spoiler Why does everyone here seem and/or say they kill Loghain every time?

[frakle]

It's really simple. Loghain hung the death of the King on me, sent assassins to kill me, and sold my brothers and sisters into slavery. Off with his head. He would do the same with me if he had the chance, and boy did he try.

 

Problem is, he didn't do his homework before he tried to take down a one-woman army who wades through the blood of thousands of darkspawn and eviscerated every single fool that tried to stand in her way. Some brilliant tactician, huh? I wish there was an option to spit on his grave.

 

and the moral of this story is always do your homework unless you want to get destroyed by an elven warrior goddess who slaughters craploads of evil zombie dude things, dragons, werewolves, blood mages, abominations, demons, possessed templars, walking corpses, revenant things, and..

[LenSquig]

This is the first time Ive ever played DOA.

I decide to let Loghain live, and marry Alistar to Anora. I think they could make a very effective ruling team if they try. (I put in some pretty naughty mods, so they should be very pleased with each other in bed *grins*). If Anora is half the woman I think she is, Alistar will be thanking me tomorrow!

 

My thinking about Loghain:

I figure he should walk in the Grey Warden's Shoes, make him really see the magnitude of disaster he created by his bad decision at Ostagar (Ahhh... there's nothing like the staunch support of a reformed wh0re). I'd have Morrigan stick pointy ears on him and make him live penniless in the Elven ghetto too If I could.

 

Also being the pragmatic warden that I am, I just cant bear to throw out any viable resources when I'm already scrapping the bottom of the barrel. Loghain is a seasoned veteran and military leader, not too mention a pretty good sword/board tank. I figure in the worst case, I can use him as cannon fodder and steal all his equipment ... Bwahaahahhaa!

 

Yeah losing Alistar is serious loss for the party, BUT he is going to be very useful married to Anora and rule as King. In many ways this is even more important than his role in the party. He and Anora can give the country immediate stability and leadership that it desperately needs. Alistar might be pissed off with me, but I'd rather have that than the darkspawn loving me.

Edited September 17, 2011 by LenSquig

[Thandal]

But you can get all the benefits of the Alistair-Anora marriage and STILL execute Loghain for the treacherous, murderous, pompous, delusional, usurping pig that he is! ;D

 

His single-minded hatred of Orlais blinds him to the real danger, and leads him to damn himself, and almost leads to the destruction of the very land he is supposedly try to protect. (Convenient how Ferelden's "protection" requires that he become its leader, isn't it?)

 

Loghain is No Loss.

[Sync182]

Hmmm...Loghain:

* allowed the Grey Wardens to be massacred (personal)

* abandoned the king to die (treason)

* permitted an assassination attempt against the warden-PC (personal)

* permitted Tevinter slave-traders to operate out of Denerim (illegal)

* took a blood-mage from the lawful custody of the chantry (illegal)

* imprisoned a templar (illegal)

* if you played the Human Noble origin, he allowed Howe's attack on the Cousland house (illegal & pesonal)

* organised for the poisoning of Arl Eamon (illegal)

* tries to forcibly take lands from those who oppose him (per the Chantry Board quest Loghain's Push - illegal)

* appoints himself as Regent after Cailan's death when Anora at the least should assume the throne as Queen (illegal)

 

I'm sure there's a few I've missed. He cannot use the "Defence of Ferelden" to excuse every single one of these things. He dies.

Edited September 17, 2011 by Sync182

[Tarie]

as the person above posted, all that and....

 

... allows/encourages his supporters to refer to him as King Loghain (Orz. gates)

... is a villain we love to hate.

 

 

and I'd love the option to slap Ser Cautherin (sp..) for being a stooge.

[billyro]

Ser Cauthrien (sp...) is only following orders. Still, she could have easily gone against Loghain. Oh man, another thing about Loghain is that angry glare of his. *shudder*

[Kaldelar]

If I play a Human Noble, I always slice him up personally, but otherwise it's Alistair. I've read similar threads like these over at Bioware's forum, and many seem to proclaim how he changes after the Joining and redeems himself etc. When I hear this, I always think: People do not change. They simply become more who they truly are. So I kill Loghain every single time. I haven't even got the achievement for recruiting the treacherous, two-faced, backstabbing bastard.

 

Ah.... if I only could wack Anora too. I'd arrange their features in a comedic fashion and put 'em on display. Hm... I'll go and replay my Landsmeet save - see if I can beat him with just one weapon.

[Alehazar]

Ser Cauthrien (sp...) is only following orders. Still, she could have easily gone against Loghain. Oh man, another thing about Loghain is that angry glare of his. *shudder*

 

Cauthrien is a dweeb who insists on insulting my dwarf or elf (Don't interrupt churl, your betters are talking.) Yeah, right. Cauthrien suffers from misplaced loyalty; she sees what Loghain has done and what he has become, yet she believes that opposing him is akin to betrayal.

Then she can share his fate -which she will gladly do.

I just wish I could make that other sycophant (Ceorlic?) die as well. I'd love to let my Human Noble shoot an arrow through his mug when he tells me I am a spoiled brat.

 

And if Anora decides to stab me in the back, I'm always disappointed that Alistair will simply lock her in the tower. Too bad there is no alternative way of dealing with her. Ah well, can't have 'em all, I guess.

[brokenergy]

Hmmm...Loghain:

* allowed the Grey Wardens to be massacred (personal)

* abandoned the king to die (treason)

* permitted an assassination attempt against the warden-PC (personal)

* permitted Tevinter slave-traders to operate out of Denerim (illegal)

* took a blood-mage from the lawful custody of the chantry (illegal)

* imprisoned a templar (illegal)

* if you played the Human Noble origin, he allowed Howe's attack on the Cousland house (illegal & pesonal)

* organised for the poisoning of Arl Eamon (illegal)

* tries to forcibly take lands from those who oppose him (per the Chantry Board quest Loghain's Push - illegal)

* appoints himself as Regent after Cailan's death when Anora at the least should assume the throne as Queen (illegal)

 

I'm sure there's a few I've missed. He cannot use the "Defence of Ferelden" to excuse every single one of these things. He dies.

 

To counter-claim in order:

 

* The Grey Wardens' lives are not his concern. It's a role of a GW to slay every single darkspawn in anymeans possible. And that means fighting to death. They would haved been injured in the best or dead in the worst.

* If the Cailan lived, Ferelden would have gone back to the Orlais as Gaider clearly stated here and in the codex here that he (the king) was interested in marrying the Empress

* The warden and Alistair were legitimate threats towards the stablity of Ferelden, he had every right to kill him

* That was illegal (I give you that) but he need a way to fund his forces. Most likely that this was one of Howe's plans rather than Loghain's

* Same as above

* Also same

* He didn't allowed it, Howe did it on his own for petty revenge

* Eamon is also a legitimate threat, he would have use everything to obtain something which is good for him

* It's civil war, he has the right to crush his opponents.

* He can become regent if Anora want him to (which she did)

 

Just because you hate him, doesn't mean that his views are not justified. What is legal or illegal here has no bearing there.

[Alehazar]

Hmmm...Loghain:

* allowed the Grey Wardens to be massacred (personal)

* abandoned the king to die (treason)

* permitted an assassination attempt against the warden-PC (personal)

* permitted Tevinter slave-traders to operate out of Denerim (illegal)

* took a blood-mage from the lawful custody of the chantry (illegal)

* imprisoned a templar (illegal)

* if you played the Human Noble origin, he allowed Howe's attack on the Cousland house (illegal & pesonal)

* organised for the poisoning of Arl Eamon (illegal)

* tries to forcibly take lands from those who oppose him (per the Chantry Board quest Loghain's Push - illegal)

* appoints himself as Regent after Cailan's death when Anora at the least should assume the throne as Queen (illegal)

 

I'm sure there's a few I've missed. He cannot use the "Defence of Ferelden" to excuse every single one of these things. He dies.

 

To counter-claim in order:

 

* The Grey Wardens' lives are not his concern. It's a role of a GW to slay every single darkspawn in anymeans possible. And that means fighting to death. They would haved been injured in the best or dead in the worst.

 

The Grey Wardens want to bring in reinforcements from Orlais; that;s enough reason for Loghain to have them killed.

 

* If the Cailan lived, Ferelden would have gone back to the Orlais as Gaider clearly stated here and in the codex here that he (the king) was interested in marrying the Empress.

So? More likely it would've become a dual kingdom. If Calian would've married Celene, would that mean Ferelden would become subjugated to Orlesian rule again? That seems unlikely.

 

* The warden and Alistair were legitimate threats towards the stablity of Ferelden, he had every right to kill him

 

Killing the Wardens will only result in losing Ferelden to the Blight. So if Loghain is successfull, everything he;s being trying to save will be destroyed.

 

* That was illegal (I give you that) but he need a way to fund his forces. Most likely that this was one of Howe's plans rather than Loghain's

 

* Same as above

* Also same

* He didn't allowed it, Howe did it on his own for petty revenge

 

Loghain could've done something about Howe's treachery; he knew about Howe's actions as he tells the Human Noble at Ostagar that he is familiar with the king's promise. When he states at the Landsmeet, that "whatever Howe may have done, he should have been brought before the Senesechal", makes him a bloody hypocrite. His alliance with Howe is only convenient when Loghain can benefit from Howe's actions.

So not bringing Howe to justice, he allows to go unpunished.

 

* Eamon is also a legitimate threat, he would have use everything to obtain something which is good for him

 

At least Eamon isn't blind to the Blight's threat.

 

* It's civil war, he has the right to crush his opponents.

 

If he wins, Ferelden is doomed. Just because Loghain is blind to see the true threat of the Blight, doesn't make him right to destroy all of Ferelden's chances to oppose and overcome the Darkspawn menace. His actions will bring about the downfall of everything he cherishes and all he is trying to save.

 

* He can become regent if Anora want him to (which she did)

 

Just because you hate him, doesn't mean that his views are not justified. What is legal or illegal here has no bearing there.

 

His views will lead to the total annihilation of everything he wants to save. Though his views may be justifiable, his actions -if successfull- will doom every living soul in his "beloved Ferelden". He will brook no threat to Ferelden's safety -and its independence- from anyone. Clearly he fails to realise that the biggest threat to Ferelden is his own one track mind towards everything Orlesian. That makes Loghain the bigger threat to Ferelden,, than the Wardens and Eamon combined. Loghain simply is too pigheaded to do what is right, even if it means turning to Orlais for their contingent of Grey Wardens So maybe this isn't an issue of legal vs illegal, but one of whose actions are detrimental versus beneficial to Ferelden.