Publisher-Approved Paid Modding Policy

[elpuertorro]

5 minutes ago, Kant3n said:

Because you don't have any arguments that can be verified or refuted on that page because it doesn't mention any of what you've been claiming. You just thought dropping the Creations URL after your comment was somehow an endorsement of validity.

Hmm I guess I just put that fake site together right now just to post this huh?

[Arthmoor]

13 minutes ago, elpuertorro said:

https://creations.bethesda.net/en/creators/bethesdagamestudios

So then maybe you'd like to point us to where on that page the split is mentioned? Cause I can't find it but I may be missing it.

[showler]

5 minutes ago, Chernobylite12 said:

But as people have pointed out, Nexus has taken the position that patches CANNOT be released for paid mods ON NEXUS.  Which is the bigger issue at hand for a lot of users. 

Yes.  The argument with elpuertorro is a separate thing that just got mixed in with all this.

8 minutes ago, cyan49 said:

Thanks for pointing that out, I hadn't thought of that last one. The first thing that comes to mind is nude mods, they would never allow those. I don't think 1 and 2 are particularly problematic, 1 is simply their choice and 2 is a general modding rule.

I consider them problematic in connection to the Nexus Mods decision due to the possibility of losing patches for no good reason.

[jwisser]

8 hours ago, Pickysaurus said:

Patches for/Dependencies on Paid Mods: We will not allow any patches or addons for user-generated content that requires payment to unlock (this specifically excludes DLCs offered by the developer - including DLCs that bundle items previously sold individually such as Skyrim's Anniversary Upgrade). Equally, if a mod uploaded to the site requires a paid mod to function, it will not be permitted. 

As written, this seems sufficiently out-of-line with the other parts of the policy that I have to ask whether it means what it says. Just to confirm: the Nexus is henceforth banning any mods that improve or build on the experience of users who chose to pay for e.g. Verified Creator content?

This is wildly disrespectful to both the users who've chosen to support the creators of that content by paying for it, and to the modders who have published foundational content here over the years., but who have also chosen to take advantage of those programs.

Please remove this provision. It will only serve to push freely provided game-improving patches like these to other platforms, and it will make people, including me, resentful of the Nexus.

[samuelgensler]

3 hours ago, Gaztec said:

I want to champion Nexus, I love the idea of Collections, the new NM app, all that. I want one place to host it all, one installer new users can click that just figures it all out for them and gives them the game they want with the mods they want.

But I simply do not believe that paying modders is bad. I think mods like Bards College Expansion, Blood and Snow and many others deserve to be paid. The prospect of pay will encourage others to aim for this level of quality. For most (regardless of what is said) it really just comes down to quality. They will pay for good content, if it is easy. We should stop pretending modding is pure and free of corporate interest, Bethesda will continue to try for as long as the company exists and there has never been a shortage of hustlers shoving Patreon links into their MCM's or books. The focus shouldn't be on "All mods must be free forever" but "What mods warrant a price" and negotiating the questions around that. Many authors who previously championed the "Forever Free" badges are now Verified Creators, being paid for your work is pretty cool and i'm happy they were able to do that. Jumping straight to "make your own entire game" should not be a counterpoint, many modders move on not because they wish to but because life demands it.

Nexus already has its' DP scheme which has already proven difficult to rely on, being that we had three months pending while Nexus decided to make an algorithm for it. The existence of DP to me, acknowledges that soliciting Donations for many modders goes nowhere, users simply do not donate that much or that often unless you're in some nsfw niche. If you have aspirations of making mod content full time, it feels as though the world is working against you, that your notion of being paid for hundreds of your hours is wrong. I know I could have made other choices in my life, but I tried my best to find gainful employment and all that was left for me was burning out of minimum wage, donations through mods keep me here and I aspire to someday create something less niche but all this action against anything resembling paid mods or stable income from modding just pushes me further and further into more niche content. I have no intent to release "free" inferior versions of mods, or ever close-source anything, I want to give back. I don't even want to do anything paid, I just want to be able to eat and spend my time modding rather than the cycle of temp work, so I find the idea of offering additional customisation or assets through paid addons very tempting.

Paid opinions aside, the rule is completely unenforceable and will cause patch quality to diminish, which if we were being cynical might be the point. We have had soft-dependency scripted LL injection for years, all that this rule accomplishes is make it so more dramatic compatibility fixes like navmesh and location edits are more difficult to accomplish. If this rule continues, someone more effective than me will just create a xSE plugin to circumvent it.

Yeah that about sums up my position. Trying to prevent people from making patches for content like that comes off as super intrusive. My single player game is my single player game. If I want to spend 5 dollars, or 500 dollars on every garbage mod on the CC, I shouldn't feel discouraged to do so because Nexus decided to get super controlling over what I'm allowed to have access to. 

I could understand it if it was a legal issue, but we're talking about compatibility patches and retextures for mods that are of extremely high quality (Bards College Expansion could literally have been sold as an official DLC). There is zero justifiable reason to disallow those, and it just comes off as someone else putting their fingers all over my game.

The other points make a ton of sense, but not that one. I'm surprised anyone is even remotely okay with it. And for the record, I'm not a fan of paying for mods, but this is going way too far and trying to discourage other people from making their own decisions by tanking the quality and accessibility of the ones that are sold. That's, frankly, not Nexus' business at all. 

[showler]

3 minutes ago, elpuertorro said:

Hmm I guess I just put that fake site together right now just to post this huh?

Okay, seriously, why would you highlight the stuff in the first image?  That's literally about technical differences between Creation Club and Creations.  They modified the game so that they don't need to release game update in order to release Creations and they don't guarantee language localizations for Creations.  That has nothing to do with ANYTHING that's being discussed.

And the second image is, once again, only relevant for the paid Creation itself not for patches for that Creation.

[elpuertorro]

3 minutes ago, showler said:

Funny you mention that.  I just searched this up to end this argument:

https://creations.bethesda.net/en/skyrim/details/65eb793d-9917-486f-9e60-1401ac0eafdb/East_Empire_Expansion_Modified__Patch_

And you are 100% right on that one, but do notice  that "patch"  is a QOL mod, all it does is alter the original not patch it to work with others, no patches for other mods or anything, it is self contained to the mod itself. with no other dependencies.
And for those of us who like to read all, here is what I found at the bottom of the page that  backs up what I said here, right before I almost pressed post saw it.
 

Quote

Additional features will be added in future releases.

To make requests for quality of life improvements, please head to our website.

 

[thecrazedpyro]

I absolutely hate this new policy change involving patches for VC content. It's just a terrible move that hurts the user that wants to support both free mods and the new VCs. Sure, donations are just fine here, but god forbid you pay for a mod elsewhere and want some synergy for it. Really makes me want to use nexus less.

[jwisser]

2 minutes ago, elpuertorro said:

And you are 100% right on that one, but do notice  that "patch"  is a QOL mod, all it does is alter the original not patch it to work with others, no patches for other mods or anything, it is self contained to the mod itself. with no other dependencies.
And for those of us who like to read all, here is what I found at the bottom of the page that  backs up what I said here, right before I almost pressed post saw it.

Would you mind parking this argument or taking it to DMs, please? Your constant back-and-forth is distracting from the main topic at hand.

[showler]

3 minutes ago, elpuertorro said:

And you are 100% right on that one, but do notice  that "patch"  is a QOL mod, all it does is alter the original not patch it to work with others, no patches for other mods or anything, it is self contained to the mod itself. with no other dependencies.

Before we continue, can I request you let us know how far you plan to move the goalposts?

Are you now saying that they can release patches with one dependency, but not two?

Or is it not three?

Give us a number so we know how much we have to prove you wrong before you'll admit it.