Managing the Load Order...

[Marek357]

Am I misunderstanding that Wrye Bash will make FO4 think that I have one really big plugin instead of the 361 plugins that count against the limit? Because if that's not the case, then I will definitely get it done under 255 plugin ceiling. I'm not going to try breaking a hard-coded limit, I just thought WB worked around that limit.

Also, in a popular modding forum in response to my chat about using Vortex and trying to dispel some of the popular misconceptions, I mentioned you can shut off Autosort and use Groups and Rules to sort manually if you absolutely felt you had to, and I got this response: "it just sorts all alphabetically if you unselect that option because all are categorized as default category. " I'm under the impression from speaking with you all that neither of those assertions are correct. Do you want to phrase a response for me that I can copy and paste into the forum in response?

[HadToRegister]

Am I misunderstanding that Wrye Bash will make FO4 think that I have one really big plugin instead of the 361 plugins that count against the limit? Because if that's not the case, then I will definitely get it done under 255 plugin ceiling. I'm not going to try breaking a hard-coded limit, I just thought WB worked around that limit.

Also, in a popular modding forum in response to my chat about using Vortex and trying to dispel some of the popular misconceptions, I mentioned you can shut off Autosort and use Groups and Rules to sort manually if you absolutely felt you had to, and I got this response: "it just sorts all alphabetically if you unselect that option because all are categorized as default category. " I'm under the impression from speaking with you all that neither of those assertions are correct. Do you want to phrase a response for me that I can copy and paste into the forum in response?

 

Yes, you're incorrect if you think that Wryebash will be able to fool FO4 into thinking you have one huge plugin.

Wryebash has it's limits too.

Wryebash can merge some mergeaable mods, and leveled lists, inventory etc, but it's not like you're going to be able to make a bashed patch, and then turn off every esp in your load order and only use the Bashed Patch.

 

To address your second question about "sorting alphabetically" clearly shows that those people know nothing of Vortex and just want to jump on the hate bandwagon about it.

Vortex uses LOOT rules to sort, and you can "sort" the visual order of the lists by NAME (which is those people probably incorrectly believe Vortex sorts "Alphabetically"), you can sort by Installation Time, Install order, Mod Index etc.

 

If you want to know about Vortex, ask in the Vortex forums

To use a common analogy, asking in a different forum about Vortex instead of the Vortex forum, is like getting your sex education by listening to teenagers talk in front of a 7-11 instead of a sex ed class.

[Marek357]

I've got some end-of-year time off, so I'm running / learning about Wrye Bash today. I think I ran it once on one of my games ages ago. First thing I see in the description is how it also has utilities for ordering mods / plugins to reduce / eliminate color-code identified file load order conflicts. With both Vortex having that function and Wrye Bash having it, do they both use LOOT for the ordering logic and so would be redundant, or is there any benefit from using this feature on Wrye Bash too?

 

You'd mentioned previously that "...you can run Wryebash from Vortex, and don't lock your Load Order in WryeBash, and if WryeBash tells you it changed the load order just hit CTRL+Z to undo what WryeBash did to restore the Vortex Load order, then Create your Bashed patch." I understand you're saying Vortex's sorting is better then Wrye Bash's, I'm curious (if you have the time and are so inclined) as to the Why of that reasoning.

 

I learn by knowing the reasons behind things, drives my co-workers crazy. :)

Edited December 19, 2018 by Marek357

[HadToRegister]

I've got some end-of-year time off, so I'm running / learning about Wrye Bash today. I think I ran it once on one of my games ages ago. First thing I see in the description is how it also has utilities for ordering mods / plugins to reduce / eliminate color-code identified file load order conflicts. With both Vortex having that function and Wrye Bash having it, do they both use LOOT for the ordering logic and so would be redundant, or is there any benefit from using this feature on Wrye Bash too?

 

You'd mentioned previously that "...you can run Wryebash from Vortex, and don't lock your Load Order in WryeBash, and if WryeBash tells you it changed the load order just hit CTRL+Z to undo what WryeBash did to restore the Vortex Load order, then Create your Bashed patch." I understand you're saying Vortex's sorting is better then Wrye Bash's, I'm curious (if you have the time and are so inclined) as to the Why of that reasoning.

 

I learn by knowing the reasons behind things, drives my co-workers crazy. :smile:

 

 

Vortex does a better sort because it uses built in Loot rules.

Wryebash doesn't have those things, so let Vortex sort the load order, then if you run WryeBash, you'll probably get a warning that Wryebash has just Changed your Load order again, so it's a simple matter of hitting CTRL+Z to undo what Wryebash did and restore Vortex's sort order in Wryebash

 

I only use Wryebash through Vortex now to make a bashed patch

[Marek357]

Quick update if you're curious: got my plugin total down to 254 ESM's and ESP's, to make room for one Wrye Bash Patch, finished the tweaking steps outlined in BRB's install guide (repacked loose textures into a BA2 for performance), and am testing the build now via play. So far everything is working as intended, and absolutely blowing me away as I really pushed my system to it's limits with texture quality, lighting, shadows, ENB effects, audio tweaks, etc. Like a whole new game. I did allow Vortex to do it's thing, and really only created new groups or rules where needed, except for a few instances of plugins I absolutely had to move to the end of the load order at the suggestion of the mod developer confirmed by my experience with those mods from past playthroughs. Still got quite a few things to test out, certain areas like settlements, Boston, Diamond City, etc. where mod conflicts might cause issues, but I was very happy with the way Vortex worked after I got past the learning curve with all your help. Thanks very much for your patience and willingness to answer my questions.

[Marek357]

Slight problem, played 1-2 hours, ran beautifully, multiple save points, exited game, shut down PC (Windows updated), started PC this morning, started game, can't load any save without CTD on load.

Thoughts?

I've never had a modded game run flawlessly and have every save corrupted / fail to load. Usually there's signs of trouble in the operation like lag / CTD's, etc. to go along with unloadable saves.

[halifornia]

Maybe I'm an idiot (I hope not), but I just installed Vortex today after a long hiatus from NMM. That said, I have a rather big issue.

 

Every single mod I already have installed for FO4 is now listed in the plugins tab, and I can't check for updates on ANY of these. Do I really need to go and remove every single one, and re-download from Nexus again, just to get Vortex to see them as Mods rather than Plugins?

 

EDIT: It also appears Vortex can't "uninstall" anything in the plugins tab. This is a complete nightmare.

Edited December 27, 2018 by halifornia

[PhaseVerocity]

Vortex needs to do... 1. mods that are installed after are automatically given higher priority which can be changed if you wish.

2. Vortex needs to stop freezing every time a deployment happens or something changes. (seriously I could make a cuppa in the time it takes.)

3. A mod backup procedure. Even just the mods archives.

4. Esp's need to have the ability to move up and down in the load order after a mod import from nmm. Its a lot easier to move mods than to try and change 200 boxes that say before after.

5. Import procedure needs to import from archives in nmm that aren't installed already. Or better yet read an nmm backup.

 

I know its a new program and I'm still using it despite all that stuff but its very painful when i have to wait so long after doing a simple task. Weirdly its the same wait time on my z8300 intel tablet and my intel i7 laptop.

[BigBizkit]

Vortex needs to do... 1. mods that are installed after are automatically given higher priority which can be changed if you wish.

2. Vortex needs to stop freezing every time a deployment happens or something changes. (seriously I could make a cuppa in the time it takes.)

3. A mod backup procedure. Even just the mods archives.

4. Esp's need to have the ability to move up and down in the load order after a mod import from nmm. Its a lot easier to move mods than to try and change 200 boxes that say before after.

5. Import procedure needs to import from archives in nmm that aren't installed already. Or better yet read an nmm backup.

 

I know its a new program and I'm still using it despite all that stuff but its very painful when i have to wait so long after doing a simple task. Weirdly its the same wait time on my z8300 intel tablet and my intel i7 laptop.

 

1. We have been discussing something like that internally i.e. having a customisable setting that would allow you to have mod priorities default to the install order - which is not perfect mind you, but mb a useful default setting.

 

2. That does not sound right. Unless you are using many mods (~500) deployment should not take that long. In extreme cases it should take 2-3 minutes.

 

3. Not sure what you mean by that. The archives you downloaded are never removed unless you instruct Vortex to do just that.

 

4. You should never have to adjust 200 plugins with your own rules. LOOT will sort them in a sensible fashion and rules should be used on a handful (if that) plugins that need manual adjustment. I can tell you from my personal load order consisting of around 200 plugins that it is being sorted fine automatically.

 

5. Vortex cannot see nor import files that are not (properly) managed by NMM. If the files are still in the archives, then they are unmanaged, and thus cannot be imported.

[tommyonsn]

how to change one mod load "100" to "1" ?