Figuring out esp/esl with Wrye Bash and Vortex

[Skinjack]

I'm sorry if this has been asked before, but apparently something is not sinking in and I'm being told by multiple people something other than what I am experiencing. If anyone has any idea what is going on I would be extremely grateful for a head's up on this.

 

I run 190 esp's, 71 esp's marked in the header as esl's, and 13 true esl's (plus a lot of textures etc that don't have an esp). Now supposedly (from what I am told) I can run many more mods/patches that are marked esl's in the header and they don't take up any slots in my load order. But that is not what I have been finding when I run Wrye Bash. It still conforms to a 254 limit load list, i.e. esp's + esp's flagged as esl's - true esl's. Is anyone else experiencing this or can someone tell me what I am doing wrong? Is Wrye Bash no longer necessary when using Vortex? It's annoying the hell out of me. Just when I think I have this whole process figured out, someone throws me a curve ball (esl's).

 

Yes, I know they have been around a while, but they are relatively new to me and I'm just trying to figure this out. I've done extensive reading on the subject of esl's, when to use them, etc., but Wyre Bash is a different animal because there is so much written in so many different places that I have yet to find an answer. Is it no longer necessary if using Vortex or not? How do I get around that 254 limit that I'm running into if esl patches, etc are not supposed to be taking up any space? Every time I try it then run Wrye Bash it gives me an error to the effect I have over 254 plugins and crashes my game.

 

I'm running Wrye Bash 307.201807040057 and Vortex 1.0.5. Wry Bash says I have 261/292 mods (191 esp + 71 esp/esl) and Vortex says I have 491 active mods with 291 active plugins. I'm assuming that latter is without the Skyrim.esm included.

[HadToRegister]

What version of Vortex are you using, because mine says I'm running 152 Active Mods and 80 Light

[Skinjack]

Vortex 1.0.5. I updated it the other day and have done so regularly when it says there is an update available. At the top of the Plugins tab it does say Active:190 Light:71. It is on the Dashboard tab that it is saying 492 active mods (491 not counting Skyrim.esm I assume). But from what I have been told, I could have thousands of patches/etc if they are flagged esl. That just doesn't happen for me. Do I need to compress the form IDs and change the extension? From what I've read that's frowned upon because it screws with the load order. ESL comes before esp in the load order so I can't have the patch before the mod. Is Wrye Bash limited in that way and conflicting with the way Vortex is supposed to work, or am I just being obtuse when reading other posts?

 

Sorry, I should have specified more. 13 of those 17 Light are true ESL's so my count is Active + Light - ESL. It should be 248 total.

[Zanderat]

I don't think current builds of Wrye have this limitation. I am running 307.2019.1015.1424

[Skinjack]

Hmmm, I thought I had updated Wrye Bash more recently (like in the past 3 months), so maybe I'll have to look for that update. Thank you. I'll see if that works.

 

EDIT: Yep, last downloaded on August 02, but its been updated since then on September 26. Maybe I'll look around to see if I can find the more updated versions on Discord or something to see if there is a difference.

 

EDIT 2: So I found version 307.2019.1022.1723 in the Dropbox off the Wrye Bash Nexus posts tab, but my Norton is having an issue with it because its less than a week old and it says fewer than five people have used the file. Is this version stable or should I be looking for one that is slightly older? Also, do I need the LOOT update or just download the installer?

[Zanderat]

I hope it is stable. I am one of those five people...... :cool:

 

edit: I actually have 307.2019.1022.1725

[Skinjack]

OK, thank you. I'll update now and see if that makes any difference.

[Skinjack]

Well, its definitely counting mods differently than before. Mods: 263/294 (ESP/M: 190, ESL: 73). I guess we will see what happens when my true esp + esp flagged esl - true esl limit reaches 255.

[Tannin42]

You can have 254 plugins without the "light" flag (including the official game files and dlcs) and a couple of thousand "light" plugins.

"light" is anything that has the .esl extension and/or the light flag in the header.

All light plugins are loaded with the index FE but they will still overwrite/be overwritten according to their load order.

 

If a mod manager displays something different they are bugged or outdated.

 

Another thing: Within Vortex (and NMM and MO) we make a strict distinction between "Mod" and "Plugin". "Mod" is the entire bundle, including assets. "Plugin" is just the es* file.

One Mod can contain 0, 1 or multiple plugins. So there is no contradiction between 491 mods and 291 plugins.

 

The terminology in Wrye Bash is different, what we call "Mod" they call "Installer" and the terms "Plugin" and "Mod" are mostly used interchangeably.

[Skinjack]

Thanks for the reply Tannin42. Makes more sense in how I "assumed" they should work, but Wrye Bash was always throwing things off with its "over 254" message. I'll just have to wait to see what happens now that I have it updated to the latest version. I think I only have about 5 mods to go before I hit that "true .esp + .esp flagged .esl - true .esl" = 254 number to find out.