Ok, I tried it.

[Guest deleted34304850]

>This is like claiming that it's the job of a car repair shop to repair your car even when you didn't bring it in. We tried to tow you by asking you >relevant questions but you refused to answer. At some point everyone no matter how patient will give up and tell you to deal with your own sh*t.

 

If you want professional grade beta testers who document everything and give explicit detail, hire a crew of professionals. They don't work for minimum wage. As for users, we offer what we have without rigor. And we get paid nothing.

 

This is your job, and Vortex is your baby. You want it to be the best you can do, I assume. Users don't have a dog in the race. We are simply trying to use your product for as long as our patience holds out.

 

It is not our job to convince you of anything. But a kindly woncha, whydoncha request for more information without acting like we are the numbskulls we surely are, will probably work better for you.

you're a troll.

an idiotic troll.

no more. no less.

[Tannin42]

If you want professional grade beta testers who document everything and give explicit detail, hire a crew of professionals. They don't work for minimum wage. As for users, we offer what we have without rigor. And we get paid nothing.

 

This is your job, and Vortex is your baby. You want it to be the best you can do, I assume. Users don't have a dog in the race. We are simply trying to use your product for as long as our patience holds out.

 

It is not our job to convince you of anything. But a kindly woncha, whydoncha request for more information without acting like we are the numbskulls we surely are, will probably work better for you.

 

Ok, let me rephrase my previous statement to avoid misunderstandings:

If you want the problem you see fixed or anyone to be able to help you, you have to provide the information we need to do that.

 

If you go around claiming bugs publicly when you're not able to proof they are bugs instead of user error that's not error reporting that's slander.

 

Oh btw.:

> You want it to be the best you can do, I assume. Users don't have a dog in the race.

 

Ummm - huh?

a) You don't have a dog in this race? So you don't want to use it? What are you doing here then? Anyone who uses this software or might want to use it has "a dog in the race".

b) Our user base is large and their interests are heterogeneous. Our own time is limited and needs to be budgeted. If your report is useless, we will just spend the time on a report that isn't. It really doesn't compute for me how you think this is more our problem than yours.

 

Again, your logic just doesn't resemble our human logic.

When you report an issue you compete with tons of other users for our limited development time. The number of hours IDCs day and mine are the bottleneck for all Vortex development, not the number of things to work on.

So no, it's not your "job" to convince us but it's in your own best interest to convince us that your issue should take priority over others and is worth looking into in the first place.

[Ethreon]

The 'customer is always right' mentality really rots your brain and turns you into an idiot. Makes you do stupid things like claim you're a programmer and other such stuff while wasting everyone's time with inane bs.

[soaringcow]

It is true, I have subjected you to a couple of my radical (relative to normal programmer attitudes) unwelcome opinions.

1) software should help users do what they imagine they want to do (without unwanted consequences) rather than prevent them from doing that in the name of not disturbing your vision of what the software should do. Don't scramble my load order, don't subject me to repeated offers to "purge".

2) Users might offer their help in identifying problems with *your* software. They are helping you, rather than you helping them.

 

Peace.

[Tannin42]

Then I advice you to use Photoshop for your modding and complain to them that it doesn't do what you imagined it to do. You'd only be helping Adobe and I'm sure as a professional company they will improve the Skyrim modding features in PS right away and thank you for your valuable input.

[soaringcow]

Then I advice you to use Photoshop for your modding and complain to them that it doesn't do what you imagined it to do. You'd only be helping Adobe and I'm sure as a professional company they will improve the Skyrim modding features in PS right away and thank you for your valuable input.

 

They have their own professional beta testers, I'm sure. My comments apply to programmers who rely on users for beta testing.

[soaringcow]

The 'customer is always right' mentality really rots your brain and turns you into an idiot. Makes you do stupid things like claim you're a programmer and other such stuff while wasting everyone's time with inane bs.

 

On the other hand, when a user asks, why doesn't your software work, " because you are an idiot" is the wrong answer.

[HadToRegister]

 

The 'customer is always right' mentality really rots your brain and turns you into an idiot. Makes you do stupid things like claim you're a programmer and other such stuff while wasting everyone's time with inane bs.

 

On the other hand, when a user asks, why doesn't your software work, " because you are an idiot" is the wrong answer.

 

 

Of course, when a user asks "Why doesn't your software work?" and the Developer asks, "Why? What problems are you having?", and then the user completely ignores the question and refuses to answer, then the user is an idiot, because the user doesn't want to help in any way, and obviously doesn't actually WANT help, and just wants attention.

 

I'm not sure why you have such a mental block to that concept, but this is all on you, and you refuse to see it.

Instead you keep coming back, making more vague remarks, and STILL, after all this time, have never shown that ANY of your problems that you vaguely mention are caused by anything other than user error.

 

And here we are, STILL trying to get information out of you, and you STILL refuse to give any information, and instead, have this completely nonsensical attitude of "Why should I give you any information as to what problems I'm experiencing? That's your job, YOU figure it out"

 

That is the dumbest, and least helpful attitude ever.

 

Walk into any emergency room, and when they ask, "What seems to be the problem", tell them "You figure it out, I shouldn't have to tell you, that's YOUR job."

 

See how far that gets you.

It will net you a pretty large bill, (If they don't just kick you out for trolling the medical staff) because without any info, they're going to have to perform unnecessary tests on you.

[Guest deleted34304850]

 

The 'customer is always right' mentality really rots your brain and turns you into an idiot. Makes you do stupid things like claim you're a programmer and other such stuff while wasting everyone's time with inane bs.

 

On the other hand, when a user asks, why doesn't your software work, " because you are an idiot" is the wrong answer.

 

It's not the wrong answer when it's the truth.