I’m tired of people who’ve never used Vortex complaining about how bad it is

[nedite8864]

I am a Vortex user who runs a (mostly ) bug free Skyrim SE modding setup with around 800 mods, including many massive script heavy ones. It’s taken me ~3K hours in Skyrim and likely that in modding time too.

Likely stemming from how obviously bad NMM was next to MO, people have mostly written off Vortex as bad without actually you know, trying it. To me, it is clear that Vortex is slightly worse for my kind of application — massive load order management. However, there’s a ton of ways where I’d argue it’s just different, and people claim it’s worse.

For example, in 99% of applications, you don’t need to have manual access to your load order, all you need is one plugin below another conflicting one. People using MO2 will say Vortex is bad because it doesn’t allow you to solve problems like this easily. But in Vortex all you do is say “make sure it comes after the conflicts”. It’s a streamlined way to assemble a conflict-free load order as long as you are willing to open xEdit.

I recently had someone tout how customizable MO2 is and s#*! on Vortex because it wasn’t. Of course, they had never used Vortex, so they failed to realize that literally everything — the colors, the fonts, the font sizes, the margin widths, the layout of menus, so on — is customizable. They had no clue, but they just wanted an excuse to vomit up “Vortex bad lol”.

I think what Vortex is actually way better at than MO2 is being beginner friendly (and that’s a really good thing!! Modding is hard for newbies!) the ability to, for example just download SKSE with two button presses… Man, for many newbs it’s their first time opening file explorer. You can mark plug-ins light in the mod manager. You don’t need to set everything up outside program files or any other windows directories. Things like that and a few others make it so much easier for people to start modding and get a <100 load order.

I get it, there’s a ton of people who will disagree with me. I know fixing plugin conflicts can be annoying without direct LO control. Many don’t like the conflict resolution system either, laughing at noobs when they post a big old cycle asking for help.

But for the love of god, both mod managers just have different approaches and both are highly capable, robust, and modern mod managers. let’s stop pretending otherwise.

[showler]

With Tannin having developed it Vortex is basically MO3.

 

But now we can look forward to the (distant) future release of Nexus' next mod manager at which point everyone will talk about the good old days of Vortex.

[gnarly1]

This whole area of 'modding tool superiority' is so fraught with FUD it's hard for a new mod user to get a handle on which tool is right for them.

Just some of the issues:

1. Discord echo-chambers

2. Reddit group-think and pile-ons

3. User mis- and preconceptions about how the app should work and being unwilling to adapt to the way the app works

4. Emotional rants from users who haven't read the docs or watched a tutorial video

Much of that can be chalked up to the general human problem of cognitive biases and people being needlessly tribal.

A while ago I went onto the Viva New Vegas Discord to let them know that the load order specified by the guide for the DLC was incorrect. In passing, I mentioned that I was using Vortex. It was as if I'd admitted to worshipping Satan. The religious zealots descended upon me, denouncing my use of an unholy tool. Paraphrasing the comments:

"Why are you using Vortex - it's a PoS!"

"Why don't you use a REAL mod manager!"

"We don't offer support if you decide to install the mods using Vortex."

Note that I didn't need support and hadn't asked for any. All I did was let them know that their guide was wrong.

Even a cursory glance through the Vortex support (gripe?) thread on this forum shows that many of the issues raised and blamed on Vortex are actually user-inflicted in some way or another and sometimes in ways that should have been obvious to a user who had achieved a reasonable level of proficiency in using the tool or the Windows OS. This is not unexpected, but it's often the belligerent and ranty tone of the user which shows they've already got a bee in their bonnet about Vortex

We all have different preferences, levels of competence and use cases when it comes to software and regardless of what we think of the other tools, we should be grateful that we have choices for what to use.

Another related issue is people who obstinately view automation tools as contributing to the dumbing down of the modding commmunity (a view they never provide evidence for), but for some bizarre reason don't consider mod managers (or xEdit, or Dyndolod or LOOT) as automation tools.

All that said, for some games (RDR2 and The Witcher 3 come to mind), the community-based mod managers are easier to use than Vortex because they are built specifically for those games.

 

With Tannin having developed it Vortex is basically MO3.

But now we can look forward to the (distant) future release of Nexus' next mod manager at which point everyone will talk about the good old days of Vortex.

I don't doubt this will happen. Back in the old Bethesda forum days when MO first came out, Arthmoor expressed some reservations about the virtual file system. Some of his sycophants then picked up on these comments and started spreading FUD about MO, including one zealot (who still posts on these forums) who discouraged a new mod-user from using MO even after admitting to never having used it himself.

 

History never repeats..... :teehee:

Edited July 18, 2023 by gnarly1

[Guest deleted34304850]

they're just ignorant know-alls who believe they have a devine right to tell you their thoughts. i'd bet good money most of them struggle to turn their pc on half the time.

[Pickysaurus]

Removed a couple of posts relating to how "MO2 is superior" as it really isn't necessary.

[xrayy]

Removed a couple of posts relating to how "MO2 is superior" as it really isn't necessary.

that is sad ! pm me, please. i want to have both worlds integrated. why do you delete this ?

why do nobody cares for that wish ?

 

my first sentence was "it is in my opinion not about using "this" or "that".

 

it is about the offered options not about superiority. nexusmods can ignore that or can not.

I hope for the second.

[Guest deleted34304850]

if you have used MO2 since 2015 why do you think you are qualified to talk about vortex and what it can or cannot do?

[xrayy]

if you have used MO2 since 2015 why do you think you are qualified to talk about vortex and what it can or cannot do?

i used mo since 2015. mo2 came later!

 

did i say anything about vortex quality ? you refer to my post that got deleted a few minutes ago ?

 

i'm open for a discussion to push vortex with some added mo2 features.

even better if some are already integrated...

[Guest deleted34304850]

that's an entirely different topic which is never going to happen, so again, why do you think you're qualified to discuss vortex and what it can/cannot do?

you want to preach about mo2 - go do that on the mo2 forum.

[showler]

Since they've moved onto actively developing the successor to Vortex, I doubt there's much point in arguing about major changes to it anyway.