NMM2 - Update and recruitment

[lued123]

In response to post #47827345.

Limbic2Node wrote: Sometimes the comments are more entertaining then the article. I don't mind that NMM2.0 is not going to be named NEMO or NMO or BOB or NOB etc. Well the latter two have not been vetoed so....
MO has over 3M DL's, not sure how many current users, personally I can't imagine using another utility because MO speaks to my "logic' in a way NMM does not. After the leaning curve with MO is done, I don't have to think about how the mods are going to be handled or will interact with each other,seeing the conflict on screen right down to what individual file is conflicting/overwriting is important in the decision making process when I'm organizing my mod list.
The NMM choices of 'yes to all-yes to folder- yes to mod-yes-no to all-no to folder-no to mod-no" have always made me feel like I'm guessing and perhaps losing out on all the mod's features. Those choices against "Merge-Replace-Rename-Cancel", these are clear concise actions. So maybe language is partially why I choose MO, and the virtual folder, and the on screen info windows...I could go on.

This is one of the few times I trust the devs, because of their past work, who they are and most importantly because they are a big part of the community.

The reason NMM asks whether you want to overwrite files for any conflict, while MO only asks if a mod is the same name, is that MO uses its virtual file system to let you adjust installation order in post. NMM doesn't have that, so it has to ask you to choose between files on the spot, rather than install them all and make your choices later. Really, that's as simple as the menu could be in NMM. It needs to let you pick and choose files, but it also needs to be possible to navigate the menu within a reasonable amount of time. MO just installs everything into its own unique folder and lets you pick what files get in later. It's a much better solution when it's not causing little niggling problems with certain types of mods. Hopefully its (optional) inclusion in NMM2 will encourage people to create workarounds or solutions to those little niggling problems. I really do like that power and freedom, but I also like the advantages of Skyrim in a 64bit engine and they just don't work super well together at the moment.

[lued123]

In response to post #47493580. #47500655, #47507910, #47533300, #47538495, #47549365, #47581735, #47582835, #47686910, #47688185, #47825835 are all replies on the same post.

Farvahar wrote: What I want to be able to do: have a person save their Skyrim configuration in toto and share it with other users as a file; the mod manager would then recreate that experience on my machine without all the hassle that goes with this currently. The manager would download the mods, set them up etc etc so as to create the same Skyrim experience as a mod master would be able to put together.

Their are guides that explain how to recreate an "ideal" Skyrim configuration, but they require far too much attention for novices and more casual players. For folks with little time to play around with all that, it deters from playing the game.

bubinga64 wrote: Im not saying it's impossible, but I wonder just how useful that feature would be unless it was only mods from this site and said configuration didn't have older mods that are now hidden or removed. Also keep in mind that many people tweak mods so you may not get the intended effect.

piperman123 wrote: I can't second this enough, making it so we can share modded games without depriving modders of their downloads would be sweet AF! Would also be a tremendous help with troubleshooting I imagine. Letting more experienced modders or mod authors tweak certain things or quickly produce patches, reproduce and narrow down user issues etc. As for people using tweaked esps, no reason why after the manager downloads that mod it can't copy (or the users can manually share) the tweaked versions or direct each other to mods downloaded from elsewhere which is probably far fewer than those used from here anyway.

Plus I spend weeks messing with mods and it would be great to be able to share some of my 'ultra modded' setups with friends who aren't as experienced or willing to put the time into learning or setting things up but have seen my version of Skyrim and would like to play it too or even help troubleshoot and test things as they play more than I do or while I continue to play about with modding further.

+1 for sure!

vogues wrote: game changer

phellen wrote: I could see automation like this working for mods using the simple "click the NMM button to install" but not for mods that require separate plugins, patches, mod requirements, ini edits, manual downloads, etc. Probably would end up creating more problems for people than it would solve. Then there is the issue of bypassing page views, and the advertisement and support that nexus, and potentially mod authors get (through donations) with those page views.

The only way I can imagine this working is if Nexus set up a file sharing system like dropbox that can also connect to the Skyrim data folders and the nexus mod manager, allowing players to share data/ save game files via the cloud. Interesting concept for sure, but sharing data like that could also mean monthly subscription charges to pay for storing all the data on the cloud.

tajetaje wrote: So one thing Most of the modding community (probably) and I would absolutely love/need in NMM2 would be some sort of import from MO2/NMM1 and a virtual file system.
P.S. love te work you guys do here, very much hyped for NMM2.

tajetaje wrote: bubinga64 it's called a backup. But what would be cool is having an exportable/importable mod list that auto downloads, if still on the nexus.

lued123 wrote: Taje, Nexus can't keep backups of old mods if the original authors don't allow it. The guy who made Wyrmstooth left because he wanted to completely erase his online presence. Nexus keeping a backup of that would have been in direct conflict with what he was trying to do, and probably insulting besides.
At any rate, modlists that make use of mods that no longer exist can just become obsolete like many mods themselves eventually do, so I don't think that's a huge problem. You could create a list in ModPicker or find one on the Nexus site and then feed that list into the mod manager and have it create that modlist as closely as possible, then notify you of what's missing.
The actual problem here is what Phellen said: bypassing page views and ad impressions, as well as the Nexus simply having to handle the traffic. The closest thing to a solution that I can think of would be restricting the feature to premium members, who don't contribute ad revenue anyway, and already paid for access to better servers.
In any case, I think the Nexus staff probably want to focus on the basic features of the new manager and the site redesign before moving on to hypothetical features like one-click overhauls.

tajetaje wrote: what I meant was very similar to what you just described, but the feature would not be hard at all to implement, and even easier with electron. The feature would basically have a .txt file that NMM2/vortex could read with the mod name, file version, and nexus ID. Of course this wouldn't work with manual downloads or old/deleted files, but that is the trade-off.

Kirk777 wrote: Yes please.

I'm the kind of player that like to experiment mods and different environments, and this'll let me switch from my desktop PC to my laptop much much easier.

And as OP said, it'll give mod authors a way to give players the experience they want to share, especially for ENB authors.

Limbic2Node wrote: I have several follower mods that I've edited visually and altered their esp. , unless the creator/author looks under the hood, I doubt they would recognize their own creation.
I;m willing to bet these mod creators would not be happy with me if I made their altered followers available, neither would the folks running The Nexus. So, even if it was practical to implement, I would suspect mod "ownership" would be enough of a reason to reflect upon, throw in the other wise points discussed above and that makes it a no go.
Having said that, +1 for a pretty good idea.

@Limbic
I think in general it would only support nexus-managed files. It wouldn't just internet your data folder into someone else's. There'd probably have to be a prerequisites text field where the creator of the modlist could put information like "requires SKSE" or "looks best with X ENB", but it wouldn't be able to transfer files from the list author's machine.
At best the list author could create add-on esps (by esmifying, then making those edits you talked about) and upload those on their own Nexus page, then include those in the list. With permission from the original mod author of course.
Edit: and what would also be great is that the modlist could include a file list (listception), so when the manager finished downloading, it could check the data folder against that list to make sure all the mods made it. Edited February 23, 2017 by lued123

[matortheeternal]

In response to post #47493580. #47500655, #47507910, #47533300, #47538495, #47549365, #47581735, #47582835, #47686910, #47688185, #47825835, #47829125 are all replies on the same post.

Farvahar wrote: What I want to be able to do: have a person save their Skyrim configuration in toto and share it with other users as a file; the mod manager would then recreate that experience on my machine without all the hassle that goes with this currently. The manager would download the mods, set them up etc etc so as to create the same Skyrim experience as a mod master would be able to put together.

Their are guides that explain how to recreate an "ideal" Skyrim configuration, but they require far too much attention for novices and more casual players. For folks with little time to play around with all that, it deters from playing the game.

bubinga64 wrote: Im not saying it's impossible, but I wonder just how useful that feature would be unless it was only mods from this site and said configuration didn't have older mods that are now hidden or removed. Also keep in mind that many people tweak mods so you may not get the intended effect.

piperman123 wrote: I can't second this enough, making it so we can share modded games without depriving modders of their downloads would be sweet AF! Would also be a tremendous help with troubleshooting I imagine. Letting more experienced modders or mod authors tweak certain things or quickly produce patches, reproduce and narrow down user issues etc. As for people using tweaked esps, no reason why after the manager downloads that mod it can't copy (or the users can manually share) the tweaked versions or direct each other to mods downloaded from elsewhere which is probably far fewer than those used from here anyway.

Plus I spend weeks messing with mods and it would be great to be able to share some of my 'ultra modded' setups with friends who aren't as experienced or willing to put the time into learning or setting things up but have seen my version of Skyrim and would like to play it too or even help troubleshoot and test things as they play more than I do or while I continue to play about with modding further.

+1 for sure!

vogues wrote: game changer

phellen wrote: I could see automation like this working for mods using the simple "click the NMM button to install" but not for mods that require separate plugins, patches, mod requirements, ini edits, manual downloads, etc. Probably would end up creating more problems for people than it would solve. Then there is the issue of bypassing page views, and the advertisement and support that nexus, and potentially mod authors get (through donations) with those page views.

The only way I can imagine this working is if Nexus set up a file sharing system like dropbox that can also connect to the Skyrim data folders and the nexus mod manager, allowing players to share data/ save game files via the cloud. Interesting concept for sure, but sharing data like that could also mean monthly subscription charges to pay for storing all the data on the cloud.

tajetaje wrote: So one thing Most of the modding community (probably) and I would absolutely love/need in NMM2 would be some sort of import from MO2/NMM1 and a virtual file system.
P.S. love te work you guys do here, very much hyped for NMM2.

tajetaje wrote: bubinga64 it's called a backup. But what would be cool is having an exportable/importable mod list that auto downloads, if still on the nexus.

lued123 wrote: Taje, Nexus can't keep backups of old mods if the original authors don't allow it. The guy who made Wyrmstooth left because he wanted to completely erase his online presence. Nexus keeping a backup of that would have been in direct conflict with what he was trying to do, and probably insulting besides.
At any rate, modlists that make use of mods that no longer exist can just become obsolete like many mods themselves eventually do, so I don't think that's a huge problem. You could create a list in ModPicker or find one on the Nexus site and then feed that list into the mod manager and have it create that modlist as closely as possible, then notify you of what's missing.
The actual problem here is what Phellen said: bypassing page views and ad impressions, as well as the Nexus simply having to handle the traffic. The closest thing to a solution that I can think of would be restricting the feature to premium members, who don't contribute ad revenue anyway, and already paid for access to better servers.
In any case, I think the Nexus staff probably want to focus on the basic features of the new manager and the site redesign before moving on to hypothetical features like one-click overhauls.

tajetaje wrote: what I meant was very similar to what you just described, but the feature would not be hard at all to implement, and even easier with electron. The feature would basically have a .txt file that NMM2/vortex could read with the mod name, file version, and nexus ID. Of course this wouldn't work with manual downloads or old/deleted files, but that is the trade-off.

Kirk777 wrote: Yes please.

I'm the kind of player that like to experiment mods and different environments, and this'll let me switch from my desktop PC to my laptop much much easier.

And as OP said, it'll give mod authors a way to give players the experience they want to share, especially for ENB authors.

Limbic2Node wrote: I have several follower mods that I've edited visually and altered their esp. , unless the creator/author looks under the hood, I doubt they would recognize their own creation.
I;m willing to bet these mod creators would not be happy with me if I made their altered followers available, neither would the folks running The Nexus. So, even if it was practical to implement, I would suspect mod "ownership" would be enough of a reason to reflect upon, throw in the other wise points discussed above and that makes it a no go.
Having said that, +1 for a pretty good idea.

lued123 wrote: @Limbic
I think in general it would only support nexus-managed files. It wouldn't just internet your data folder into someone else's. There'd probably have to be a prerequisites text field where the creator of the modlist could put information like "requires SKSE" or "looks best with X ENB", but it wouldn't be able to transfer files from the list author's machine.
At best the list author could create add-on esps (by esmifying, then making those edits you talked about) and upload those on their own Nexus page, then include those in the list. With permission from the original mod author of course.
Edit: and what would also be great is that the modlist could include a file list (listception), so when the manager finished downloading, it could check the data folder against that list to make sure all the mods made it.

I'm actually in the process of building this as part of Mod Picker. Mod Picker has enough data to automate the installation of mods, including FOMOD/BAIN installers. The utility we're making will set up the external tools (stuff that installs out of the data folder, like SKSE, Mod Organizer, TES5Edit, etc.), mods, and configuration files for a mod list.

[Kitchensnk]

Kind of curious what the status is...

 

Have you found the person you are seeking?

 

 

What kind of time line are we looking at for the "new" manager?

[lued123]

In response to post #47493580. #47500655, #47507910, #47533300, #47538495, #47549365, #47581735, #47582835, #47686910, #47688185, #47825835, #47829125, #47830295 are all replies on the same post.

Farvahar wrote: What I want to be able to do: have a person save their Skyrim configuration in toto and share it with other users as a file; the mod manager would then recreate that experience on my machine without all the hassle that goes with this currently. The manager would download the mods, set them up etc etc so as to create the same Skyrim experience as a mod master would be able to put together.

Their are guides that explain how to recreate an "ideal" Skyrim configuration, but they require far too much attention for novices and more casual players. For folks with little time to play around with all that, it deters from playing the game.

bubinga64 wrote: Im not saying it's impossible, but I wonder just how useful that feature would be unless it was only mods from this site and said configuration didn't have older mods that are now hidden or removed. Also keep in mind that many people tweak mods so you may not get the intended effect.

piperman123 wrote: I can't second this enough, making it so we can share modded games without depriving modders of their downloads would be sweet AF! Would also be a tremendous help with troubleshooting I imagine. Letting more experienced modders or mod authors tweak certain things or quickly produce patches, reproduce and narrow down user issues etc. As for people using tweaked esps, no reason why after the manager downloads that mod it can't copy (or the users can manually share) the tweaked versions or direct each other to mods downloaded from elsewhere which is probably far fewer than those used from here anyway.

Plus I spend weeks messing with mods and it would be great to be able to share some of my 'ultra modded' setups with friends who aren't as experienced or willing to put the time into learning or setting things up but have seen my version of Skyrim and would like to play it too or even help troubleshoot and test things as they play more than I do or while I continue to play about with modding further.

+1 for sure!

vogues wrote: game changer

phellen wrote: I could see automation like this working for mods using the simple "click the NMM button to install" but not for mods that require separate plugins, patches, mod requirements, ini edits, manual downloads, etc. Probably would end up creating more problems for people than it would solve. Then there is the issue of bypassing page views, and the advertisement and support that nexus, and potentially mod authors get (through donations) with those page views.

The only way I can imagine this working is if Nexus set up a file sharing system like dropbox that can also connect to the Skyrim data folders and the nexus mod manager, allowing players to share data/ save game files via the cloud. Interesting concept for sure, but sharing data like that could also mean monthly subscription charges to pay for storing all the data on the cloud.

tajetaje wrote: So one thing Most of the modding community (probably) and I would absolutely love/need in NMM2 would be some sort of import from MO2/NMM1 and a virtual file system.
P.S. love te work you guys do here, very much hyped for NMM2.

tajetaje wrote: bubinga64 it's called a backup. But what would be cool is having an exportable/importable mod list that auto downloads, if still on the nexus.

lued123 wrote: Taje, Nexus can't keep backups of old mods if the original authors don't allow it. The guy who made Wyrmstooth left because he wanted to completely erase his online presence. Nexus keeping a backup of that would have been in direct conflict with what he was trying to do, and probably insulting besides.
At any rate, modlists that make use of mods that no longer exist can just become obsolete like many mods themselves eventually do, so I don't think that's a huge problem. You could create a list in ModPicker or find one on the Nexus site and then feed that list into the mod manager and have it create that modlist as closely as possible, then notify you of what's missing.
The actual problem here is what Phellen said: bypassing page views and ad impressions, as well as the Nexus simply having to handle the traffic. The closest thing to a solution that I can think of would be restricting the feature to premium members, who don't contribute ad revenue anyway, and already paid for access to better servers.
In any case, I think the Nexus staff probably want to focus on the basic features of the new manager and the site redesign before moving on to hypothetical features like one-click overhauls.

tajetaje wrote: what I meant was very similar to what you just described, but the feature would not be hard at all to implement, and even easier with electron. The feature would basically have a .txt file that NMM2/vortex could read with the mod name, file version, and nexus ID. Of course this wouldn't work with manual downloads or old/deleted files, but that is the trade-off.

Kirk777 wrote: Yes please.

I'm the kind of player that like to experiment mods and different environments, and this'll let me switch from my desktop PC to my laptop much much easier.

And as OP said, it'll give mod authors a way to give players the experience they want to share, especially for ENB authors.

Limbic2Node wrote: I have several follower mods that I've edited visually and altered their esp. , unless the creator/author looks under the hood, I doubt they would recognize their own creation.
I;m willing to bet these mod creators would not be happy with me if I made their altered followers available, neither would the folks running The Nexus. So, even if it was practical to implement, I would suspect mod "ownership" would be enough of a reason to reflect upon, throw in the other wise points discussed above and that makes it a no go.
Having said that, +1 for a pretty good idea.

lued123 wrote: @Limbic
I think in general it would only support nexus-managed files. It wouldn't just internet your data folder into someone else's. There'd probably have to be a prerequisites text field where the creator of the modlist could put information like "requires SKSE" or "looks best with X ENB", but it wouldn't be able to transfer files from the list author's machine.
At best the list author could create add-on esps (by esmifying, then making those edits you talked about) and upload those on their own Nexus page, then include those in the list. With permission from the original mod author of course.
Edit: and what would also be great is that the modlist could include a file list (listception), so when the manager finished downloading, it could check the data folder against that list to make sure all the mods made it.

matortheeternal wrote: I'm actually in the process of building this as part of Mod Picker. Mod Picker has enough data to automate the installation of mods, including FOMOD/BAIN installers. The utility we're making will set up the external tools (stuff that installs out of the data folder, like SKSE, Mod Organizer, TES5Edit, etc.), mods, and configuration files for a mod list.

Wow. That's stupendous news Mator. Best of luck with that.

[aburnstorm]

In response to post #47493580. #47500655, #47507910, #47533300, #47538495, #47549365, #47581735, #47582835, #47686910, #47688185, #47825835, #47829125, #47830295, #47878955 are all replies on the same post.

Farvahar wrote: What I want to be able to do: have a person save their Skyrim configuration in toto and share it with other users as a file; the mod manager would then recreate that experience on my machine without all the hassle that goes with this currently. The manager would download the mods, set them up etc etc so as to create the same Skyrim experience as a mod master would be able to put together.

Their are guides that explain how to recreate an "ideal" Skyrim configuration, but they require far too much attention for novices and more casual players. For folks with little time to play around with all that, it deters from playing the game.

bubinga64 wrote: Im not saying it's impossible, but I wonder just how useful that feature would be unless it was only mods from this site and said configuration didn't have older mods that are now hidden or removed. Also keep in mind that many people tweak mods so you may not get the intended effect.

piperman123 wrote: I can't second this enough, making it so we can share modded games without depriving modders of their downloads would be sweet AF! Would also be a tremendous help with troubleshooting I imagine. Letting more experienced modders or mod authors tweak certain things or quickly produce patches, reproduce and narrow down user issues etc. As for people using tweaked esps, no reason why after the manager downloads that mod it can't copy (or the users can manually share) the tweaked versions or direct each other to mods downloaded from elsewhere which is probably far fewer than those used from here anyway.

Plus I spend weeks messing with mods and it would be great to be able to share some of my 'ultra modded' setups with friends who aren't as experienced or willing to put the time into learning or setting things up but have seen my version of Skyrim and would like to play it too or even help troubleshoot and test things as they play more than I do or while I continue to play about with modding further.

+1 for sure!

vogues wrote: game changer

phellen wrote: I could see automation like this working for mods using the simple "click the NMM button to install" but not for mods that require separate plugins, patches, mod requirements, ini edits, manual downloads, etc. Probably would end up creating more problems for people than it would solve. Then there is the issue of bypassing page views, and the advertisement and support that nexus, and potentially mod authors get (through donations) with those page views.

The only way I can imagine this working is if Nexus set up a file sharing system like dropbox that can also connect to the Skyrim data folders and the nexus mod manager, allowing players to share data/ save game files via the cloud. Interesting concept for sure, but sharing data like that could also mean monthly subscription charges to pay for storing all the data on the cloud.

tajetaje wrote: So one thing Most of the modding community (probably) and I would absolutely love/need in NMM2 would be some sort of import from MO2/NMM1 and a virtual file system.
P.S. love te work you guys do here, very much hyped for NMM2.

tajetaje wrote: bubinga64 it's called a backup. But what would be cool is having an exportable/importable mod list that auto downloads, if still on the nexus.

lued123 wrote: Taje, Nexus can't keep backups of old mods if the original authors don't allow it. The guy who made Wyrmstooth left because he wanted to completely erase his online presence. Nexus keeping a backup of that would have been in direct conflict with what he was trying to do, and probably insulting besides.
At any rate, modlists that make use of mods that no longer exist can just become obsolete like many mods themselves eventually do, so I don't think that's a huge problem. You could create a list in ModPicker or find one on the Nexus site and then feed that list into the mod manager and have it create that modlist as closely as possible, then notify you of what's missing.
The actual problem here is what Phellen said: bypassing page views and ad impressions, as well as the Nexus simply having to handle the traffic. The closest thing to a solution that I can think of would be restricting the feature to premium members, who don't contribute ad revenue anyway, and already paid for access to better servers.
In any case, I think the Nexus staff probably want to focus on the basic features of the new manager and the site redesign before moving on to hypothetical features like one-click overhauls.

tajetaje wrote: what I meant was very similar to what you just described, but the feature would not be hard at all to implement, and even easier with electron. The feature would basically have a .txt file that NMM2/vortex could read with the mod name, file version, and nexus ID. Of course this wouldn't work with manual downloads or old/deleted files, but that is the trade-off.

Kirk777 wrote: Yes please.

I'm the kind of player that like to experiment mods and different environments, and this'll let me switch from my desktop PC to my laptop much much easier.

And as OP said, it'll give mod authors a way to give players the experience they want to share, especially for ENB authors.

Limbic2Node wrote: I have several follower mods that I've edited visually and altered their esp. , unless the creator/author looks under the hood, I doubt they would recognize their own creation.
I;m willing to bet these mod creators would not be happy with me if I made their altered followers available, neither would the folks running The Nexus. So, even if it was practical to implement, I would suspect mod "ownership" would be enough of a reason to reflect upon, throw in the other wise points discussed above and that makes it a no go.
Having said that, +1 for a pretty good idea.

lued123 wrote: @Limbic
I think in general it would only support nexus-managed files. It wouldn't just internet your data folder into someone else's. There'd probably have to be a prerequisites text field where the creator of the modlist could put information like "requires SKSE" or "looks best with X ENB", but it wouldn't be able to transfer files from the list author's machine.
At best the list author could create add-on esps (by esmifying, then making those edits you talked about) and upload those on their own Nexus page, then include those in the list. With permission from the original mod author of course.
Edit: and what would also be great is that the modlist could include a file list (listception), so when the manager finished downloading, it could check the data folder against that list to make sure all the mods made it.

matortheeternal wrote: I'm actually in the process of building this as part of Mod Picker. Mod Picker has enough data to automate the installation of mods, including FOMOD/BAIN installers. The utility we're making will set up the external tools (stuff that installs out of the data folder, like SKSE, Mod Organizer, TES5Edit, etc.), mods, and configuration files for a mod list.

lued123 wrote: Wow. That's stupendous news Mator. Best of luck with that.

This is so clearly and simply needed that it's almost silly it hasn't been agreed to yet as a possibility with mod authors. I understand some would not like their own work to be partially overridden/blended within a network of mods, but the power of getting those of us who have limited time but want to build a awe-inspiring mod deck for a particular play-through would be phenomenal. I wouldn't mind only getting my mods via the nexus for this capability. I mean, in truth I already get 90% of them here anyway.

[Brohanga]

I still like to play Oblivion and have noticed NMM does not do a good job installing the mods I have tried. While I am quite capable of using OMM, I was just wondering if the new NMM would be more capable of installing these Oblivion mods properly?

[greyday01]

When you are working on the interface how about adding a print icon that will print out your current mod order? I've always been irritated that that has been missing from the managers.

[Ethreon]

In response to post #48023900.

greyday01 wrote: When you are working on the interface how about adding a print icon that will print out your current mod order? I've always been irritated that that has been missing from the managers.

Export to > Text or Export to > Clipboard. I don't know why you'd need more.

[IgnusLupin]

New Name Idea:

 

The N.E.O.M.O.R.P.H.

 

Nexusmods

Expanded

Optimized

Mod

Organizer

Renovated

Package

Handler

Edited March 10, 2017 by IgnusLupin