Syria

[Mandamus]

What is happening in Syria is tragic but I'm really not sure a Western intervention would help at all. Like most civil wars, there are extremists on both sides, I don't see how helping one side get rid of the other by dropping a few bombs here and there is going to help any.

 

Besides, I think perhaps the West as a whole should get out of Middle Eastern regional affairs. They are a time and money sink; at a time when other superpowers like China and India are emerging, and with the West experimenting some sort of decline, we should be focusing on getting our finances and industries back on track; are we really willing to throw away our economical advance for the Middle East? What will we get out of it in the long run? China, India, and African countries like Nigeria are going to become increasingly powerful as time goes by. I say the West should prepare itself for that, and not waste time, money, and people with the Middle East; they don't even want us there.

Edited September 16, 2013 by Mandamus

[HeyYou]

What is happening in Syria is tragic but I'm really not sure a Western intervention would help at all. Like most civil wars, there are extremists on both sides, I don't see how helping one side get rid of the other by dropping a few bombs here and there is going to help any.

 

Besides, I think perhaps the West as a whole should get out of Middle Eastern regional affairs. They are a time and money sink; at a time when other superpowers like China and India are emerging, and with the West experimenting some sort of decline, we should be focusing on getting our finances and industries back on track; are we really willing to throw away our economical advance for the Middle East? What will we get out of it in the long run? China, India, and African countries like Nigeria are going to become increasingly powerful as time goes by. I say the West should prepare itself for that, and not waste time, money, and people with the Middle East; they don't even want us there.

I pretty much agree with you. And now we see that more than 50% of reble forces are hard-line islamists, or al-queda..... gives me even LESS motivation to want to help overthrow assad. In my opinion, Assad is the LESSER of two evils..... We will be better off with him remaining in power, than we would be with yet another islamic state in the ME.

[sukeban]

Just wanted to share that Turkey shot down a Syrian helicopter yesterday after it supposedly entered Turkish airspace. The only catch is that the helicopter apparently crashed fully two kilometers inside of Syrian territory, meaning that it either never entered Turkish airspace at all or that it was already turned around and fleeing/back inside Syria by the time it was shot down. No matter the circumstances, such an incident is straying dangerously close to open warfare between the two countries, which, of course, might just be the entire point. Turkey desperately wants intervention and, with its enormous army, might be considering that they should be the ones to knock Assad over. Or, if they can claim self-defense, they can possibly rope NATO (so US/UK/France) into the conflict as a backdoor means of circumventing public opinion in those countries, couching the intervention in terms of treaty obligations rather than direct interference.

 

Which is all to say that efficacious warmongers don't give up, they merely bide their time.

[ginnyfizz]

You have a serious point there, sukeban, i think Turkey are far more likely than Israel to try and start something. As a postscript to that, the pilot apparently landed in Syrian rebel territory. Now if you thought the picture of the Syrian army soldier being decapitated with little toddlers sat on the front row was bad, at least the poor guy lost his head in one stroke of a sword. I sincerely hope that the pilot was already dead (he looked it in the video that I saw) when they sawed his head off with a knife. The group that I am a member of was already on the verge of puking as we saw that, but it got worse. Some other rebels also captured a priest and two other men and we saw them get the same treatment as the pilot, unfortunately these three were definitely still alive when the butchery began. It was made more gruesome (if that's possible) by the way that the crowd were jeering and getting close ups on their smartphones. I won't post links because they are truly graphic.

 

Intervene on behalf of these butchers? Hell no. They are certainly no better than Assad and quite probably a good deal worse.

[HeyYou]

You have a serious point there, sukeban, i think Turkey are far more likely than Israel to try and start something. As a postscript to that, the pilot apparently landed in Syrian rebel territory. Now if you thought the picture of the Syrian army soldier being decapitated with little toddlers sat on the front row was bad, at least the poor guy lost his head in one stroke of a sword. I sincerely hope that the pilot was already dead (he looked it in the video that I saw) when they sawed his head off with a knife. The group that I am a member of was already on the verge of puking as we saw that, but it got worse. Some other rebels also captured a priest and two other men and we saw them get the same treatment as the pilot, unfortunately these three were definitely still alive when the butchery began. It was made more gruesome (if that's possible) by the way that the crowd were jeering and getting close ups on their smartphones. I won't post links because they are truly graphic.

 

Intervene on behalf of these butchers? Hell no. They are certainly no better than Assad and quite probably a good deal worse.

Try convincing our government of that......

[Gracinfields]

The US Government should just let both groups kill each other off till both groups can't fight no more, then the UN can go in and clean up and remove both groups.

[JimboUK]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/19/syrian-government-civil-war-stalemate

 

The Syrian government have called for a ceasefire, normally I'd be optimistic but given the opposition I can't see much coming from it.

[HeyYou]

We'll see if the rebels can stop shooting at each other....... A three way war. That should be interesting......

[Hardwaremaster]

I found an interesting video on YouTube; I would like to see if I could get a second opinion on this matter, it's about a month old now, and he does basically examine everything we already know, then he attempts to put it together.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oRsAOKJhH8

Edited September 28, 2013 by Hardwaremaster

[Harbringe]

Except for some historical inaccuracies and false assumptions in the peripheral matters its pretty much bang on.

 

Here's a video that explains it much better.

 

 

 

This is also a bit old but lays out the basics of the issue confronting us pretty well . Though I must say with the recent developements of what appears to be a thawing of relations between Iran and the US , its like there is something else in the wind now , good or bad just don't know . All I do know is that Nutjobyahoo is pissed (What do you mean your talking to the Iranians) and the Saudis seem to be unsettled by it to say the least . Will it impact the situation in Syria or will it stay confined to the Iran question its a wait and see moment.