MidbossVyers Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Where are you getting these Kirkbride quotes from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 Where are you getting these Kirkbride quotes from?Some have been compiled on the Imperial Library in various lists... More recently though he's been posting on Reddit and taking part in the occasional Lore Selectives podcast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoneWolfEburg Posted September 22, 2014 Share Posted September 22, 2014 There's a minor controversy in the unpleasable TES fanbase as to whether Kirkbride's writings that didn't appear in games are "canon". And the topic reminds me of Jerulith from 3dnpc. Ah, good ol' Jeru. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monganfinn Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 How come the Redguards always escape destruction?And how come the Dragonborn isn´t stopping the Thalmor? No matter which race he is, he already stopped Alduin from eating the world just for the Thalmor to destroy it?Or is he already dead, since the victory of the Thalmor is long after TesV:Skyrim?The demonic races, powerful enought to chase the dovah away just sit by when the planet - but not the plane of Mundus, the other "planets" are aedric planes but the moons?, gets unmade?Quite frankly I can´t see the Thalmor winning, I can see them winning over the empire but to reach their goal, there are many powerful beings in their way, the dovah- for the PC never extinguished them, the Akavir races, the creatures living in the sunken lands etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted September 25, 2014 Share Posted September 25, 2014 Well, I don't think the Daedra LET it happen. Several actually straight up die in the event. It's also clear that, while they 'won' in that mankind ceased to be and they are no longer restrained by mortality, the Thalmor don't actually succeed in their goal. It's kind of a mutually assured destruction scenario, that the Thalmor didn't really see comming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guantanamobayxx Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 (edited) One thing we must all remember about TES lore is that it is extremely controversial - on purpose. It changes from game to game, novel to novel, to give the person experiencing it a sense of history, mythology, and controversy. The Falmer for instance were in earlier games, but we only thought of them as ice goblins, having not discovered their true, heinous heritage until later on, and even later on their entire race is under debate. So whether or not you're getting quotes about lore from creators, they've intentionally created TES lore in such a way that while some things definitely DID happen, they want you to debate the truth and mysteries to provide a sense of immersion throughout the entire world - just like in real life. My own opinion about the Thalmor is that they do not want to 'unmake' the world, but revert the world back to the paradise the elves think they had long ago, in which case they wouldn't go to war with the Dwemer, because the Dwemer are part of who elves overall used to be before made flesh. It wasn't that there was 'no creation' -- In fact they had everything they desired in their mystical paradise, if they truly believed to 'unmake' creation they wouldn't have allowed the Aldmeri Dominion to place the Bosmer as equals to them. I basically believe they are just really elven supremacists, and that Ancano was just a bit off his rocker. They desire power and dominion because they believe Mer are in all ways superior to every other being, not total destruction, though how they want to acquire their dominion - IE return to their state as Ehlnofay and the glories they believe they had then - can certainly be seen as destruction from a 'mortal' viewpoint. We must remember creation did not start with Mundus, but with the separation of Anu and Padomay. With the creation of mortal cycles of life, certainly, but spirits were created from this and -existed-. With the return to the void, not even the entity Sithis would exist anymore, and that is certainly not what the Thalmor want. Edited September 28, 2014 by guantanamobayxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 The creation event the Thalmor are opposed to is the creation of mundus and the FORCING of Mortality on the Aedric spirits. This act can be seen in the transformation of Arkay, who before the creation of mundus was Tu'wacca, the 'God of no body cares'. Life and death still existed, as a concept, but it was not one that affected any of the Et'ada. After Mundus, however, Arkay is propelled to one of the premier positions of power, second only to Akatosh himself. Why? Because now everything can die. It's the imposition of Mortality that the Thalmor want to undo, by unmaking Mundus. They certainly don't want to undo the Anu-Padomay divide. Its also incorrect to say that the Bosmer are equals. The Original Thalmor were a collection of Altmer noble houses who were used to prop up a certain body of Bosmeri chiefdoms, essentially operating under the premise "You can't govern yourselves, so we'll do it for you". The same basic dynamic still seems to exist, with the Altmer members lording over their Bosmeri 'charges'. In fact, they seem to be so overbearing that there has been a running theme of Bosmeri unrest in Valenwood since the Dominion's coup, almost 200 years before Skyrim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guantanamobayxx Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Yes, but do the Bosmeri think of it that way, and also how it has progressed as well? (Rhetorically of course). Also... Gotta remember, there's conflicting lore about Arkay and Tu'wacca, Tu'wacca is from a completely different pantheon. Kind of what I love about these debates, as before we found out Alduin was really a dragon, we were all under the assumption for years that Alduin WAS Akatosh, and Or'key was Arkay (but now we understand that he's really Malacath, and stories make a lot more sense, but at the same time a lot of the stories all in between can lead to different opinions about whether THAT'S still the truth as well). A lot of elven pantheons are similar, but human ones can vary wildly and there isn't one clear dichotomy and distinction for parallels and a lot of confusion ^^. I suppose I don't really have an 'opinion' per se but just a reminder that TES lore is set up this way purposely, and it's what adds to the conflict in the world between factions, nations, races, and religions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terra Nova Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I guess it would help change your mind, that Ocato pretty much gave his life to keep the empire together and from falling to the Thalmor. Tidus Mede gave in too easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidbossVyers Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I guess it would help change your mind, that Ocato pretty much gave his life to keep the empire together and from falling to the Thalmor. Tidus Mede gave in too easily.Reading what you said with the voice of your avatar made me smile (I just recently unlocked her). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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