Maharg67 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Yes, as awful as it seems, right at this moment hostages are being held at a cafe in Sydney. The area is at the very heart of the city. Little information has been given to the public so far but the area has been evacuated and is on lock down. It brings to the fore front just how vulnerable society is and continues the urgency of the debate on the nature of fundamentalism, terrorism and how they had be dealt with in a fair, strong and effective manner. Perhaps somebody can link a news video to this topic of what is going on. As an Australian, though I live in a different city, I find the situation most troubling despite that far more Australians were killed in the Bali bombings decades ago. Perhaps, despite its relatively small size, it is because this is happening on Australian home soil. I fear over reaction as much as I do the actions of the terrorists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvnchrist Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 There is no middle ground with people who would use anyone or anything to further their aims. Terrorists are well within that group and don't really care what anyone thinks. There is no effective way of dealing with these people fairly. They consider their path divinely inspired and no person, even fellow believers are safe from them. This is a plague of human suffering because of politicizing a religion. Nothing more, nothing less. You need to eradicate those who would eradicate us. That might sound severe, but the West started screwing around there pretty close to a century ago and now we are paying the price for what our fore bearers started. We can't take history back. It is ours, we own it and that's the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboUK Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I don't know if this is related but something similar is going on in Belgium http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/belgium-hostage-drama-police-standoff-4813051 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZephyrDrake Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 An update on the Sydney Siege. (here is a link to live news currently covering it ABC News Live )Five of the hostages have escaped or been released, one had to go to hospital for an existing condition, but nobody was aparently hurt. Three of them were staff of the cafe.It apears to be a single gunman, and he has been identified by police as known to them, but police have not shared his identity.The gunman has been making demands via forcing hostages to text family/friends with them, calling and sending videos to news stations, and posting on social media, but the police have been supressing them as it is clear that the gunman is desperate for attention. The siege is now going into its 14th hour. The hostages apear to be allowed to eat. The exact number of hostages is unknown, and has been reported as between less than 13 and more than 30. The flag that is being displayed in the windows has been identified as the "testimony of faith" flag, which to people who don't know the differecne looks like the islamic state flag. Some reports claim that the gunman is demanding a real islamic state flag in exchange for release of a single hostage. Police took hours to establish direct contact with the gunman (not due to lack of trying) and are currently negotiating with him. All our thoughts are with the hostages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 An Iranian, apparently suspected of many sex related crimes, no known terrorist affiliations, and, most importantly, he is dead. Along with two other folks. No word currently how any of them got that way though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZephyrDrake Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) Two innocents died, one man and one woman. Several others are in hospital from gunshot wounds, including at least one policeman. The gunman was on bail on charges relating to the murder of his ex wife (accessory to murder, his current partner is charged with murder), as well as doing community service for sending extremely nasty letters to the families of dead Aussie soldiers. He has also been filmed protesting the war in the middle east by chaining himself to buildings and holding up signs saying "Aussie soldiers please stop killing innocent Afghans". He has also been charged with a large number of sex related offenses.He was a "political refugee", and a self proclaimed cleric. Edited December 16, 2014 by ZephyrDrake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvnchrist Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Maybe it's time to look more carefully at what the person is here for more than who he's running from. A Shiite terrorist running from a Sunni nation is still a terrorist. I really think we should keep an eye on those who come here to be protected from harassment and then harass others. Sometimes a person gets targeted for good reasons and bring those reasons here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharg67 Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 (edited) What has happened is a sad tragedy but we all need to be careful in not jumping to unwise conclusions. Was it an act of a terrorist or something else wrapped up in a facade of terrorism? Did the man strike out because he was a fundamentalist Muslim or because of psychological reasons or because of a mixture of pressures? Understanding why people carry out acts of terrorism helps to stop them from happening. My heart felt sorrow to the two victims, and their families, who did not deserve this tragedy to be visited upon them. Edited December 16, 2014 by Maharg67 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kvnchrist Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 What has happened is a sad tragedy but we all need to be careful in not jumping to unwise conclusions. Was it an act of a terrorist or something else wrapped up in a facade of terrorism? Did the man strike out because he was a fundamentalist Muslim or because of psychological reasons or because of a mixture of pressures? Understanding why people carry out acts of terrorism helps to stop them from happening. My heart felt sorrow to the two victims, and their families, who did not deserve this tragedy to be visited upon them. Did you miss the thing about him sending nasty letters to the families of solders who died in Afghanistan? Did you not hear he wanted the authorities to get him a Isis flag? Seems fairly cut and dry to me. As for understanding violence done in the name of religion you've got to open up another can of worms. I have my own opinion of people professing their belief in a glorified tooth fairy and even more, those who would kill for it. I'd say nuts is a good explanation for it all. As far as wisdom is concerned, people have been claiming the actions of others as wise or unwise by the virtues they themselves hold since the dawn of mankind. I have faith in human nature and the ability for self delusion. That goes for me as well, since this is coming from my own version of reality and I dislike the things I see. To me, it is unwise to continually ignore the evidence perpetrators give us for appearance sake. Sometimes what is there is actually there and no matter how many times you pick it up and examine it, it remains so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maharg67 Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 What has happened is a sad tragedy but we all need to be careful in not jumping to unwise conclusions. Was it an act of a terrorist or something else wrapped up in a facade of terrorism? Did the man strike out because he was a fundamentalist Muslim or because of psychological reasons or because of a mixture of pressures? Understanding why people carry out acts of terrorism helps to stop them from happening. My heart felt sorrow to the two victims, and their families, who did not deserve this tragedy to be visited upon them. Did you miss the thing about him sending nasty letters to the families of solders who died in Afghanistan? Did you not hear he wanted the authorities to get him a Isis flag? Seems fairly cut and dry to me. As for understanding violence done in the name of religion you've got to open up another can of worms. I have my own opinion of people professing their belief in a glorified tooth fairy and even more, those who would kill for it. I'd say nuts is a good explanation for it all. As far as wisdom is concerned, people have been claiming the actions of others as wise or unwise by the virtues they themselves hold since the dawn of mankind. I have faith in human nature and the ability for self delusion. That goes for me as well, since this is coming from my own version of reality and I dislike the things I see. To me, it is unwise to continually ignore the evidence perpetrators give us for appearance sake. Sometimes what is there is actually there and no matter how many times you pick it up and examine it, it remains so. I missed none of the things that you mentioned but such actions are not those of a disciplined, organised, finely goal focused terrorist. They are more the actions of somebody confused with links to Islam. What dedicated fanatic would foolishly draw attention to himself by sending letters to the families of Australian soldiers? Nor would one have to demand that the authorities get him a real ISIS flag; surely he would have bought one for himself for they can be obtained easily enough even in the West, surprising as that might seem to many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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