Icefiddell Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Yes not a very happy or inspiring title but this was a question asked during my physics lesson and i thought i'd see all your points of view. Ok My thoughts on this subject well i dont really want to answer, if i say yes i'm undermining my very existence and if i say no its a bit narrow minded. Think of this the planet has existed for billions of years, for hundreds of millions of years life has existed here but out of all the species that have walked and died on this planet man has been the only intelligent species (plus neandatols sp?). Life on Earth is just a series of extremly fragile and lucky statistics thrown together in a place so big that it just had to happen at some point, temparture, the atmosphere and so on. What if man is just one of these lucky calculations. The reason i called this thread 'title' was because every thing we do we seem to throw nature off balance, we destroy whole species of animals, we burn fossil fuels, we destroy the ozone layer and so on. Surely if intelligent life was meant to exist then the planet would be able to cope with all this instead of being thrown off balance. For example, Carbon Dioxide emissions. The more we throw into the atmosphere the worst things become, over time it would be possible for there to be so much that life on earth would just cease to exist. Now i'm going to stray a little off topic here but what about places such as Mars and Titan and so on. Not sure about Titan think that atmosphere is mostly Mephane but Mars is mostly carbon dioxide (heres where it gets a little farfetched) what if life had exsited on Mars. What if it had gone through the same process as earth and eventually intelligent life did exist on Mars and went through the whole process that we went threw and eventually ended up destroying themselves. Yes theres no evidence for this what so ever hopefully you get the idea. Well theres me finnished, whats your thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peregrine Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 "Meant to" implies that there was some plan behind our universe. There isn't. So the answer to your question is no, we weren't meant to exist. We just do. What if man is just one of these lucky calculations. That's exactly what we are. Well, there are various factors (evolution, time, etc) that favor intelligent life eventually appearing, but we're still the product of a lot of luck. Surely if intelligent life was meant to exist then the planet would be able to cope with all this instead of being thrown off balance. Only if the earth was designed, not the product of an inanimate universe.What if it had gone through the same process as earth and eventually intelligent life did exist on Mars and went through the whole process that we went threw and eventually ended up destroying themselves. What if it did? Lets ignore all the evidence for a moment, and assume that there was not only life, but advanced civilization on mars. What's your point? One society destroyed itself, that doesn't have anything to do with ours. There's nothing stopping us from someday fixing our problems well before they destroy us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramul Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Was intelligent life ever meant to exist?The term "meant to" implies purpose. Purpose, however, implies intelligence, or at least awareness. So then, what, preecisely, does this question mean? If it was "meant to" exist, does this imply actions taken at some point? If so, when? Would it make sense to ask of an empty universe, "Was intelligent life meant not to exist?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darnoc Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 The word "meant" does not necessarily lead to the conclusion that there was a plan behind something. In this specific case it could also mean that intelligent life cannot develop itself through evolution but must be created by some higher intelligence. In this case, intelligent life was not meant to be, because it disrupts the order of nature and the laws of nature. Of course there is no evidence which would support such a claim, so this is purely speculative. So there would be only a point in debating, if intelligent life was meant to be, if there was some higher intelligence. Since we cannot prove the existence of such a being, the basis of this debate does not exist. We could of course assume that a higher being which created earth does exist (since we cannot prove it), but then the whole debate in itself would be speculative and in the end perhaps amusing and interesting, but senseless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramul Posted January 13, 2005 Share Posted January 13, 2005 Did you just prove that this debate doesn't exist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThetaOrionis01 Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Perhaps we could also rephrase this question as 'does evolution necessarily lead to intelligence?' And the answer to that would be that as long as intelligence bestows an evolutionary advantage, yes. Of course, there is also the question how we define and recognise intelligence - is intelligence necessarily contingent on the evolution of carbon-based lifeforms existing within a narrow range of parameters? Or is intelligence far more widespread than we can imagine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark0ne Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 I'm not entirely sure about what the question asks specifically. Is this a "does other intelligent life exist?" debate, or a "Should intelligent life exist?" debate or "DOES intelligent life exist?" debate? It has always been a possiblity that humanity did stem from a higher intelligence, but I believe there's more chance of that higher intelligence being another race than from an omniscient being ... an alien's science experiment if you will. As for other life out there... Think of this the planet has existed for billions of years, for hundreds of millions of years life has existed here but out of all the species that have walked and died on this planet man has been the only intelligent species (plus neandatols sp?). Life on Earth is just a series of extremly fragile and lucky statistics thrown together in a place so big that it just had to happen at some point, temparture, the atmosphere and so on. ... it may have taken billions of years for this planet to form into it's current state and for humanity to evolve to where we are now, but time is infinite and there are trillions of planets out there. The odds for the lottery suck when you realise you've only got 2,000 odd chances of playing it in your life time (1 per week), but when you're able to play the lottery an infinite amount of times the odds go out the window ... its a sure thing you'll win. In a similar way, the odds that another intelligent species could have grown on this planet in a similar time frame are extremely small, but add infinity into the odds and you've got a sure thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramul Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 Here's the Drake Equation: N = N* fp ne fl fi fc fLSubscripts don't transfer, so LinkerooNOTE: This refers only to our Galaxy, not even the Local Group is included.I thought it had been established that there was a beginning to time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThetaOrionis01 Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 But does it have an end? http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung0304/fragend/confused-smiley-013.gif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramul Posted January 14, 2005 Share Posted January 14, 2005 "Wait and See" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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