Two great ways to make Skyrim harder!

[zyg0tic]

My current character is level 29, has a full set of ebony and daedric weapons (got all when I was about level 20 :) and can tear through standard enemies quite easily, and just use paralyse poisons on tougher ones. In my very first playthrough I abused enchanting and it certainly made things incredible easy. Now that Im keeping enchanting limited, and using it to make money mostly, Im still finding the game somewhat easy.

My character dominates the economy, I can make gold on demand through smithing, enchanting and alchemy and so Im never too short of cash to buy anything from stores. I have +32% smithing improve total from store bought items, and have upgraded all my stuff.

 

I have a question about this method:

 

How many levels should I advance it to see a significant but not absurd difference in the challenge?

Also keep in mind Im trying not to die at all - in my current playthrough Ive only died once afaicr because of Lydia pulling a Dwarven Centurion close to me when I was hiding from it (I wasnt going to restart the game because of that sort of death!).

[Kardgar]

Finding the right challenge level is a difficult thing depending on the type of character you make and the amount of skills you use. I've found that limiting your character to a few combat skills (primary, support) and a couple of support skills to be the most challenging. Never use potions makes for a good challenge. Which is one of the rules of my current character. I have smithing on this one, but only the first two perks so as not to break it to much.

 

Really I'm at a loss to make the game more challenging. I made an archery, sneak, pickpocket, alchemist who wore no armor, used no magic and still destroyed the world in just fine garments and boots. Ultimately he capped out lower and earlier because he only used 4 skills (excluding passives, lockpicking, speechcraft, etc). Granted a person had to be extremely patient for some situations and draugr lords had to be finessed, but ultimately it was very easy past the initial 10 levels. Once sneak got to high it was gamebreakingly easy.

 

I tried an unarmed heavy armor warrior with nothing but heavy armor, smithing zero perks, no potions and no magic. Ultimately I had to level up skills I never used in order to get a chance to explorer higher level content but it was easier than it sounds. He was definitely the most challenging because no enchanted weapon and very low damage even with perks, race and store bought enchantments, became overpowered.

 

There's a fine line between tedium and challenge that's hard to find and being able to remove some options would be a nice addition; but even more so than Oblivion you can become entirely to strong for your own good and it actually gets much worse if you allow dragons to roam. Once you add dragon powers to the mix it becomes ridiculous.

[zyg0tic]

I used this method and added 4 levels. Just as the OP said, it doesnt give you a perk point or anything - it just jacks up your level while leaving your hp and everything the same.

 

The results are nice and it is indeed more challenging now.

[tjmontario]

using these console codes even on master where i play does me no good as a stealth assassin, i'm level 41, no smithing/alchemy/enchanting at all and still 1 hit everything even giants mammoths dragons etc....reason i say this, i pretty much never get hit or even seen and when i do get seen i just crouch in combat and get an insta kill cause of the dagger backstab cause of the shadow warrior perk ( the last sneak perk @ 100 )

 

iv started to actually pay for training in my light armor which i really hate as i never pay for training, but i need to if i want to max it and get more lvls ><

 

You might have to start from level 1 to get any benefit from "player.advlevel".

 

That's what I just did, was about lvl 40 archer that would 1 hit mobs while sneaking(playing on Master obv...) and I also exploited the crafting system to the tune of $40000 gold - in other words the game was pointless to continue.

 

Made a new game, loaded the "PISE Improved SkyRim Experience" mods, also used the command to stop all health regen in battle, also played with the level command and exited the cave to skyrim at level 51 lol....just to see how it would be, tested it on the bandits at the camp just outside WhiteRun and I couldn't even do any damage on them with my bow in sneak mode, then they 1 shotted me.

 

Decided that was a bit too extreme, so loaded back and lowered the level increase to 26.

 

So I am starting the game with most mobs having 25 levels on me lol. I am also playing the same type of character as before, wood elf archer.

 

It's nice to know that I might actually NEED to exploit the trades and use my perks wisely in order to advance in the game.

 

This game is very challenging now, as I also added most of the optional mods in that "Improved Skyrim Experience" pack, so now mages have healing spells, humanoids have health potions and use them, prices are higher at stores, sell price lower, etc etc

Edited January 8, 2012 by tjmontario

[spork542]

As far as challenge goes, I'm finding the game pretty playable on Adept, as long as I do as follows.

A. Not using/abusing smithing and enchanting to create godly equipment

B. Not using/abusing equipment that reduces spell costs to 0%

C. Not using enchanted weapons much

 

My reasoning is as follows for A.

I believe it to be an exploit. I don't know for sure, and it's an arguable point. But it's a semantic argument, and it makes no difference to me whether or not the issue was intended, a "fundamental design flaw" or otherwise. The point is that, regardless, it unbalances the game to an enormous extent. We can probably agree on that, so an obvious solution to the issue is: Don't craft ridiculously powerful items! It's pretty obvious, I think, that there is a cap on the strength of any material. You can't take any iron and make it more than a few times (at max, it might be much less, I'm not a materials science expert) tougher or harder than the original material. I cannot conceive of any way of taking a sword that would normally kill a dragon in 100 hits and then making it so strong (and still made of the same material) it can easily kill the dragon in one hit. It would break immersion for me. I don't mind the idea of making a weapon's edge slightly finer, or an armor slightly more durable, but come on, there should really be limits. The weapons you can make would make a Daedra Lord envious. There is quite simply no precedent for a blade that deals out thousands, or millions, of damage at once.

 

For B, it's pretty obvious there's something wrong with free master-level destruction spells. It's just plain broken. A berserker type character should not spend 35 levels slicing and dicing with dual swords and then be able to all of a sudden lob master-level destruction spells for free and become the greatest mage in Skyrim without any previous skill in magic.

 

C is just a personal choice. I've never liked enchanted weapons much because the charge goes down over time. I haven't found them to be necessary at all anyway. My dual-wielding warrior got through the entire main quest with two flawless Dwemer swords. Anything dies within seconds anyway.

 

Disclaimer: I have only used two characters so far. These are a dual-wielding warrior and a pure mage. I can say nothing about assassin/thief type characters.

 

Having said all that, I've gotten far enough with my dual-wielding warrior that the game does become pretty easy past level 15 or so. Everything that approaches dies in a few seconds of slicing and dicing, and everything that does not approach will be approached by my character, then sliced and diced. On one hand, I feel like my character, after gaining a lot of levels in an RPG, should be more powerful than pretty much anything. But on the other hand, it's not that much fun if I just own everything. In fact, I kind of stopped playing my dual-wielding warrior character for that precise reason.

 

And please, don't take what I'm saying as intolerance for others' playing styles. That's not the intent. To me, all of these things, except for C, are immersion-breaking, and I've explained why. Obviously, you can do what you want, and I have no issues with that, as long as it's fun for you. I've just explained what isn't fun to me.

 

Edit: When I say you can do what you want, I mean that you can do that because it's a singleplayer game. What you do, therefore, doesn't affect my experience or any else's.

Edited January 8, 2012 by spork542

[tjmontario]

As far as challenge goes, I'm finding the game pretty playable on Adept, as long as I do as follows.

A. Not using/abusing smithing and enchanting to create godly equipment

B. Not using/abusing equipment that reduces spell costs to 0%

C. Not using enchanted weapons much

 

My reasoning is as follows for A.

I believe it to be an exploit. I don't know for sure, and it's an arguable point. But it's a semantic argument, and it makes no difference to me whether or not the issue was intended, a "fundamental design flaw" or otherwise. The point is that, regardless, it unbalances the game to an enormous extent. We can probably agree on that, so an obvious solution to the issue is: Don't craft ridiculously powerful items! It's pretty obvious, I think, that there is a cap on the strength of any material. You can't take any iron and make it more than a few times (at max, it might be much less, I'm not a materials science expert) tougher or harder than the original material. I cannot conceive of any way of taking a sword that would normally kill a dragon in 100 hits and then making it so strong (and still made of the same material) it can easily kill the dragon in one hit. It would break immersion for me. I don't mind the idea of making a weapon's edge slightly finer, or an armor slightly more durable, but come on, there should really be limits. The weapons you can make would make a Daedra Lord envious. There is quite simply no precedent for a blade that deals out thousands, or millions, of damage at once.

 

For B, it's pretty obvious there's something wrong with free master-level destruction spells. It's just plain broken. A berserker type character should not spend 35 levels slicing and dicing with dual swords and then be able to all of a sudden lob master-level destruction spells for free and become the greatest mage in Skyrim without any previous skill in magic.

 

C is just a personal choice. I've never liked enchanted weapons much because the charge goes down over time. I haven't found them to be necessary at all anyway. My dual-wielding warrior got through the entire main quest with two flawless Dwemer swords. Anything dies within seconds anyway.

 

Disclaimer: I have only used two characters so far. These are a dual-wielding warrior and a pure mage. I can say nothing about assassin/thief type characters.

 

Having said all that, I've gotten far enough with my dual-wielding warrior that the game does become pretty easy past level 15 or so. Everything that approaches dies in a few seconds of slicing and dicing, and everything that does not approach will be approached by my character, then sliced and diced. On one hand, I feel like my character, after gaining a lot of levels in an RPG, should be more powerful than pretty much anything. But on the other hand, it's not that much fun if I just own everything. In fact, I kind of stopped playing my dual-wielding warrior character for that precise reason.

 

And please, don't take what I'm saying as intolerance for others' playing styles. That's not the intent. To me, all of these things, except for C, are immersion-breaking, and I've explained why. Obviously, you can do what you want, and I have no issues with that, as long as it's fun for you. I've just explained what isn't fun to me.

 

Edit: When I say you can do what you want, I mean that you can do that because it's a singleplayer game. What you do, therefore, doesn't affect my experience or any else's.

 

You want immersion? Try clearing Bleak Falls Barrow with the mobs set to 25 levels above you. The troll on the road there is impossible to kill so being a wood elf I used my daily and kited it up to the tower then mind controlled it, used it to help me kill all the mobs there, a few weren't that bad, one of them was tough as nails and would have been impossible for me to kill without the troll. Then the troll chased me up to the top of the tower once the mind control wore off and I jumped to my death.

 

THAT is immersion. lol

 

Im gonna have to start a new game again this time only up the level by 15.........25 is impossible.

 

Either way this game has got my attention again now that there is actually a point in playing it.

 

And as for your reasons: none of those are valid in any way once you up the difficulty using the player.advlevel command.

 

I am trying to find the perfect setting where the game is very difficult but still beatable while using ALL tactics/resources. That way there would be NOTHING to make me lose immersion.

 

I can not fathom why anyone would want to play SkyRim in a way where assigning perks, stats, and crafting are not VERY VERY important.

 

To me the game gets extremely boring and repetitive once the challenge is gone.

 

If you don't have to use your brain to advance in the game, the game sucks.

Edited January 8, 2012 by tjmontario

[spork542]

You want immersion? Try clearing Bleak Falls Barrow with the mobs set to 25 levels above you. The troll on the road there is impossible to kill so being a wood elf I used my daily and kited it up to the tower then mind controlled it, used it to help me kill all the mobs there, a few weren't that bad, one of them was tough as nails and would have been impossible for me to kill without the troll. Then the troll chased me up to the top of the tower once the mind control wore off and I jumped to my death.

 

THAT is immersion. lol

 

Im gonna have to start a new game again this time only up the level by 15.........25 is impossible.

 

Either way this game has got my attention again now that there is actually a point in playing it.

 

And as for your reasons: none of those are valid in any way once you up the difficulty using the player.advlevel command.

Hmm, I see the point in doing that, to some extent. My beef with the difficulty, and my reason for not doing something like that is that there are things out there, like high-level mage enemies, that can be quite frustrating even at the appropriate level. I don't know about anyone else, but I don't like being OHKO'd by enemies. I don't want to turn all enemies into bosses just to compensate for the game not being ridiculously hard.

 

I am trying to find the perfect setting where the game is very difficult but still beatable while using ALL tactics/resources. That way there would be NOTHING to make me lose immersion.

 

I can not fathom why anyone would want to play SkyRim in a way where assigning perks, stats, and crafting are not VERY VERY important.

 

To me the game gets extremely boring and repetitive once the challenge is gone.

Regarding repetitiveness, I see your point, but there's a fine line between keeping the game fun and making a system like Oblivion's, where you would level up but still be at a disadvantage against enemies. Also, regarding the assigning perks, stats, and crafting, I do think perks and stats should be important. They're there to be chosen and customized. Crafting, though, I kind of see as an issue of the playing style of your character. I don't do crafting as my pure mage, for example. Not everybody needs to be a blacksmith or enchanter, but I see no reason not to encourage players to assign perks and stats carefully.

[mclericp]

Great! advlevel does the trick for me. Before, i can 1shot kill a bandit or so on master since i have 100 archery and good gears with sneak critical, and 2-3 shots on regular monsters(not dragons/boss etc) and i m lv 55. When i added only 10 levels, dragons 2hko me and bandits no longer take 2-3 hits to kill but rather 7-8

[duracele]

Mybe its me but having to use commands to increase difficulty, doing any kind of leveling tweaking actually, is a major immersion killer for me. I cant imagine wanting to move forward after that... even if the game is easy.

 

Im a level 50 nord, sword and shield, heavy armor and i kill bandits mostly with one powerstrike. I kind of like that... ima dragonborn... blood of a dragon and if i am in a swordfight with a some dumb bandits then i feel its cool to end them with a swing of my sword. Makes me feel powerful :) Any real challange, when i have to really use some potioons, are boss battles. You know those guys at the "dragon" walls...

 

Funny thing is, i dont feel any loss of immersion if anyone makes a mod that increases difficulty in a way i dont know about... you know, adds some levels to enemy when i dont know about it then its fine :) Its just adds difficulty... its all i want to know! I think im weird... :)

 

 

I feel much the same way. i expect not to have to fiddle with files when playing a game i bought for 50 bugs. it gotta be so easy for the designers just to make it harder. from a game i expect the hardest difficulty to be so hard that i voluntarely play second hardest.

i am playing a cloth wearing khajit mage and save for dying from one well aimed arrow the game is no challenge at all and it hasn`t been since level 20 or so. reason i see is the insane time the enemies need to regain their stance after getting hit by a mighty blow. i mean as long as i had mana drinks there was no way dying to a dragon just because it always gets stunned when hit by a fireball. since i enchanted my cloth with 102% destruction magicka not even magicka is an issue anymore. so you can say dumb your char down dumb your npc down/ don`t use one. but that`s not the point. of course i am trying to get as good as i can get cause that`s my reason for playing rpgs.

[StaffSgtMaxFightmaster]

I originally started playing Skyrim on normal. As a mage that wore cloth the entire time up until when I stopped playing the character (36), I figured that it would be a decent challenge. I was more of a spellblade really. I would conjure allies, buff up with flame cloak and stoneskin, and go in swingin with dual (unenchanted) glass maces. That and elemental fury alone broke the game for me, even going melee wearing cloth. It was too easy. I moved on.

 

My next character was an unarmed Khajiit. Since I never really took advantage of smithing, enchanting, or much alchemy on my first playthrough, and considering I set it to expert this time around, I figured I'd need these advantages. Boy was I horribly wrong. Once again, around 35 or so, my character was gamebreaking good using potions to make enchanting better to make potions better to make enchanting better to make smithing better. I crafted a set of Daedric and upgraded it to have a total armor amount of around 600. My character required "Fists of Steel" to make damage with fists viable. Unfortunately my 130 damage (+15 claws, +115 armor gauntlets) per swing were far too much for anything my level to be a challenge. Immediately upon realizing that the crafting systems break the game, I changed it to master. Still too easy. I moved on...again.

 

This time around, I'm not taking any chances. I'm a sneaky rogue, on master. I'm exclusively NEVER going to smith a damn thing, and there's still one more thing I required to make the game harder--and boy have I been enthralled by the finality of difficulty I have found after long seeking, experimenting, and 3 playthroughs.

 

I'm sure many of you may know of these sole console commands that can make things so much more challenging, and are ADJUSTABLE to suit how much additional challenge a player may want past master.

 

The first is: "player.modav healrate x" where x is any value less than the 0.7 vanilla Skyrim grants you. I have mine personally at "player.modav healrate 0.2". This allows for me to still regen when out of combat or when resting, but when in combat, the regen does nothing for me.

 

The second is: "player.advlevel". This will allow you to "level up" your character strictly for the numerical value. You WILL NOT gain any perk points or stat points from this approach. Instead, it will simply put you x amount of levels above your "true" level, thus making enemies scale up to this imaginary level, and therefore making the game as adjustable in difficulty past master as you wish!

 

I hope this has been some assistance to those, who like me, found that master difficulty was simply not challenging enough. I am blessed that I stopped playing the first couple "broken" characters before I ever did any of the major content in such a wonderful game. Now, at last I can enjoy the game for what I feel it should be. Thanks for your time and happy gaming!

 

I never play any game above Normal. Im just that kind of player, its not fun when game is too easy, and definately when its too hard. Default is best. I even find Adept hard as melee player, sometimes i reduce it apprentice when fighting hard bosses.

Edited January 9, 2012 by StaffSgtMaxFightmaster