and that's more of a band-aid than a solution, and, on top of that, if that mod author suddenly does a 180 and releases something right up your alley, you won't even know. If there's something I'm missing here, please let me know as this issue has been my single biggest issue with the Nexus for years.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it.

Yeah, and I'm sure a lot of people *dislike* it too, but because it's what's popular, it's what people will create if they're looking for recognition. See: social media in general. You have to at least acknowledge that a fair amount of a Mod Author sharing their mods is for the recognition of it. They could just as keep it to themselves and upload the mod to a private area in case it's lost.

What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

First off, I want to clarify something. When I say a "thumbs down" type system, I don't mean a system where you click a button similar to an endorse button and it counts towards any sort of true effect on the mod (IE having it less likely to be hidden, hurting its chances of going to the hot files, or becoming a top file, etc). Literally no effect whatsoever on that for the mod. I mean a system that's displayed similar to "Total Downloads", which is there *purely* as a visual statistic. Nothing more. The positive effect? People who disagree with the mod and would like to voice their opinion can do so, even if they're unconstructive about it. On top of being able to simply block an author, I feel like this'd cause a lot of the older, more salty people of the community who aren't happy with it ease up a bit now that they have a way to actually voice what they feel. Being the Nexus, I figure it'd probably be best to allow the mod author to *hide* this statistic, as I know it'd discourage some modders. It'd just be a nice feature, is all.

As for the analogy, if it affected the statistics of that article and it was a well-written article with effort put into it, sure, that's shitty. But the key point there is if it effects the statistics. If it doesn't, you have *every right* to downvote that article. Why? Because other people who dislike those types of articles will do the same, and newer people writing articles, if they want to, will potentially write an article that appeals to what people want, thus making more people happy. The football fans will keep their articles (As that's just a silly statistic and they enjoy doing what they do), and the other writers who want to appeal more to what seems popular (or are just seeking recognition) will write the rugby/cricket articles. Hopefully that actually *explained* what I'm trying to say, as I'm starting to feel as if I'm just bad at illustrating my point (and I don't mean that in a hostile way, btw.)

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

So rather than people having a (optionally removable) harmless way of expressing distaste without actually attacking anyone, you'd rather they are completely silent and thus the opinion of what is popular never really shifts? I mean, really. How long has skimpy armor mods been a popular thing for Beth games? Don't you think, in all these years, the general opinion has shifted a bit? Yet nobody is allowed to express this, and thus that's still one of the most popular genre of mods on the Nexus, so much so that for Skyrim, it's almost difficult to find non-skimpy mods (if you, like me, have issues with overly specific tastes, borderline OCD-level type s#*&#33; where the smallest detail can ruin it) because your choices are to endlessly wade through thousands, maybe even tens of thousands of mods looking for something, or filter out a lot of these options, most likely filtering out a potential choice for yourself.

That kind of loops back to my previous point, which, again, the conclusion of that is "Maybe I'm doing something wrong, and if I am, let me know.".

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

I agree the *quality* of the mods would not improve, or if it did, it'd be marginal at best. I'm saying that I think a genre shift could occur, or at least more genres will become a bit more popular and thus everyone will be happy.

Though, again, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. Ultimately it's your site and what I say doesn't really matter, you'll run it how you want, and that's fine. I just like being able to voice my opinion to *hopefully* see change implemented, even if that opinion could actually be harmful (and yes, I do understand how the concept of downvoting mods could be abused). It's like how venting to a friend can help you feel better. Just a bit salty with seeing the state of Nexus mods in general over the years. It seems like some things improve, like the Nexus moderators (Which I'll admit, I was wrong about. They HAVE improved, I just haven't noticed it as I don't go out of my way to look for it, which is, in itself, a testament to how it's improved.), while at the same time some things stagnate (Like the current popular genre of mods, which has remained the same for a very long time)

I can tell you by experience at some point you just give up on the comment sections here, even the Youtube comment section cant compare to the ignorance, rudeness and down right stupidity of some people on here.

[JimboUK]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495, #46409765, #46410010, #46411275, #46412080, #46413505, #46417005, #46418845, #46423325, #46427465 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb. (EDIT: Brainfart, contradicted what I had just said after stating what I had meant. My bad. Leaving it there with a strikethrough to indicate what part it was, though.)

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

Dark0ne wrote:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

jim_uk wrote: @wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities.

wolfrevan5555 wrote:

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites?

Obviously my experience using the site. Kind of a pointless question, don't you think?

EDIT: Sorry if that came off as hostile, by the way. Didn't intend that.

Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did?

Why is that relevant? Obviously no experience, and average knowledge about the topic.

If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

Yes, I would, actually. It's a very hyperbolic expression to get across a general idea. It's like someone calling a moderator who deletes posts for being in the wrong forum the "fun police". Obviously that person is not a member of law enforcement. Obviously they're not trying to kill your fun. It's an exaggerated expression, just not on the same level as this. As for the Godwin's law bit, I don't see how that's relevant at all, but it's nice to know.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

I haven't seen as much moderator presence on the Nexus lately, so fair enough.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Fair enough, though I personally disagree with a mod author having the ability to censor free speech simply because they can't handle it. Nobody should feel like they can't share their thoughts (so long as it's constructive). We may just have to agree to disagree due to a difference in core opinions on the topic.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

Honestly? I think I kind of just had a brainfart while typing. Ranting while tired is confusing. The point before that is what I had intended, I think I just stopped thinking for a moment and contradicted it like a moron. :(

I'll edit it with a strikethrough and a reason why but leave it so I don't look like I'm editing s#*&#33; out of my post for the sake of looking less stupid.

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod. Bringing up skimpy mods again, some people may find a type of robe that shows the character's thighs and cleavage but covers the rest and isn't clearly 'sexualized' gear (IE something like BDSM or clearly intended to look like a sexy armor set) to be fine, whereas others may consider to be super skimpy. Thus, the mod author won't tag that as skimpy and it won't get filtered out. Vice versa, a mod that genuinely *isn't* considered to be skimpy by some will be tagged as skimpy and will be filtered out, leaving you oblivious to it ever having existed. The only way I know how to solve this issue is to block a mod author, and that's more of a band-aid than a solution, and, on top of that, if that mod author suddenly does a 180 and releases something right up your alley, you won't even know. If there's something I'm missing here, please let me know as this issue has been my single biggest issue with the Nexus for years.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it.

Yeah, and I'm sure a lot of people *dislike* it too, but because it's what's popular, it's what people will create if they're looking for recognition. See: social media in general. You have to at least acknowledge that a fair amount of a Mod Author sharing their mods is for the recognition of it. They could just as keep it to themselves and upload the mod to a private area in case it's lost.

What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

First off, I want to clarify something. When I say a "thumbs down" type system, I don't mean a system where you click a button similar to an endorse button and it counts towards any sort of true effect on the mod (IE having it less likely to be hidden, hurting its chances of going to the hot files, or becoming a top file, etc). Literally no effect whatsoever on that for the mod. I mean a system that's displayed similar to "Total Downloads", which is there *purely* as a visual statistic. Nothing more. The positive effect? People who disagree with the mod and would like to voice their opinion can do so, even if they're unconstructive about it. On top of being able to simply block an author, I feel like this'd cause a lot of the older, more salty people of the community who aren't happy with it ease up a bit now that they have a way to actually voice what they feel. Being the Nexus, I figure it'd probably be best to allow the mod author to *hide* this statistic, as I know it'd discourage some modders. It'd just be a nice feature, is all.

As for the analogy, if it affected the statistics of that article and it was a well-written article with effort put into it, sure, that's shitty. But the key point there is if it effects the statistics. If it doesn't, you have *every right* to downvote that article. Why? Because other people who dislike those types of articles will do the same, and newer people writing articles, if they want to, will potentially write an article that appeals to what people want, thus making more people happy. The football fans will keep their articles (As that's just a silly statistic and they enjoy doing what they do), and the other writers who want to appeal more to what seems popular (or are just seeking recognition) will write the rugby/cricket articles. Hopefully that actually *explained* what I'm trying to say, as I'm starting to feel as if I'm just bad at illustrating my point (and I don't mean that in a hostile way, btw.)

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

So rather than people having a (optionally removable) harmless way of expressing distaste without actually attacking anyone, you'd rather they are completely silent and thus the opinion of what is popular never really shifts? I mean, really. How long has skimpy armor mods been a popular thing for Beth games? Don't you think, in all these years, the general opinion has shifted a bit? Yet nobody is allowed to express this, and thus that's still one of the most popular genre of mods on the Nexus, so much so that for Skyrim, it's almost difficult to find non-skimpy mods (if you, like me, have issues with overly specific tastes, borderline OCD-level type s#*&#33; where the smallest detail can ruin it) because your choices are to endlessly wade through thousands, maybe even tens of thousands of mods looking for something, or filter out a lot of these options, most likely filtering out a potential choice for yourself.

That kind of loops back to my previous point, which, again, the conclusion of that is "Maybe I'm doing something wrong, and if I am, let me know.".

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

I agree the *quality* of the mods would not improve, or if it did, it'd be marginal at best. I'm saying that I think a genre shift could occur, or at least more genres will become a bit more popular and thus everyone will be happy.

Though, again, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. Ultimately it's your site and what I say doesn't really matter, you'll run it how you want, and that's fine. I just like being able to voice my opinion to *hopefully* see change implemented, even if that opinion could actually be harmful (and yes, I do understand how the concept of downvoting mods could be abused). It's like how venting to a friend can help you feel better. Just a bit salty with seeing the state of Nexus mods in general over the years. It seems like some things improve, like the Nexus moderators (Which I'll admit, I was wrong about. They HAVE improved, I just haven't noticed it as I don't go out of my way to look for it, which is, in itself, a testament to how it's improved.), while at the same time some things stagnate (Like the current popular genre of mods, which has remained the same for a very long time)

Druundev wrote: I can tell you by experience at some point you just give up on the comment sections here, even the Youtube comment section cant compare to the ignorance, rudeness and down right stupidity of some people on here.

FatSniper wrote: Oh boy, just pwnd! xD

Nofsdad wrote: She banned me and I've never had any kind of interaction with her, never commented or even used any of her mods, no contact with her whatsoever.

The Vampire Dante wrote:
@Nofsdad: Which is impossible.

You need to have had some interaction on one of her pages at some point, since the block tools an author uses are only accessible via the comments section.

tonycubed2 wrote: I agree with this. I have never banned anyone for telling me in a respectful way how my mod(s) fail. It stings. Yes. But I honestly thank them because more often than not the move improves after I address the issue. My mod only improves when someone tells me something is wrong, not when they love the mod the way it is.

( jim_uk wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities)

Arthmoor wrote: @wolfrevan5555

Thumbs down, comment voting, 1-10 rankings, requiring an accompanying comment with a rating, etc. It's all been tried. It all got trolled to hell and back. That's why those things aren't done here. You''d think that you having been here since 2008 you'd know that, but since you spent that time contributing absolutely nothing....

@wolfrevan5555 Popular mods are popular because people like them and people are not going to change their preferences because a few self entitled users want them to. Authors are not there to make what you want, they make what they want and then share it, if you want things tailored to your liking then make them yourself, it's not that hard.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod.

You've tagged one file in seven years, you're in no position to criticise authors for something you can't be bothered to do yourself, same with mod content, you've not added one file or even an image, in fact you've contributed bugger all to the site, all you do is take and then have the nerve to make demands of those who do contribute. Edited January 8, 2017 by jim_uk

[FatSniper]

In response to post #46364080. #46364325, #46367235, #46368205, #46369815, #46369930, #46370390, #46374095, #46374390, #46374475, #46374920, #46376420, #46377285, #46378940, #46379215, #46386540, #46389205, #46389595, #46389810, #46392420, #46393260, #46397745, #46399790, #46400835, #46401120, #46401925, #46402520, #46409160, #46409495, #46409765, #46410010, #46411275, #46412080, #46412965 are all replies on the same post.

Kevin843 wrote: I love your mods, just wish you were a little nicer in the comments

RaffTheSweetling wrote: I agree. Talent and arrogance seem to go hand-in-hand sometimes.

LanceHolland90 wrote: Shes a very popular modder and is constantly barraged by stupid questions. Over the years it has taken it's toll - and the result is what you experience today.

I am no fanboy, but I respect her work, and as you have so eloquently put, talent and arrogance do often go hand in hand.

Kastrenzo wrote: Nah, that's no excuse to be arrogant with everyone, Make mention of her attitude and she presses the safe space button and bans you from her content.

I guess it's too bad for her that you can only do it to someone once, Someone's on a power trip.

It's refreshing to see that so many others, whether just snide comments or genuine distaste for the person, acknowledge what she is.

Ombragine wrote: Indeed

I have experimented this with her. I posted a comment about her attitude because her answer to someone was very harsh and sadly i got a ban from her content.

This is not a good way.

Viorotica wrote: Yeah she's like a less dickish version of DDProductions, and we all know what EVENTUALLY happened to him.

But whatever, no excuses for a bad attitude really, just because some people act like bellends doesn't mean you should treat anyone with even any slightly negativity like one.

Kastrenzo wrote: In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Thats what's always kind of astonished me about Elinora, first off was how completely hostile she is to the slightest bit of criticism, and how she takes advantage of The Nexus' complete lack of involvement and interference with individual bans from an authors content,


in other words. An author can choose to ban individuals from their stuff. and Nexus won't do anything about it, and they say you have to sort it out with them. She takes full advantage of that and bounces anyone who even so much as breathes funny on her it seems.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

I'm just really surprised to see that she is STILL doing it.

Purgey wrote: I'm liking some of the people here :)

jim_uk wrote: @Kastrenzo You are not a customer or consumer, she's willingly sharing something she created for free, she is under no obligation to put up with people making demands, whining and generally being arsehats. As for bans, the mods belong to the author and if they don't want an certain individual having access to their mods then that is their right.

Ethreon wrote: Whether you like the modder or not, best would be to not start a huge argument here about it. Eh?

Dark0ne wrote: If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

In most other mediums on the internet, like a store front for example, like ebay. when the customers or consumers are being harrassed and insulted, the seller, provider, creator, whatever, normally gets punished.

Elianora isn't selling anything, so your analogy is completely moot. The Nexus is not a storefront. It's not a seller/consumer environment -- at all. If it was then yes, of course, there would need to be some accountability and I'm sure Elianora and others would understand that and revise how they choose to respond to the more negative elements of the community more accordingly. But it's not, so there's no point even discussing that line of thought.

Relevant analogies to the Nexus are free content distribution platforms. YouTube, Facebook, Twitter and so on. Guess what they all have in common with the Nexus? They provide the original authors of content with the tools to moderate their own content how they see fit.

And, I'm not grumbling about getting my ban, I really could care less. There's never been anything she's made that ever remotely interested me, and I'll gladly take a personal ban if it means higlighting some extremley cancerous behaivor from a "top modder"

If you don't care about her content, how did you even manage to get a ban? What were you doing on her pages in the first place? Seems really silly to me. Why waste your time if you don't care? That's a rhetorical question, really. You obviously do care, else you wouldn't be mentioning it here trying to "out" her. So lets just move on, and stop being silly.

LethalThreat wrote: "If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it." A rule that only applies to users and not authors. I don't understand why authors are given a free pass and are allowed to be assholes to their users while the users are the ones to get punished. There's no reason authors can't be a little more respectful and less rude to their users. If "you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it" should be reminded to anyone, be sure to remind the authors too. No reason for the rudeness, if the users get on their nerves it isn't hard to ignore them or delete the comment. You'd think they would be more kind and helpful, it's unfortunate that finding a kind and helpful author here is like finding a needle in a haystack.

I suppose the most simple solution for common users is to not engage with people here anymore, just get your mods and run - because no matter what, it will always be their fault. Sad to see this is where we're at now.

Then again, no one can really do anything here. Authors will continue to be arrogant asses, users will continue to be ignorant asses. Just a shame the users get a punch in the face for something harmless while authors are given a trophy for being pricks.

*Not applied to all authors. Sadly the popular and arrogant authors have given the reputation for all mod authors (or popular users) to be arrogant assholes too. Which not all of us are!

Ethreon wrote: Not applying to 95% of the userbase here, author or user. Trying to generalize further involves a lot of ignorance from the person generalizing.

jim_uk wrote: Mod authors are human beings, they're not machines who can keep ignoring all the crap some have to put up with.

Someone puts days, weeks or even months into making a mod, hundreds of hours of unpaid work could have gone into it, they upload it and what do they get? I want this, I want that, I don't like this, I don't like that, do this, do that, questions from idiots who haven't read the readme or those so thick they have to call customer services to get instructions on how to turn their PCs on.

Most of us will only get annoying comments under our files once in a blue moon and it's easy to deal with that, the major modders get a lot more and it's enough wear anyone down.

The rise of automated tools like NMM have seen a decline in the knowledge of the average user, they don't have to learn so they don't bother, they shove more and more stuff into their games until it breaks, then they blame the modders. There was a time when users could make simple adjustments to mods or fix mods themselves, these days they throw a hissy fit at the author and demand the author does it.

Ombragine wrote: A lot of users are not assholes and a lot of authors are really kindly and are doing their best to enhance experience with all what they do for end users.

This is apply to a small part, always same people i like to say and it is really fun to see that this applies between authors themself too.

And, sadly, she is inside. A good way will be for her to change all her mod pages and remove agressive contains, disclamers, etc.

Look yourself : http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/2829/? and it is not the only one.

It only gives a bad picture for both, authors and users. Is it good to be like that ?

EMS60 wrote: @jim-uk: Thanks. Your comment should be highlighted.

phantompally76 wrote: It's no secret that users and authors are subject to two completely different sets of rules and guidelines on this site. Several of the most "prolific" authors are habitual offenders of policies that would result in permabans for any single user, yet they are shielded by the site owner and moderators, because those authors generate clicks (ad revenue) for the site. It's a massively hypocritical and transparent double-standard.

There are exceptions, of course. Not every single "prolific" mod author is a jerk. I would never lump someone like Chesko in that category, because he goes out of his way to be courteous, even when a user is trying to flame him. Even at his worst (which rarely happens), he still treats people the way I can only imagine he wants to be treated himself.

A philosophy I wish other mod authors would adapt. Users as well, if I'm honest.

Kastrenzo wrote: Yeah no, I'm not going to accept that authors can have free reign to be rude and obnoxious where users have to kiss their feet and that we should feel thankful for their mods when it comes at the cost of them throwing fits and getting away with it.

@ Dark0ne

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Also, she banned me from her page after I looked at one of her compliation mods and made a comment on her attitide. AFTER that, I couldnt care less about her content.

So I insist, I don't really care. I had forgotten she existed until this came up, and when I saw others complaining that she's a toxic individual. I thought I'd jump on the bandwagon too.


All in all, I saw a comment someone made about thinking most people should just treat Nexus as a "pick up and go", get your mods and get out, because the community here is surprising toxic. I'm still laughing at that guy who shut down all of his mods to Protest Donald Trump during the US election on the Skyrim Nexus

Kastrenzo wrote: @Kevin Careful now, you're speaking a lot of truth. wouldn't want the law to take notice.


@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

Arthmoor wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Maybe when people are paying for the content they can expect this, but not before.

Dark0ne wrote: No. A seller/buyer relationship is nowhere near the same relationship as a mod author/mod user relationship. Nowhere near at all. The fact you think they are the same speaks volumes on the issues you're trying to raise here.

@Dark0ne and moderation in general - I think you really just need to acknowledge, whether to yourself, or to the public, that you decided to feature a very controversial author. That's really all that this is.

We feature, and shall continue to feature, mod authors from all different attitudes, outlooks, creeds, classes, cultures, countries and so on and so forth. Widely referred to as "human beings" and "people" in the real world.

I'm sorry you're upset over the fact we've chosen to feature a mod author you personally disagree with. If our job was to find mod authors that everyone in this community liked/got on well with/enjoyed and used all the work they did then we wouldn't be doing any features at all. You'll note that we've interviewed plenty of mod authors over the past few months, and they've all been quite unique and different personalities.

jim_uk wrote:

The analogy to a seller/buyer, still applies. just with author/end user

Then ask the author for a refund, get the nothing whatsoever you paid her back.

RetroDaddy wrote: Really, Y'all need to understand the difference between arrogance and confidence. Being a top modder, she gets so many comments by people that don't read available posted information before asking questions already covered. It gets really trying to maintain civility, so put your frustration not on the author but the ones who are too lazy to read.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: @Dark0ne

Just wanna reply to this real quick.

>If you have nothing nice to say, then don't say it. Basically the founding principle of the Nexus. Some of you guys seem to have forgotten that. I'll be moderating these comments as necessary.

There's a difference between hating on something and criticizing. The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience) where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic. I understand not wanting your comments to devolve into unrewarding shithole where you go to to simply offer criticism and report bugs and such and never *thank* the author, instead having it as a mostly positive place, but the way the Nexus handles comment sections is just a complete joke. Punishment for being constructive is dumb. Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb. (EDIT: Brainfart, contradicted what I had just said after stating what I had meant. My bad. Leaving it there with a strikethrough to indicate what part it was, though.)

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor). If people could simply click a "thumbs down" button to express distaste (and if they commented, the "thumbs down" icon would be attached to that comment to indicate what their opinion is) while not worrying about punishment, the quality of mods would greatly improve and the community would become a lot less tense overall. Then again, from the years I've been on the Nexus I've seen it as being this type of horrifying "forced smile" type thing. You have to be positive. You have to be appreciative. Gotta keep that up, can't actually be honest with anything or you could be punished.

Also, sorry about the oversized rant. Gonna add a TL;DR for convenience.

TL;DR People need to learn the difference between useless criticism and constructive criticism. Being able to constructively criticize a mod (respectfully) would be very useful and would help to improve the quality of mods on the Nexus, and, in my opinion, help some of the "salty Nexus vets" feel a bit better as they can finally voice their opinions without feeling like they might be persecuted for it. A simple "Thumbs Down" type system, with the thumbs down symbol tied to your comment, I think would help to fix this and would greatly help to show the general consensus on some types of mods, something I feel is woefully lacking due to the fear of being punished.

Madcat221 wrote: Thumbs-down voting option was tried... it was abused. Hence, why it's not around here anymore.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: Did it hide mods or anything? I figured having it more as a background thing that doesn't effect mod visibility or anything, just allows people to display their opinion freely. Shouldn't negatively impact the mod.

Ethreon wrote: tl;dr of your comment
- we don't need dislike features, this is not facebook.
- constructive criticism is not deleted (or very rare cases)
- half of it is nonsense.

wolfrevan5555 wrote: TL;DR means "Too Long, Didn't Read". It's used on the internet to paraphrase a long-winded statement. That was called a "reply". You should use that thing called Google. It'll help you understand these things better.

Ethreon wrote: :rolleyes:

Dark0ne wrote:

The Nexus is fond of running a borderline Nazi-Germany type system (in my experience)

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites? Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did? If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

where if you don't circle-jerk a mod 100%, and instead appreciate the mod but offer *CONSTRUCTIVE* Criticism (IE: Good mod, but I have a problem with <X> and would recommend <Y> as a solution), you're likely to get bashed and *potentially* even banned. Modders turning their comments into safespaces because any sort of constructive criticism "triggers" them is pretty pathetic.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Punishment for being a shithead who bashes someone or unconstructively bashes the mod is dumb.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

I honestly feel like a sort of "thumbs down" system would really help to fix this problem. If people disagree with a mod *so much* and are so sick and tired of seeing that type of mod, they're going to want their voices heard. I think you'd be surprised to hear how many people hate some genres of mods but *can't* voice their opinions on the matter for fear of the banhammer, thus they're stuck in a repetitive cycle of seeing hated mods endlessly and other modders seeing these mods "doing well" because nobody bashes them, thus deciding to make those types of mods (See: Skimpy armor).

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it. What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

jim_uk wrote: @wolfrevan5555 I've never seen anyone banned for actual constructive criticism, the problem is too few know what constructive criticism is including yourself, telling someone you hate the type of mod they've made is not constructive, if you don't like a type of mod an author makes then block that author, their mods will no longer be visible to you thus protecting your delicate sensibilities.

wolfrevan5555 wrote:

Your experience of Nazi Germany, or your experience of using these sites?

Obviously my experience using the site. Kind of a pointless question, don't you think?

EDIT: Sorry if that came off as hostile, by the way. Didn't intend that.

Do you have any experience or knowledge of the things Nazi Germany did?

Why is that relevant? Obviously no experience, and average knowledge about the topic.

If you did, you wouldn't be using that reference. You should also look up Godwin's Law.

Yes, I would, actually. It's a very hyperbolic expression to get across a general idea. It's like someone calling a moderator who deletes posts for being in the wrong forum the "fun police". Obviously that person is not a member of law enforcement. Obviously they're not trying to kill your fun. It's an exaggerated expression, just not on the same level as this. As for the Godwin's law bit, I don't see how that's relevant at all, but it's nice to know.

Now you need to disconnect between Nexus moderation, that is, moderation performed by official staff members of the Nexus, and mod author moderation, that is, moderation done by mod authors on their own files and comment sections.

I haven't seen as much moderator presence on the Nexus lately, so fair enough.

The former, Nexus moderation, will not warn or ban for providing valid constructive criticism. It gets reported from time to time by disgruntled people that we do, but find me a warning or ban from the past two years where this has happened and I will happily review it. This is normally the first trip-up on these sorts of conversations; allegations are made, but they're never backed up by any actual proof or the proof provided is 4 - 8 years old now and yet people are talking as though we still make the same mistakes of the past. Lets live in the now.

The latter, the mod authors, have been given almost free reign to moderate their own files and comments how they see fit. In this situation, you're more than welcome to form your own opinions towards how mod authors handle their own moderation of their files. If you feel that a mod author's attitude is below you or you don't like it, it follows our very simple Nexus rule of "If you don't like it, don't use it". It's oh so simple. But a lot of people feel it's somehow their right to call out mod authors publicly that they disagree with, like they're entitled to tell mod authors how they should and should not do things.

I disagree.

Fair enough, though I personally disagree with a mod author having the ability to censor free speech simply because they can't handle it. Nobody should feel like they can't share their thoughts (so long as it's constructive). We may just have to agree to disagree due to a difference in core opinions on the topic.

Say what? You don't think people should be punished for being a "shithead who bashes someone"? I feel like the rest of what you're saying is pointless if you believe that...

Honestly? I think I kind of just had a brainfart while typing. Ranting while tired is confusing. The point before that is what I had intended, I think I just stopped thinking for a moment and contradicted it like a moron. :(

I'll edit it with a strikethrough and a reason why but leave it so I don't look like I'm editing s#*&#33; out of my post for the sake of looking less stupid.

I feel like you're using a version of Nexus Mods from 2010.

If you don't like an entire genre of mods, you should be using our content blocking system to remove as many of them as possible from your view. The tools exist, you just need to use them.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod. Bringing up skimpy mods again, some people may find a type of robe that shows the character's thighs and cleavage but covers the rest and isn't clearly 'sexualized' gear (IE something like BDSM or clearly intended to look like a sexy armor set) to be fine, whereas others may consider to be super skimpy. Thus, the mod author won't tag that as skimpy and it won't get filtered out. Vice versa, a mod that genuinely *isn't* considered to be skimpy by some will be tagged as skimpy and will be filtered out, leaving you oblivious to it ever having existed. The only way I know how to solve this issue is to block a mod author, and that's more of a band-aid than a solution, and, on top of that, if that mod author suddenly does a 180 and releases something right up your alley, you won't even know. If there's something I'm missing here, please let me know as this issue has been my single biggest issue with the Nexus for years.

If a genre of mods is popular, to use your example, "skimpy armour", then it's popular for a reason. It doesn't get popular unless lots of people like it.

Yeah, and I'm sure a lot of people *dislike* it too, but because it's what's popular, it's what people will create if they're looking for recognition. See: social media in general. You have to at least acknowledge that a fair amount of a Mod Author sharing their mods is for the recognition of it. They could just as keep it to themselves and upload the mod to a private area in case it's lost.

What positive effect is created by you having the ability to tell other people who do like that genre of mods that you don't like that genre of mods have on the community? What role does that fulfil? It'd be like going on to a sports website and downvoting any article about football because you don't like football, you like rugby and cricket. It makes no sense. It has no practical use to anyone other than your misplaced need to tell other people you dislike something that they like.

First off, I want to clarify something. When I say a "thumbs down" type system, I don't mean a system where you click a button similar to an endorse button and it counts towards any sort of true effect on the mod (IE having it less likely to be hidden, hurting its chances of going to the hot files, or becoming a top file, etc). Literally no effect whatsoever on that for the mod. I mean a system that's displayed similar to "Total Downloads", which is there *purely* as a visual statistic. Nothing more. The positive effect? People who disagree with the mod and would like to voice their opinion can do so, even if they're unconstructive about it. On top of being able to simply block an author, I feel like this'd cause a lot of the older, more salty people of the community who aren't happy with it ease up a bit now that they have a way to actually voice what they feel. Being the Nexus, I figure it'd probably be best to allow the mod author to *hide* this statistic, as I know it'd discourage some modders. It'd just be a nice feature, is all.

As for the analogy, if it affected the statistics of that article and it was a well-written article with effort put into it, sure, that's shitty. But the key point there is if it effects the statistics. If it doesn't, you have *every right* to downvote that article. Why? Because other people who dislike those types of articles will do the same, and newer people writing articles, if they want to, will potentially write an article that appeals to what people want, thus making more people happy. The football fans will keep their articles (As that's just a silly statistic and they enjoy doing what they do), and the other writers who want to appeal more to what seems popular (or are just seeking recognition) will write the rugby/cricket articles. Hopefully that actually *explained* what I'm trying to say, as I'm starting to feel as if I'm just bad at illustrating my point (and I don't mean that in a hostile way, btw.)

You don't need to downvote content you don't like. That's really silly. You need to block it, then ignore it.

So rather than people having a (optionally removable) harmless way of expressing distaste without actually attacking anyone, you'd rather they are completely silent and thus the opinion of what is popular never really shifts? I mean, really. How long has skimpy armor mods been a popular thing for Beth games? Don't you think, in all these years, the general opinion has shifted a bit? Yet nobody is allowed to express this, and thus that's still one of the most popular genre of mods on the Nexus, so much so that for Skyrim, it's almost difficult to find non-skimpy mods (if you, like me, have issues with overly specific tastes, borderline OCD-level type s#*&#33; where the smallest detail can ruin it) because your choices are to endlessly wade through thousands, maybe even tens of thousands of mods looking for something, or filter out a lot of these options, most likely filtering out a potential choice for yourself.

That kind of loops back to my previous point, which, again, the conclusion of that is "Maybe I'm doing something wrong, and if I am, let me know.".

The quality of mods would most definitely NOT improve if people could say they disliked them for reasons as basic and puerile as "I don't like this genre of mods".

I agree the *quality* of the mods would not improve, or if it did, it'd be marginal at best. I'm saying that I think a genre shift could occur, or at least more genres will become a bit more popular and thus everyone will be happy.

Though, again, I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. Ultimately it's your site and what I say doesn't really matter, you'll run it how you want, and that's fine. I just like being able to voice my opinion to *hopefully* see change implemented, even if that opinion could actually be harmful (and yes, I do understand how the concept of downvoting mods could be abused). It's like how venting to a friend can help you feel better. Just a bit salty with seeing the state of Nexus mods in general over the years. It seems like some things improve, like the Nexus moderators (Which I'll admit, I was wrong about. They HAVE improved, I just haven't noticed it as I don't go out of my way to look for it, which is, in itself, a testament to how it's improved.), while at the same time some things stagnate (Like the current popular genre of mods, which has remained the same for a very long time)

Druundev wrote: I can tell you by experience at some point you just give up on the comment sections here, even the Youtube comment section cant compare to the ignorance, rudeness and down right stupidity of some people on here.

jim_uk wrote: @wolfrevan5555 Popular mods are popular because people like them and people are not going to change their preferences because a few self entitled users want them to. Authors are not there to make what you want, they make what they want and then share it, if you want things tailored to your liking then them make them yourself, it's not that hard.

See, here's my issue with that system. Mod authors seem to have difficulty actually tagging their mod, mostly because it comes down to a matter of opinion with some genres of mod.

You've tagged one file in seven years, you're in no position to criticise authors for something you can't be bothered to do yourself, same with mod content, you've not added one file or even an image, in fact you've contributed bugger all to the site, all you do is take and then have the nerve to make demands of those who do contribute.

Oh boy, just pwnd! xD

[balwick]

My only complaint goes to Dark0ne, for referring to GMT as UTC, whatever the hell that means :p

 

Eli has every right to be a little short with people; the level of entitlement some people display is beyond belief, and couple that with a hail of "how do mod???" every time she releases something, and she would be in her rights to be a whole lot 'meaner'.

Edited January 8, 2017 by balwick

[Madcat221]

In response to post #46414175.

balwick wrote: My only complaint goes to Dark0ne, for referring to GMT as UTC, whatever the hell that means :p

Eli has every right to be a little short with people; the level of entitlement some people display is beyond belief, and couple that with a hail of "how do mod???" every time she releases something, and she would be in her rights to be a whole lot 'meaner'.

*deleted nevermind* Edited January 8, 2017 by Madcat221