How to edit rules in italics.

[UrizenDe]

There´s a BetterSettlers.esp in this one Tannin: https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/21248?tab=files .

[Grestorn]

But if that would be the case, and especially if that particular BetterSettlers.esp introduces another dependency, that would be a MAJOR problem with this "Unique NPCs" mod. That's not only very bad style (to overwrite another person's mod without mentioning that in the descriptions) it's also dangerous and potentially malicious.

 

Actually, it's a good thing that LOOT caught that indirectly by giving you this headache about the cyclic rules. So you were made aware of the fact that there's something amiss.

[Tannin42]

Yeah, that and - sorry but I'm not going to download 6GB to try this out plus I can still not make heads or tails of the report:

 

Think I found it, the Better Settlers replacement patch from Unique NPCS - Creatures and Monsters has Better Settlers.esp as a master, and Better Settlers CCA pack has Eli_Armour_Compendium as a master

 

 

It's in Unique NPCS - Creatures and Monsters of the Commonwealth, it replaces the Better Settlers.esp if you pick the option, in order to combine the "No lolly gagging" option from better settlers into Bettersettlers.esp

 

 

How does a replacement, that replaces Better Settlers.esp have Better Settlers.esp as a master? It can't very well have itself as a master...

 

I'm really sorry, I'm trying sooo hard to explain the situation but we're three days in and we still have no proper picture of which mods and plugins are actually involved because so many of the mod names and links posted are wrong or abbreviated.

But from the looks of it it seems that the relations that cause the "cycle" are not at all masterlist rules but master-of dependencies. Those aren't specific to LOOT, if a series of master-of dependencies forces two mods to be loaded in a certain order then you can't change that in any mod manager or you'd get a crash.

[HadToRegister]

No it's not, at least not in the current version. The only options are "D.E.C.A.Y.", "Deadlier Deathclaws" and "SuperMutantRedux".

I also went through the file previews of the optional files and old files, I can't find anything on that mod containing a replacement for that esp.

 

Whoops, it should've been Unique NPCS - An overhaul of the Commonwealth

[Jebbalon]

1. Did you try cleaning masters in xEdit - that could help especially with the master of itself thing.

 

2. The replacement esp from another mod would have a completely different CRC - so can't LOOT assign different rules to that file? It knows when a file is "dirty" by its CRC but it can't treat them different?

 

Not that those will help in this situation - they just came to mind.

[HadToRegister]

1. Did you try cleaning masters in xEdit - that could help especially with the master of itself thing.

 

2. The replacement esp from another mod would have a completely different CRC - so can't LOOT assign different rules to that file? It knows when a file is "dirty" by its CRC but it can't treat them different?

 

Not that those will help in this situation - they just came to mind.

 

Yea, first thing I tried to do was see if I could clean the Masters.

The problem IS, with Vortex's Pre-made Loot rules that you can't edit (I suppose I could dig into the Masterlist I guess)

[Grestorn]

LOOT works on esp's names and not on their CRC.

 

I've already posted a list of all the rules present in the masterlist about BetterSettlers.esp

Trying to help HardToRegister. He chose to shout at me.

 

Everyone can extract them out of LOOT's masterfile (update the masterlist with LOOT then go to C:\Users\<user>\AppData\Local\LOOT\Fallout4 and open the "masterlist.yaml" with any text editor. Search for "BetterSettlers" or whatever plugin you're looking for.)

 

If you don't like the rules in the masterlist, just delete them. If you want do that for Vortex instead of LOOT, the same thing applies, just look for the file in C:\Users\<user>\AppData\Roaming\Vortex\fallout4\masterlist instead.

 

List of rules for BetterSettlers.esp:

  - name: 'BetterSettlers.esp'
    url: [ 'https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4772' ]
    after:
      - 'MoreSkinColors.esp'
      - 'AzarPonyHairstyles.esp'
      - 'Eli_Armour_Compendium.esp'
      - 'Scrap Everything - Core.esp'
      - 'Scrap Everything - Ultimate Edition.esp'
    clean:
      - crc: 0x6A5FC68B
        util: 'FO4Edit v3.2'
  - name: 'BetterSettlersFarHarborPatchMortal.esp'
    url: [ 'https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4772' ]
    req:
      - 'BetterSettlers.esp'
    after:
      - 'BetterSettlersNoLollygagging.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCleanFacePack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCCAPack1.1b.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCCAPack2.0.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersAllFemale.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersMortalPack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersMortalSoldiersPack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersLightArmorOnly.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersHeavyArmorOnly.esp'
    inc: [ 'BetterSettlersFarHarborPatch.esp' ]
  - name: 'BetterSettlersFarHarborPatch.esp'
    url: [ 'https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4772' ]
    req:
      - 'BetterSettlers.esp'
    after:
      - 'BetterSettlersNoLollygagging.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCleanFacePack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCCAPack1.1b.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCCAPack2.0.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersAllFemale.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersMortalPack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersMortalSoldiersPack.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersLightArmorOnly.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersHeavyArmorOnly.esp'
    inc: [ 'BetterSettlersFarHarborPatchMortal.esp' ]
  - name: 'BetterSettlersCCAPack2.0.esp'
    url: [ 'https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4772' ]
    req:
      - 'BetterSettlers.esp'
    after:
      - 'BetterSettlersNoLollygagging.esp'
      - 'BetterSettlersCleanFacePack.esp'

  - name: 'BetterSettlersCleanFacePack.esp'
    url: [ 'https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/4772' ]
    dirty:
      - <<: *dirtyPlugin
        # Version 2.0
        crc: 0x7331d352
        util: 'FO4Edit v3.2.1'
        itm: 33

[Jebbalon]

 

1. Did you try cleaning masters in xEdit - that could help especially with the master of itself thing.

 

2. The replacement esp from another mod would have a completely different CRC - so can't LOOT assign different rules to that file? It knows when a file is "dirty" by its CRC but it can't treat them different?

 

Not that those will help in this situation - they just came to mind.

 

Yea, first thing I tried to do was see if I could clean the Masters.

The problem IS, with Vortex's Pre-made Loot rules that you can't edit (I suppose I could dig into the Masterlist I guess)

 

Vortex uses LOOT masterlist for the pre-made rules so this is a Loot thing.

 

About using the CRC it was a question. Loot does keep track of them and I guess my question was more for tannin or loot devs.

Changing the masterlist might work but I'd think the next run would just update it again.

So back to the original question - How can you edit the 'locked' italic rules?

In this specific case though I'd probably use original mod esp and the esp replacement from another mod - I'd see about making its changes into patch.

[Tannin42]

LOOT does support using conditions (including checksums) to distinguish esps, yes, but of couse they will use that only if absolutely necessary because any update of the plugin as well as cleaning it would then require a separate entry.

In this case, since we still don't have a full picture of the plugins involved I can't even begin to investigate if an distinction should be made in this case. Masterlist rules are not usually made nilli-willy.

Only with a full list of the plugins (and which variant was used in case of replacers) and with a full list of custom rules and what they try to achieve we could try to investigate whether any of the masterlist rules are actually unnecessary.

[Rattledagger]

 

*Think I found it, the Better Settlers replacement patch from Unique NPCS - Creatures and Monsters has Better Settlers.esp as a master, and Better Settlers CCA pack has Eli_Armour_Compendium as a master

 

 

While you've fixed the name of the mod later on, at least my reading of this is:

 

1: You're using a mod called Better Settlers that includes bettersettlers.esp

2: You're using a mod called Unique NPCS - An overhaul of the Commonwealth that replaces bettersettlers.esp

3: The bettersettlers.esp from 2 has bettersettlers.esp as master.

 

Since bettersettlers.esp having bettersettlers.esp as a master should be impossible if this really is the case you've got a fatal bug and fixing this fatal bug is the first thing you should do.

 

If your problem is not that bettersettlers.esp has bettersettlers.esp as a master, my recommendation is that you make a detailed post including:

 

a: Links to all the mods that is part of the circle.

b: Any fomod-choices to install these mods.

c: The list of all the esp in the circle and for each esp a list of their masters.

d: Any custom Vortex rules or putting into groups for the esp in the circle.

 

BTW, also mentioning you're having problems with Fallout 4 would be helpful, since in this case I wouldn't need to read the whole thread to learn you're talking about a game I don't have.