Do You Think the Delayed Creation Kit Will Have a Long Term Negative Effect on Modding?

[JimboUK]

You guys might want to reread the FO4 EULA as it pertains to content ownership and paid modding. All of the legal mechanics for paid modding and Bethesda owning anything created with their software is already in place. The license doesn't say there won't be paid modding. It says end users cannot charge for mods.

 

Charging for FO4 mods wouldn't be retroactive since no mods to date have been made with an official Bethesda FO4 CK editor. All of the existing mods thus far have been hacked together with 3rd party software. Legally, Bethesda could insist game sites remove those mods since they violate to FO4 EULA. That doesn't mean they would do it, only that they could if they wanted to.

 

I think Bethesda.net will be a venue for paid modding for both PC and consoles, as well as free modding. One thing to be aware of; the EULA implies that if a mod is uploaded to Bethesda.net they will retain ownership of it.

 

The hand writing is on the wall, but very few are reading it.

 

I think if they tried it with FO4 the resulting sh**storm would worse than last time, they've said several times now that mods will be free, going back on that would piss a lot of people off.

[Boombro]

I agree, not only for mod users, any modder who shows any want in doing while have a really bad time.

[minngarm]

 

You guys might want to reread the FO4 EULA as it pertains to content ownership and paid modding. All of the legal mechanics for paid modding and Bethesda owning anything created with their software is already in place. The license doesn't say there won't be paid modding. It says end users cannot charge for mods.

 

Charging for FO4 mods wouldn't be retroactive since no mods to date have been made with an official Bethesda FO4 CK editor. All of the existing mods thus far have been hacked together with 3rd party software. Legally, Bethesda could insist game sites remove those mods since they violate to FO4 EULA. That doesn't mean they would do it, only that they could if they wanted to.

 

I think Bethesda.net will be a venue for paid modding for both PC and consoles, as well as free modding. One thing to be aware of; the EULA implies that if a mod is uploaded to Bethesda.net they will retain ownership of it.

 

The hand writing is on the wall, but very few are reading it.

 

I think if they tried it with FO4 the resulting sh**storm would worse than last time, they've said several times now that mods will be free, going back on that would piss a lot of people off.

 

All of their wording each time was saying basically free initially, or no current plans for them to be paid. Having a paid mod release would not be against their word, nor would it have even half as much uproar as the first time where a select few individuals were able to hood wink the masses into thinking it was some sort of evil conspiracy and personal insult. In the aftermath of the skyrim paid modding change the few obvious issues were well discovered and the bullshit propaganda against modders was discussed at great lengths in most communities afterwards. The plebs would not be driven to digital arms again against it so easily.

[JimboUK]

 

 

You guys might want to reread the FO4 EULA as it pertains to content ownership and paid modding. All of the legal mechanics for paid modding and Bethesda owning anything created with their software is already in place. The license doesn't say there won't be paid modding. It says end users cannot charge for mods.

 

Charging for FO4 mods wouldn't be retroactive since no mods to date have been made with an official Bethesda FO4 CK editor. All of the existing mods thus far have been hacked together with 3rd party software. Legally, Bethesda could insist game sites remove those mods since they violate to FO4 EULA. That doesn't mean they would do it, only that they could if they wanted to.

 

I think Bethesda.net will be a venue for paid modding for both PC and consoles, as well as free modding. One thing to be aware of; the EULA implies that if a mod is uploaded to Bethesda.net they will retain ownership of it.

 

The hand writing is on the wall, but very few are reading it.

 

I think if they tried it with FO4 the resulting sh**storm would worse than last time, they've said several times now that mods will be free, going back on that would piss a lot of people off.

 

All of their wording each time was saying basically free initially, or no current plans for them to be paid. Having a paid mod release would not be against their word, nor would it have even half as much uproar as the first time where a select few individuals were able to hood wink the masses into thinking it was some sort of evil conspiracy and personal insult. In the aftermath of the skyrim paid modding change the few obvious issues were well discovered and the bulls*** propaganda against modders was discussed at great lengths in most communities afterwards. The plebs would not be driven to digital arms again against it so easily.

 

 

If Bethesda is a reputable company they won't pull a stunt like that, they said they would be free, they didn't say they would be free for a while, if they go back on that then it's going to be even worse than before, "should have read the small print" won't cut it, people will feel that they've been lied to. The aftermath did get discussed but only by a relatively small group of people, the vast majority weren't involved in those discussions so no one can claim they were representative of the community and anyway, very few would openly admit they just didn't want to pay.

 

Bethesda have obviously moved their focus to pre-orders and season passes, if they pull a fast one with Fallout 4 then people will remember and that will hurt the pre-orders for the next title, pre-orders rely on trust, they'd be mad to do anything that loses that trust.

[mac2636]

 

 

What I don't get is, if mod users are such a minority then why did Beth put so many resources into bringing to consoles?

Because they are not a minority in Beth games.

Yeah I know. The question was really a rhetorical question and aimed at those here who keep saying PC players and mod users are only a small percentage of FO4 players.

[mac2636]

To me what Beth has done with FO4 is almost as bad as the Skyrim paid modding debacle. It seems very obvious to me, they skimped on easily modded in content to probably save them money on the front end and to have an easy way to generate future revenue (dlc that just adds settlement items etc). Why I think this is bad is it doesn't help modders at all, and it certainly shows they do not and probably never did care about getting money into the hands of modders.

 

Allowing Beth any increased control over modding would seem to be a really bad idea. As someone who just surpassed $100 in mod author donations for FO4 (pretty sure that puts me in a minoroty), I'm all for rewarding modders for their work, but I think its foolish to beleive Beth is "on the mod authors' side" in any way shape or form, unless it will benefit them monetarily.

 

Its sad really that Beth doesn't seem to want help modders more considering the massive amount of additional game and dlc sales they've received because of mods.

[minngarm]

 

 

 

You guys might want to reread the FO4 EULA as it pertains to content ownership and paid modding. All of the legal mechanics for paid modding and Bethesda owning anything created with their software is already in place. The license doesn't say there won't be paid modding. It says end users cannot charge for mods.

 

Charging for FO4 mods wouldn't be retroactive since no mods to date have been made with an official Bethesda FO4 CK editor. All of the existing mods thus far have been hacked together with 3rd party software. Legally, Bethesda could insist game sites remove those mods since they violate to FO4 EULA. That doesn't mean they would do it, only that they could if they wanted to.

 

I think Bethesda.net will be a venue for paid modding for both PC and consoles, as well as free modding. One thing to be aware of; the EULA implies that if a mod is uploaded to Bethesda.net they will retain ownership of it.

 

The hand writing is on the wall, but very few are reading it.

 

I think if they tried it with FO4 the resulting sh**storm would worse than last time, they've said several times now that mods will be free, going back on that would piss a lot of people off.

 

All of their wording each time was saying basically free initially, or no current plans for them to be paid. Having a paid mod release would not be against their word, nor would it have even half as much uproar as the first time where a select few individuals were able to hood wink the masses into thinking it was some sort of evil conspiracy and personal insult. In the aftermath of the skyrim paid modding change the few obvious issues were well discovered and the bulls*** propaganda against modders was discussed at great lengths in most communities afterwards. The plebs would not be driven to digital arms again against it so easily.

 

 

If Bethesda is a reputable company they won't pull a stunt like that, they said they would be free, they didn't say they would be free for a while, if they go back on that then it's going to be even worse than before, "should have read the small print" won't cut it, people will feel that they've been lied to. The aftermath did get discussed but only by a relatively small group of people, the vast majority weren't involved in those discussions so no one can claim they were representative of the community and anyway, very few would openly admit they just didn't want to pay.

 

Bethesda have obviously moved their focus to pre-orders and season passes, if they pull a fast one with Fallout 4 then people will remember and that will hurt the pre-orders for the next title, pre-orders rely on trust, they'd be mad to do anything that loses that trust.

 

Again every time they said it they said it in very particular wording that suggests it is temporary. It is not going back on their word. It is you failing to understand the exact wording they chose.

[minngarm]

To me what Beth has done with FO4 is almost as bad as the Skyrim paid modding debacle. It seems very obvious to me, they skimped on easily modded in content to probably save them money on the front end and to have an easy way to generate future revenue (dlc that just adds settlement items etc). Why I think this is bad is it doesn't help modders at all, and it certainly shows they do not and probably never did care about getting money into the hands of modders.

 

Allowing Beth any increased control over modding would seem to be a really bad idea. As someone who just surpassed $100 in mod author donations for FO4 (pretty sure that puts me in a minoroty), I'm all for rewarding modders for their work, but I think its foolish to beleive Beth is "on the mod authors' side" in any way shape or form, unless it will benefit them monetarily.

 

Its sad really that Beth doesn't seem to want help modders more considering the massive amount of additional game and dlc sales they've received because of mods.

Getting donations at all puts you in the 10% of modders, getting triple figures makes it 1% of modders. If the mod user community were more giving with donations there wouldnt be such push from mod authors to have the option to make some paid mods.

[Boombro]

To me what Beth has done with FO4 is almost as bad as the Skyrim paid modding debacle. It seems very obvious to me, they skimped on easily modded in content to probably save them money on the front end and to have an easy way to generate future revenue (dlc that just adds settlement items etc).

DLC02 adds also slavery and fights, not just building items.

 

llowing Beth any increased control over modding would seem to be a really bad idea.

We have no idea in what way Beth will control mods. I don't see how it can be bad since they hardly showed any hostile reaction to pretty much any mod, or youtube showcases.

 

Its sad really that Beth doesn't seem to want help modders more considering the massive amount of additional game and dlc sales they've received because of mods.

That doesn't make any sense, they did hire modders before, made tutorials for modding, and the mod tools is one of the best editing tools, add mod like stuff in new games and so much more. I saw much, much harsher modding environments that are hellishly unfair and beth is very chill about the whole thing.

 

And paid modding does help modders, how it doesn't? Even if the cut is small, it better than nothing all and pressing "like" buttons.

Edited March 12, 2016 by Boombro

[JimboUK]

 

Again every time they said it they said it in very particular wording that suggests it is temporary. It is not going back on their word. It is you failing to understand the exact wording they chose.

 

 

 

https://twitter.com/bethesda/status/610491547595902977 Where is the "for now" bit?

 

https://youtu.be/p5iowfsgiDs?t=5m51s same again. I understand the words, also I understand what people have taken from them and what will happen if it turns out Bethesda were using weasel words. I'm not saying they won't be stupid enough to do it, what I'm saying is that the brown stuff will hit the fan if they do.