Lock to Index doesn't go higher than 99

[beebophuckleberry]

Every once in a while a mod is not sorted correctly. For me, this mod is Diversity- A Character Overhaul. On the Diversity mod page it's recommended that Diversity be placed late in the load order. This recommendation exist to prevent bugs. Specifically, blackface.

 

If Vortex sorts the mod, then it places it somewhere in the load order that causes blackface on NPC's. If I lock diversity to the index by manually assigning it to the end of the load order then the blackface bug is fixed.

 

The 'lock to index' feature lets you type in a number as high as 99. So, if you have 99 mods or less you could assign Diversity to the 99th spot if you wanted and the blackface bug would be a thing of the past. I have 541 mods which makes it impossible for me to place Diversity at the end because the highest you can place it in the load order is 99.

 

I found a workaround by adding Diversity to the group 'late loaders'. This works, but it would be nice to be able to manually type in a number to place it in a specific spot in the load order. Sure, Diversity isn't as critical to dial in the exact spot as long as it loads late, but other mods require fine load-order tuning.

 

Here is a example of finer tuning needed;

 

I use Immersive Weapons, Enhanced Blood, and Wildcat. Wildcat recommends being loaded after Immersive Weapons and after Enhanced Blood. If I could assign the load order manually then this problem would be fixed. But, even though those three mods are in the load order below 99, if I type in a specific number it sometimes puts that mod at a different place in the load order instead of the number I typed. For now, I've used that little icon next to Wildcat plugin and dragged it to Immersive Weapons and Enhanced Blood then told it to have Wildcat load after the other two. This works, but with 541 mods it's a challenge to drag the icon to another mod because not only do you have to scroll through a lot of mods, but you also have to find the other mod you're looking for. It took me a few minutes to hunt down those two mods so I could drag the icon and set the load rules. Turns out, they were all right next to the load order, but that didn't stop me from having to search all over before realizing they were right there. Ha!

 

Last example; USSEP should load right after the default plugins that come with the game. But, Vortex has one other mod load just before USSEP. Fortunately, this was easier to fix because I just typed in the number so USSEP load right after the default plugins.

 

Point being, sometimes we need to manually set a mod to a specific number in the load order. This might sound petty, but all of these little petty things could be fixed by simply allowing a higher number to be typed into the 'lock to index' feature.

 

Lastly, I've only been using Vortex for about a month. If I'm missing a easier way to set the load order for specific mods then please educate me :) As of right now there are 5 mods out of the 541 that I need to place in specific areas of the load order.

 

Final thought; maybe the Vortex devs purposefully don't let you set the load order with a large number of mods because it's too easy for someone to screw things up?

 

Thanks for reading and I look forward to any feedback or advice to better manage those mods that require a specific slot in the load order.

 

 

[HadToRegister]

You need to pay attention to if those mods you're trying to "Lock to index" are assigned to groups.

This is why I told you in your other post that using Lock To Index is NOT GOOD to use.

Also, turn off AUTOSORT

 

Also, a LOT of modders like to tell people to make sure their mod loads at the bottom of the load order and it's simply not true.

If LOOT is sorting them, then that's the way they're supposed to be sorting, and no amount of forcing a mod to load somewhere else is going to work

[beebophuckleberry]

You need to pay attention too if those mods you're trying to "Lock to index" are assigned to groups.

-I've paid very close attention. All of the mods are set to their default group except for Diversity and USSEP. Diversity keeps being placed in the middle of the load order causing blackface. USSEP keeps getting put at number 6 slot instead of the number 5 slot. USSEP is ALWAYS supposed to load right after the default plugins. That comes straight from Arthmoor. I think the person who helped make USSEP knows what he's talking about, right? Here is exactly what Arthmoor says;

After installing the mods, the following general load order needs to be followed:

Skyrim.esm
Update.esm
Dawnguard.esm
Hearthfires.esm
Dragonborn.esm
Unofficial Skyrim Special Edition Patch.esp
[The rest of your mods]

 

Source: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/266

 

And here is what the NEVERMORERJM (the Diversity author) says:

STEP 1: Install my mod via Vortex (or manually).
Load Diversity's assets last.

STEP 2: Check your load order. If using LOOT, it will NOT yet recognize my mod.
Go to your plugins. Find "Diversity - A Character Overhaul.esp" and drag it to the bottom.

STEP 3: Enjoy!

 

Source: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/5291/?

Wildcat, Enhanced Blood, and Immersive Weapons has a specific order too that isn't followed by LOOT. Source: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/articles/21/?

 

 

^^ These are the 5 mods I have to sort manually... but you're telling me it's not good to do that... I'm confused. I can understand not manually sorting 500 mod, but 5 seems reasonable.

 

This is why I told you in your other post that using Lock To Index is NOT GOOD to use.

-In my other post you recommended against using 'Lock to Index' because you suggest it could cause problems... and I agree 99% of the time. That's not the case here. I literally said the opposite is happening. In this case, manually assigning the load order for a specific mod solves the problem. If locking Diversity to the index is, as you said, not good, then why does it solve the issue and why does the mod author suggest loading late? What about Arthmoor and USSEP? What is the downside?

Also, turn off AUTOSORT

-Would you mind expanding on this? I'd appreciate learning the benefit of turning off AUTOSORT.

 

Also, a LOT of modders like to tell people to make sure their mod loads at the bottom of the load order and it's simply not true.

-I see modders writing that all the time. Again, I agree with your statement 99% of the time... but it's not a constant. I don't listen unless I'm experiencing a bug or it's a reputable author like Arthmoor, meh321, aers, etc. Sometimes you need to listen to the author to get things working right. I'll once again refer to the Diversity blackface bug as an example. The author acknowledges the LOOT problem. If I didn't listen to the mod author who suggest it be loaded near the end, then I would have blackface bug. Are you saying ignore the instructions on the Diversity mod page and instead play the game with blackface? What about USSEP... Should I ignore Arthmoors advice too???

 

If LOOT is sorting them, then that's the way they're supposed to be sorting, and no amount of forcing a mod to load somewhere else is going to work.

-I understand what you're saying and once again agree with your statement 99% of the time. But, if LOOT wasn't wrong, then how do you explain the diversity blackface bug? It's clearly stated on the Diversity mod page that it needs to be loaded late because LOOT doesn't recognize it yet, but LOOT won't place it where it works. <----this is a widely known issue too. Just Google 'Diversity blackface' and you'll see endless post about it or click the mod page link from above and read it from the sources. What would be even better, test it yourself and you'll learn something. I assigned Diversity to 'late loaders' and blackface is gone. Again, are you saying let LOOT sort and just simply play with blackface? I'm again confused from your advice.

 

I REALLY WANT TO BELIEVE YOUR ADVICE BECAUSE YOU HAVE ALMOST 14,000 POST... BUT SO FAR YOU'RE VERY WRONG ACCORDING TO ARTHMOOR AND NEVERMORERJM. Maybe you're generalizing in effort to protect others from thinking, "Oh hey look! I can manually sort! Let me sort 500 mods myself derp derp". But... I'm not a derp ;)

 

Understand I'm not arguing with you. I'm very much trying to get to the truth, but what you have said isn't correct IMO and I don't think it's right to have misinformation perpetuated around the forums.

 

Lastly, if I'm incorrect then please prove me wrong, provide sources, and call me a derp

 

--

 

Back on course about being able to 'lock to index' higher than 99. Vortex, can you make that happen please?

[Zanderat]

I am not sure. But what you are requesting my be a LOOT constraint. I would make a request in both the Vortex Git Hub and the LOOT Discord pages to have this added.

[Guest deleted34304850]

it's no-ones responsibility to prove you wrong - or right.

you post, asking for help - that help is provided. you don't like it - fine - its worth what you paid for it. go off and do something else. job done. right?

[HadToRegister]

 

Back on course about being able to 'lock to index' higher than 99. Vortex, can you make that happen please?

 

Well, since you want to argue about everything instead of following advice, I'll leave you to it.

I'm not going to try and defend what I said in some lengthy bullet-point essay

 

Also, your last point was already answered in your other thread.

 

Have fun.

[AugustaCalidia]

In my own experience with Vortex (since its early alpha phase) I have never had to lock to index. If I have to load a plugin late because I am not happy with LOOT sorting, I simply assign the plugin to a late loading group. That has worked every time (which is 3 times in almost two and a half years).

 

As for requiring a plugin to load absolutely last, that would be necessary only in the case where that plugin was in conflict with every other installed plugin. While such a situation may arise in a game with a small number of plugins, what about a game with, say, 200 plugins? In that case, the plugin would have to conflict in some way with all the 199 other plugins. This seems unlikely. The only real requirement here is that the plugin load after the plugins which is affects, not all the plugins in the load order.

 

However, if you believe that a given plugin has to load absolutely last, then assign it to the last loading group and make sure to use "load after" rules if there are any other plugins in the group. There is no need for lock to index.

[beebophuckleberry]

 

 

Back on course about being able to 'lock to index' higher than 99. Vortex, can you make that happen please?

 

Well, since you want to argue about everything instead of following advice, I'll leave you to it.

I'm not going to try and defend what I said in some lengthy bullet-point essay

 

Also, your last point was already answered in your other thread.

 

Have fun.

 

 

Instead of getting to the truth, you bow out and dismiss the conversation entirely. Don't you want to know what is or isn't correct? Don't you want to share correct advice instead of incorrect advice?

 

I posted back with the sources because it's the second time you provided me bad advice. The first thread I actually listened to you because I thought, "Wow, this guy has a lot of post. He MUST be correct." Several bugs later and a lot of research I discovered you were wrong. I make a new thread about this and guess who replies... the same guy who caused me problems before, you. But, I didn't want to be rude and call you a idiot so I decided to reply back this time with correct info and sources in effort to subtly educate you. Instead of looking at the sources I provided you simply exit the conversation. <---That's a typical ego move when someone gets offended. Instead, you should look at the sources, learn from it, and preach correct information rather than bad information.

 

Do us all a favor. Look at the link for Arthmoor... everyone knows who he is and what he's done for the Skyrim community. See what he says since you won't listen to me. I gave you the source... all you have to do is read it. Educate yourself, but please brother, don't get offended and continue to preach bad info. You hurt others that way and in the long run you only hurt yourself.

 

Lastly, sometimes you have to dig deep and make big post to get the information across. Don't be afraid to write back just because it's a big bullet point post. Please, provide sources that back up what you're saying so others will know too. As a result, we'll have another informed person who can help others. But as long as you back out then we can't figure out what is right or wrong regarding whether a modder should manually place specific mods into a load order.

 

I really do appreciate you TRYING to help. But please please please get your info straight. It makes me wonder how many poor souls listened to you and now have a buggy game.

 

What's funny is... my entire post was about a higher 'lock to index' number, but so far all you've done is avoid the main point of the topic and you hijack the thread to preach bad advice. Then, when proven wrong you run away without posting a source to back up what you said.

 

You my friend are the epitome of a bullshitter.

[beebophuckleberry]

In my own experience with Vortex (since its early alpha phase) I have never had to lock to index. If I have to load a plugin late because I am not happy with LOOT sorting, I simply assign the plugin to a late loading group. That has worked every time (which is 3 times in almost two and a half years).

 

As for requiring a plugin to load absolutely last, that would be necessary only in the case where that plugin was in conflict with every other installed plugin. While such a situation may arise in a game with a small number of plugins, what about a game with, say, 200 plugins? In that case, the plugin would have to conflict in some way with all the 199 other plugins. This seems unlikely. The only real requirement here is that the plugin load after the plugins which is affects, not all the plugins in the load order.

 

However, if you believe that a given plugin has to load absolutely last, then assign it to the last loading group and make sure to use "load after" rules if there are any other plugins in the group. There is no need for lock to index.

 

Thanks for the thoughtful advice. I like the way you made the point too because it's totally correct. Diversity conflicts with a handful of mods and by adding it to the group 'late loaders' it seems to load after the last conflicting mod. I'm currently doing it the same way as you by adding those handful of specific mods to a group and the other couple of mods I create a 'load after' rule. So far, it's all working out. With 541 mods I have only 3 bugs that I can find and all are minimal. And, all are being fixed by the mod authors too since they were bugs they were already working on.

 

Anyways, thanks again! I really appreciate you.

[beebophuckleberry]

it's no-ones responsibility to prove you wrong - or right.

you post, asking for help - that help is provided. you don't like it - fine - its worth what you paid for it. go off and do something else. job done. right?

 

Ha ha ha. I posted asking for a higher lock to index number. Someone came along with bad advice. I posted sources proving them wrong. And, you get mad. Grow up. Bye.