And So It Begins...

[loveme4whoiam]

Excellant Job, Bestheda, making a better business model.

You are looking at this from an accounting point of view, just like they did. They saw a huge community which they had helped to create, and saw dollar signs. Screw their business model, I want a development company who puts gamers over squeezing that extra bit of money out of them.

 

And I'll echo Peregrine, had this been a big, substantial plugin with lots of content (the idea of having a Kvatch Rebuilt quest is a class idea, I'm sure it's on their list) I'd have been more than happen to pay for it. But for this puny content, made before or after the game was finished irregardless, I object to paying for it at all. Morrowind's official plugins were all free, why shouldn't these be? Oh yes, that's right - their better business model.

 

And by the way, you mention Looking Glass Studios. I'd have liked them to have stayed afloat as well, but unfortunately they didn't. And it seems that Warren Spector got bitten on the ass when he totally sold out to the accountants and made a weak, watered down Deus Ex 2, which consequently did badly in sales. Goes to show, if you cultivate a dedicated community for your games, it pays not to spit in their faces. Which is exactly what Bethesda has done, and purging the official forums of members who objects to this is even worse than that.

[edstamos1]

Hmmmmm.... the payment might be new but everytime i go to subscribe it comes up with billing options.

 

http://www.fileplanet.com/subscribe/subscribe.shtml

 

I am aloowed to post that right. slightly new see and have only read the rules once. :blush:

 

Click on Login Now above those billing options - it's for both logging in and registering as a new user. Sneaky

[Humblie]

Click on Login Now above those billing options - it's for both logging in and registering as a new user. Sneaky

 

wow thanx for that... ive already had a little play on the site but how do i get to the summit and the downloads. :D

 

Is there an oblivion page on there up yet and can i view that as a member now or do i have to join that as well :ohmy:

[Dark0ne]

Quite frankly I couldn't care less about a few crappy mods with subpar content. They're not forcing you to buy it and this isn't stuff that's necessary to play the game. I wouldn't say its stuff that should have been within the game already either -- it's horse armour for god's sake...big whoop de doo.

 

The mods they made for Morrowind, all 8 of them, are relatively crap and useless any way. I don't understand why people are making a big deal about how Bethesda made free mods for Morrowind; how many people actually used them?

 

I think all of the above is a non-issue; if you're complaining about that then you're whining in my eyes. Sure you can say you won't buy the official plugins, but to be writing big essays about how Bethesda have sold out is pretty much useless.

 

For me the only issue here is the fact Bethesda are holding out on the necessary author tools to make similar mods. That's the bad thing.

[loveme4whoiam]

*Waves* I used them :D Admittedly, for all of five seconds - "Wow, I can get a pop-up that says I've entertained the patrons!" - but it's the principal of the thing. And fair enough, no-one is forcing me to buy them, but as you say, they are withholding the tools necessary for modders to make their own stuff. And they are doing it for all the reasons I and others have mentioned.

 

I'll stop now, lest I be accused of writing a big essay :P

[Visbontavon]

Excellant Job, Bestheda, making a better business model.

You are looking at this from an accounting point of view, just like they did.

 

I think you're forgetting that this is a corporation, not a charity. Also, you're right, Warren Spector "sold out" when he made Deus Ex 2, but the game company he originally worked for, Ion Storm, is gone. Man, I know if I was out of work, and no longer able to do the things I'd love, I would hand over my projects and paycheck to some other guy in a heartbeat, if it was in favor of standing up for my "principles." Seeing somebody else develop the sequel to my IP, yeah, that feels REAL great. Ask John Romero.

 

The game industry is extremely tough right now, and while game production costs have been steadily rising into 8 digits, we're still paying $50 for great games like Oblivion. Sure, that's a lot of money, I agree, but we were paying $50 8 years ago, when $50 was worth about $55.

 

If you think I'm spewing crap, you better catch up on some reading.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/issue/9/4

http://www.gamasutra.com/

 

Nobody's making you pay it.

[thurind]

Hmmm . . . .

 

Great marketing idea.. but the principle irks me. Here we have what i feel is a stellar immersive rpg with several game immersion issues that break the flow of play. My intention is not to look at the negatives but to point out that they seem quite capable of producing pay for play mods but are still lacking fixes to issues that should have surfaced during any self respecting beta test. I for one refuse to pay for any new content untill they address some of the more glaring issues that are so valiantly being tackled by the unpaid modding community. The fans of eldar scrolls are going the extra mile to make an already excellent game more playable and less buggy. Do i see any of them charging me to download thier product. no. to bethesda , fix the game before you sell new stuff.

[Cadarn]

Hmmm . . . .

 

Great marketing idea.. but the principle irks me. Here we have what i feel is a stellar immersive rpg with several game immersion issues that break the flow of play. My intention is not to look at the negatives but to point out that they seem quite capable of producing pay for play mods but are still lacking fixes to issues that should have surfaced during any self respecting beta test. I for one refuse to pay for any new content untill they address some of the more glaring issues that are so valiantly being tackled by the unpaid modding community. The fans of eldar scrolls are going the extra mile to make an already excellent game more playable and less buggy. Do i see any of them charging me to download thier product. no. to bethesda , fix the game before you sell new stuff.

 

Nail on head, totally agree.

 

Bring back Socialism ;)

[ThetaOrionis01]

I don't have a problem in principle with Bethesda making extra content available and charging for it - I imagine that Oblivion's development costs were astronomical and well over budget, and if there is to be another TES game Bethesda need to make enough of a profit to keep their investors happy.

 

However, the way Bethesda have handled this so far is excruciatingly poor marketing, and not good for business in the long run. It is always more cost-effective to retain existing customers than to attract new customers to replace the ones you've lost. Alienating their fanbase and their modding community is bad business.

If Bethesda had charged an extra 2 quid for the collector's edition and included a code for a free horse armour download there, would anyone have complained? I don't think it would have provoked quite the same hostile reaction.

 

If Bethesda had announced that work on a patch was going on and the issues which were going to be addressed in this patch it would have mollified a lot of people, IMO. However, I haven't come across any such announcement.

The nif exporter is another such issue - it would be nice if an announcement were made as to when a nif exporter might be forthcoming, or if not, why it can't be released.

Basic customer care and after sales service, IMO. And ATM, that seems to be lacking.

 

However, releasing a commercial add-on without addressing those concerns first (or even at the same time) is bound to make a lot of people feel like cash cows rather than customers. And I suspect that's what's behind a lot of the unfavourable reactions.

[Mystarria]

I know it seems like it's taking forever for the exporter and other things to come out for the modding community. But really it hasn't been that long. It was months before Morrowind were out. Give Beth a reasonable amount of time before flipping out about it. They do care about the modding community, or they wouldn't be helping the modders on the Oblivion Wiki site.

 

I agree it kinda sucks to pay for a mod that I feel should've at least been contained in the CE version of the game. But for the cost of a coffee, it's not 'that' horrible. Regardless of when the mod was made, 1.99 in no way would cover the programmers time or effort to make the mod. In a perfect world maybe they would just do it for the love of the game and gamers, but this has never been a perfect world by any standards. In a way, we're actually lucky that they're releasing them at all. Since they have other projects in the works and have taken time away from other things, just to give these to us.

 

Yes, I'm annoyed about all this as well, but sitting back a little and thinking logically about it, things really aren't as horrible as some people are making it sound.