Managing the Load Order...

[Guest deleted34304850]

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Edited July 18, 2019 by 1ae0bfb8

[HadToRegister]

I get that automatic sorting solves all kinds of problems. Unfortunately, the issue I have now is something in my load order is causing the game to crash, and there is no VVortex errors in terms of load oreder. With NMM, and it's load order drag and drop, it was far easier to resolve this kind of issue. Why can't Vortex allow this load order drag, in addition to the automation provided by Loot? or does it and i can't see how to do it?

I take it you didn't read any of the Knowledge Base articles built into Vortex or watch any of the videos?

 

With NMM it was easy for you to make a load order that would crash simply because NMM didn't notify you of ANY Errors.

It was an "Ignorance is bliss" mod manager.

 

Obviously you have something not compatible with your game inside your load order and for whatever reason are blaming Vortex for it, and that you can't manually make it worse.

Once Again, STOP TRYING TO MANUALLY SORT YOUR LOAD ORDER, It's Unnecessary

 

If your game is crashing it's for some other reason, post your load order so we can see, and do so without insulting the people trying to help you.

[AugustaCalidia]

 

or does it and i can't see how to do it?

 

That's right. You've not yet seen how to do it. That's why others are advising that you read the Vortex documentation.

 

 

 

It's a shame folks in this thread are being obnoxious to folks who are hionestly here trying to reolve the issues they ahve with this software. How about you either help or leave your snide remarks to yourself.

 

 

It's a shame that you view as obnoxious people who are honestly trying to give you good advice.

[Marek357]

Sorry if my question started some heated responses. I'm coming at this neutrally, assuming that the people and knowledge base that compile LOOT know what they're doing and are better organized than the separate input of the thousands of individual mod makers who know their mods and some of the pieces of the puzzle but not the big picture. Then I read through 3 mod list and load order guides, BiRaitBec's predominantly. I've chatted through his forum and he seems super-knowledgeable, and he and numerous commenters in his forum are, from what you're saying, taking the "old-school" viewpoint that using NMM and manually ordering mods is the only way to go. So I tried to do a compromise, based on a commenter in his forums that said he was going to use Vortex, and create some additional Groups and to try to follow BRB's organization.

I loaded the mods in his list in the order he instructed, and even with "Autosort Enabled" it seems like almost all (if not all) the mods loaded into the "Default", group, so I reassigned them into different Groups based on the guides' suggestions. Then I loaded a bunch more mods and reassigned them to the different groups.

Are the advocates of Vortex saying that if I leave the limited number of initial Groups, just let Vortex load the mods into the Groups it wants, let it sort the mods how it wants, other than needing to occasionally tell it that a patch for the mod comes after a mod, that it should produce a stable, optimized build?

Is there a limit to the number of plugins that Vortex can handle? I have 472 ESM's, ESL's and ESP's, 111 of which are ESL's. If it can pull this off before I go to the Wrye Bash patch step, I'll be impressed.

I did have a number of cyclic errors when I moved mods, and noticed that putting mods back into different groups (not the Default group) resolved them.
I was also concerned when I couldn't follow instructions on the mod developers page like Scrap Everything which explicitly instructs loading at the end of the load order, but Vortex puts it in a Scrap Everything group, half or two-thirds of the way through the Groups if I recall their original arrangement.

So am I better off redoing the build and letting Vortex do everything, despite the default group mass loading and not following mod creator instructions, or should I leave things how I placed them with no cyclic or mod conflicts?

[HadToRegister]

 

Is there a limit to the number of plugins that Vortex can handle? I have 472 ESM's, ESL's and ESP's, 111 of which are ESL's. If it can pull this off before I go to the Wrye Bash patch step, I'll be impressed.

I did have a number of cyclic errors when I moved mods, and noticed that putting mods back into different groups (not the Default group) resolved them.

I was also concerned when I couldn't follow instructions on the mod developers page like Scrap Everything which explicitly instructs loading at the end of the load order, but Vortex puts it in a Scrap Everything group, half or two-thirds of the way through the Groups if I recall their original arrangement.

So am I better off redoing the build and letting Vortex do everything, despite the default group mass loading and not following mod creator instructions, or should I leave things how I placed them with no cyclic or mod conflicts?

 

 

1. First off, with that many mods you'll have to use a bashed patch no matter what because the Embryo engine can only handle 255 to begin with, you can run Wryebash from Vortex, and don't lock your Load Order in WryeBash, and if WryeBash tells you it5 changed the load order just hit CTRL+Z to undo what WryeBash did to restore the Vortex Load order, then Create your Bashed patch.

I would also seriously assess whether you really need 472 Plugins, and remove the dead weight and trim that load order down some.

 

2. For Scrap Everything, try putting it in Dynamic Patches group, or Late Loaders group to get it down to the bottom.

 

3. If you get cyclic errors, then you're going against the built in LOOT load rules. You seriously don't need to manually sort your ESPS at all, no matter what some Load Order Specialist says, because they're convinced that micromanaging the order of ESPS, rather than Meshes, Textures and BSAs is somehow more important.

 

4. I would redo the build and let Vortex sort your PLUGINS, and listen to Vortex when it tells you if your MODS are conflicting, because the load order of MODS is more important than the load order of PLUGINS.

[Guest deleted34304850]

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Edited July 18, 2019 by 1ae0bfb8

[AugustaCalidia]

 

So am I better off redoing the build and letting Vortex do everything, despite the default group mass loading and not following mod creator instructions, or should I leave things how I placed them with no cyclic or mod conflicts?

 

Nobody here in this forum, as far as I can tell, is advocating letting Vortex do everything. Rather, they are advising you to let Vortex do most of the heavy lifting, since that's what it was designed to do. However, there are times when some fine tuning will be required. That's where you intervene and make the changes necessary to eliminate cyclic and mod conflicts. In my own experience, I've had to do very little of that.

 

Your attempt to manage 472 esm's, esl's, and esp's is very ambitious and would tax the capabilities of any mod manager. Presumably you will whittle that down through patches, etc., to stay within the Bethesda cap for esm's and esp's. It will be interesting to learn how well Vortex can meet that challenge.

Edited December 16, 2018 by Augusta Calidia

[Marek357]

Per Steam I have 456 hours of play in on I believe 3 different mod builds of Fallout 4. I don't think I ever had less then 100 mods. I'm always pushing the envelop to 1. fill in the design gaps the developer left in the game, and 2. make it a different experience I as never replay a game otherwise. I actually spent the better part of the last 2 weeks painstakingly pouring over the Nexus, reading guides, searching mods for new versions, and seeing where there's innovation. That's how I ended up with my current mod total. A big portion of the non-ESL mods (~50+?) are VIS patches to make up for the crappy vanilla inventory system. Another big chunk comes from Sim Settlements and settlement crafting mods, as that's really the only creative area of the game once you've played through the plot for each unique ending, all companion relationships, etc. I've also included a fair amount of any original content that isn't flagged as game-breaking. You can call me stupid or ambitious, but that total isn't coming down. Think of it like a stress test for Vortex, Wrye Bash, and FO4. :)

In the spirit of keeping this constructive and contributing to the success of Vortex (which I like once I got through the learning curve), I'm happy to export the mod list for your perusal, and to update you on how stable and playable the build ends up.

Despite my years of modding from (at least) Morrowind on, using Script Extenders and ENB's, I think of myself as an average capability modder, and often marvel at the knowledge base of some in the community. So if I can pick up Vortex and some modding guides and make a great new game from it, that's a pretty compelling endorsement for all of those tools.

If you want to see my mod list and make suggestions, just let me know how to export the list of mods / plugins, whatever. :)

[HadToRegister]

Per Steam I have 456 hours of play in on I believe 3 different mod builds of Fallout 4. I don't think I ever had less then 100 mods. I'm always pushing the envelop to 1. fill in the design gaps the developer left in the game, and 2. make it a different experience I as never replay a game otherwise. I actually spent the better part of the last 2 weeks painstakingly pouring over the Nexus, reading guides, searching mods for new versions, and seeing where there's innovation. That's how I ended up with my current mod total. A big portion of the non-ESL mods (~50+?) are VIS patches to make up for the crappy vanilla inventory system. Another big chunk comes from Sim Settlements and settlement crafting mods, as that's really the only creative area of the game once you've played through the plot for each unique ending, all companion relationships, etc. I've also included a fair amount of any original content that isn't flagged as game-breaking. You can call me stupid or ambitious, but that total isn't coming down. Think of it like a stress test for Vortex, Wrye Bash, and FO4. :smile:

In the spirit of keeping this constructive and contributing to the success of Vortex (which I like once I got through the learning curve), I'm happy to export the mod list for your perusal, and to update you on how stable and playable the build ends up.

Despite my years of modding from (at least) Morrowind on, using Script Extenders and ENB's, I think of myself as an average capability modder, and often marvel at the knowledge base of some in the community. So if I can pick up Vortex and some modding guides and make a great new game from it, that's a pretty compelling endorsement for all of those tools.

If you want to see my mod list and make suggestions, just let me know how to export the list of mods / plugins, whatever. :smile:

 

Learn how to use Xedit, and pra's VIS-G script and you can do away with all of those ridiculous Vis patches.

 

I just VIS patch my esps directly now so I don't have to have a VIS patch for every single mod in existence.

 

[Guest deleted34304850]

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Edited July 18, 2019 by 1ae0bfb8