Valve/Bethesda announce paid modding for Skyrim, more games to follow

[mcguffin]

In response to post #24593024. #24593174 is also a reply to the same post.

ScrollTron1c wrote:

WightMage wrote: Sadly true.

Well, money is actually a real way to show some appreciations. It's not the only one, but still.
I dont think a lot a modders want money as a business model, but being able to buy new games, extensions (to mod them also) just by donation, is kind of cool, actually. Edited April 24, 2015 by mcguffin

[Arguilleres]

I have no problem with mods being behind a paywall. What I do have a problem with is Valve and Bethesda taking 75% of the share. This screws over the modder more than it screws the user, and its sad they haven't realized that.

[icecreamassassin]

In response to post #24589329. #24589589, #24589619, #24589869, #24589984, #24590034, #24590139, #24590269, #24591409, #24591504, #24591544, #24591669, #24591839, #24591859, #24591919, #24592019, #24592054, #24592144 are all replies on the same post.

Maverick11 wrote:

DiaSin wrote: The modders get a maximum of 25% of the profit. How is this them getting what they deserve?

Arendella wrote: Everyone has even said they should of done this years ago.
Back in 2012-2013 when the modding scene was booming and Skyrim's modding community was huge.

A lot of them left nexus, and they could of easily made more money and if they polished it better instead of this really dumbass way of 75% of your proceeds which is Absolutely nothing I might add for the modder themselves, it probably wouldn't of been as a big deal.

Daiyus wrote: I don't think anyone is condemning mod authors for wanting a bit of commercial recompense. Anyone who's made a mod knows how labour intensive it can be.

I think the big complaint is how Valve/Bethesda are handling that business model; they're stripping 75% of that profit away for something that they were happy being distributed for nothing?

That and it completely changes the way the community works. I don't think anyone would complain about having a more prevalent donations system with recommended donations. That at least would be keeping with the ethos of the community.

I personally don't have a problem with paying authors for good work, but let me try it first, don't put it behind a paywall.

salvador33 wrote: If it was about some other method of supporting the modders, everything would be fine. They SHOULD get some money via an alternate system. But how is it not GREED when modders get only 25%?

1)How many mods are based on other people's work and assets? I am sure nobody will be greedy and they will share the profits equally.

2)Why do people complain about DLC? It TAKES TIME for the company to create that product. I think we have all seen where that thinking has led.

3) What happens when Bethesda decides that they will allow mods for their games to only be hosted on Steam? If everyone follows suit, say goodbye to the Nexus. But I am sure that monopolistic practices never hurt any consumers before.

4)If you're being paid, it's not a mod but a DLC. Your work better be stellar since you're now selling me a product and if it breaks I am expecting you to fix it or else. See how this changes the relationships in the community?

I am not against modders being paid for their work, I am against the method implemented.

Maverick11 wrote: 25% is very fair. The platform for modders to begin work is available and ready. That platform cost Bethesda and steam a great deal of money to prepare. It is very easy to for a modder to begin work and entirely hassle free when preparing their next project. 25% is better then nothing which has been the case since the dawn of modding.

pr0 wrote: In all fairness a mod author would make more money making mods on Twitch or YouTube than they'll ever make from the SWS program....because even Youtube and Twitch have better profit splitting policies than this.

I get a 60/40 split from YouTube...and I'm literally nobody, I'm sure far more popular people get 90% or even 100% of what they generate in ad revenue. I have friends that make more in one night on Twitch, just playing games, than a mod author is likely to make from the SWS program in the span of a year.

I'm not sure where Bethesda thinks 25/75 is even a fair split, and I'm not sure why a mod author would think it was either.

There are far more effective ways to monetize content than this.

uszpdoz wrote: this is a good thing guys...now modder will take full attention for their mod....so we wont see any paid mod get abandoned right?

belenbelen wrote: dude. please. stfu. the guyaboveme. please.

Celltrex wrote: Is that sarcasm? Have you ever heard about Early Access games? Most of them cost money, and they are left unfinished and abandoned, and customers have their money taken. Anyone who condones payed mods and other Early Access cancer is a thug.

Maverick11 wrote: ^ And anyone who doesn't support modders making money is selfish. Arguably the real thug.

TheLine wrote: 25% is NOT fair at all. I don't understand what sort of mental gymnastics you have to tell yourself to think that Valve deserves 75% of a mod that costs 0.25 and the creator wont see a profit until after its made over $400. How much of a shill do you have to be? Not to mention that modding is a hobby not a career. I would gladly donate (read: DONATE) money to a modder that i felt truly deserved it but anyone who thinks they deserve even a cent for a sword retexture is greedy and doesn't understand what modding is truly about. Which is the community.

numeriku wrote: 25% is very fair.

25%.

Fair.

Not sure if serious.

P.S: They only get that 25% if they make $400 from selling their mod(s). So if you only made $399.99, then you get nothing, while Valve and Bethesda claim all of it.

:3 Still fair?

Arendella wrote: Mowing my Neighbors backyard makes more money than this crap

Noortje wrote: If it was 90% then MAYBE I would consider purchasing on steam. 25%? Are you f*#@ing kidding me? Mod authors deserve 100% not f*#@ing 25%.

The most downloaded mod has 7.2 million unique downloads. The author would only receive 72000 dollars before taxes if EVERYONE who ever downloaded that mod bought it on steam. Long story short: The income mod authors will get from this is ridiculously low. If someone sells 7.2 million copies of something they don't deserve some asshole company stealing 75% of what they should have made.

Winjin wrote: When I see not-supporting guys saying that 25% is fair I start to think that it's either Bethesda or Valve sales reps. You know, guys who desperately try to pluck the shitstorm by trolling the community into thinking that it's TOTALLY FAIR.

Gaben is not love anymore. Gaben is not life.

Noortje wrote: Winjin that's a bit weird to say, Maverick has made two outstanding mods. Not everyone has to give back to the community by supporting.

Maverick11 wrote: @TheLine

This coming from a guy who has never made a single mod. I have never received a single donation for anything I provided from this site nor do I expect a single dime. To say donations is even a viable solution to make money is nonsense. Whats even more nonsense is saying that modders should accept this as a hobby and nothing more. Some of us actually do this in hopes that one day we can make a career out of it.

To me, making money doing what I love is better then making nothing at all. Perhaps the 25% is arguably low but as person who simply downloads mods as opposed to actually making them... that doesn't concern you at all. Not in the slightest.

The platform to host these mods cost money. The platform to create these mods cost money.

I will say 25% is pretty low, but it's not far off the mark of the industry norm for consignment of products like this. In the indie table top RPG world there is a PDF seller that gives 30% and takes 70% with a $100 payout threshold. This is fairly common. same with amazon's create space at one point. The PDF seller even wanted you to send people to their sure from your own which is absurdity if you already have the customer yourself. The trade off is promotion, but frankly I don't think what steam offers in that area is worth their cut.

The best way to combat this? Show your financial appreciation to modders you like and give them no reason to defect. Think about it this way; you volunteer with an organization you believe in and does good things and one day they say that they have a paid position doing just what you volunteer doing and they are offering it to you. Nobody in their right mind would turn that down. This is very similar.

[Racoon247]

Does this mean the Nexus will have a similar pay for mods?

[EnaiSiaion]

In response to post #24592779. #24592899, #24593074, #24593094, #24593979, #24594029, #24594224 are all replies on the same post.

SvarogNL wrote:

insaneplumber wrote: Thanks.

AronaxAE wrote: Will come in extremely handy, thank you c:

WightMage wrote: Brilliant mate!

Charismoon wrote: Using your banner on my mods - thanks!

Magnalenian wrote: thanks!

AwesomeNino wrote: Im putting this on the dragonskin mod for fnv

Looks like the London Underground logo.

"Mind the crap" Edited April 24, 2015 by EnaiSiaion

[Georgiegril]

In response to post #24593024. #24593174, #24593264 are all replies on the same post.

ScrollTron1c wrote:

WightMage wrote: Sadly true.

mcguffin wrote: Well, money is actually a real way to show some appreciations. It's not the only one, but still.
I dont think a lot a modders want money as a business model, but being able to buy new games, extensions (to mod them also) just by donation, is kind of cool, actually.

I believe people who mod are artists who are creating in a particular medium. Donating to modders is like paying a street musician--sure, you could get it for free, but if it is beautiful and/or improved your day, then the money will help encourage them to keep doing it and adds to the benefit of yourself and the community.

[MadzMasteR]

this made me cry

[eldiabs]

In response to post #24589329. #24589589, #24589619, #24589869, #24589984, #24590034, #24590139, #24590269, #24591409, #24591504, #24591544, #24591669, #24591839, #24591859, #24591919, #24592019, #24592054, #24592144, #24593439 are all replies on the same post.

Maverick11 wrote:

DiaSin wrote: The modders get a maximum of 25% of the profit. How is this them getting what they deserve?

Arendella wrote: Everyone has even said they should of done this years ago.
Back in 2012-2013 when the modding scene was booming and Skyrim's modding community was huge.

A lot of them left nexus, and they could of easily made more money and if they polished it better instead of this really dumbass way of 75% of your proceeds which is Absolutely nothing I might add for the modder themselves, it probably wouldn't of been as a big deal.

Daiyus wrote: I don't think anyone is condemning mod authors for wanting a bit of commercial recompense. Anyone who's made a mod knows how labour intensive it can be.

I think the big complaint is how Valve/Bethesda are handling that business model; they're stripping 75% of that profit away for something that they were happy being distributed for nothing?

That and it completely changes the way the community works. I don't think anyone would complain about having a more prevalent donations system with recommended donations. That at least would be keeping with the ethos of the community.

I personally don't have a problem with paying authors for good work, but let me try it first, don't put it behind a paywall.

salvador33 wrote: If it was about some other method of supporting the modders, everything would be fine. They SHOULD get some money via an alternate system. But how is it not GREED when modders get only 25%?

1)How many mods are based on other people's work and assets? I am sure nobody will be greedy and they will share the profits equally.

2)Why do people complain about DLC? It TAKES TIME for the company to create that product. I think we have all seen where that thinking has led.

3) What happens when Bethesda decides that they will allow mods for their games to only be hosted on Steam? If everyone follows suit, say goodbye to the Nexus. But I am sure that monopolistic practices never hurt any consumers before.

4)If you're being paid, it's not a mod but a DLC. Your work better be stellar since you're now selling me a product and if it breaks I am expecting you to fix it or else. See how this changes the relationships in the community?

I am not against modders being paid for their work, I am against the method implemented.

Maverick11 wrote: 25% is very fair. The platform for modders to begin work is available and ready. That platform cost Bethesda and steam a great deal of money to prepare. It is very easy to for a modder to begin work and entirely hassle free when preparing their next project. 25% is better then nothing which has been the case since the dawn of modding.

pr0 wrote: In all fairness a mod author would make more money making mods on Twitch or YouTube than they'll ever make from the SWS program....because even Youtube and Twitch have better profit splitting policies than this.

I get a 60/40 split from YouTube...and I'm literally nobody, I'm sure far more popular people get 90% or even 100% of what they generate in ad revenue. I have friends that make more in one night on Twitch, just playing games, than a mod author is likely to make from the SWS program in the span of a year.

I'm not sure where Bethesda thinks 25/75 is even a fair split, and I'm not sure why a mod author would think it was either.

There are far more effective ways to monetize content than this.

uszpdoz wrote: this is a good thing guys...now modder will take full attention for their mod....so we wont see any paid mod get abandoned right?

belenbelen wrote: dude. please. stfu. the guyaboveme. please.

Celltrex wrote: Is that sarcasm? Have you ever heard about Early Access games? Most of them cost money, and they are left unfinished and abandoned, and customers have their money taken. Anyone who condones payed mods and other Early Access cancer is a thug.

Maverick11 wrote: ^ And anyone who doesn't support modders making money is selfish. Arguably the real thug.

TheLine wrote: 25% is NOT fair at all. I don't understand what sort of mental gymnastics you have to tell yourself to think that Valve deserves 75% of a mod that costs 0.25 and the creator wont see a profit until after its made over $400. How much of a shill do you have to be? Not to mention that modding is a hobby not a career. I would gladly donate (read: DONATE) money to a modder that i felt truly deserved it but anyone who thinks they deserve even a cent for a sword retexture is greedy and doesn't understand what modding is truly about. Which is the community.

numeriku wrote: 25% is very fair.

25%.

Fair.

Not sure if serious.

P.S: They only get that 25% if they make $400 from selling their mod(s). So if you only made $399.99, then you get nothing, while Valve and Bethesda claim all of it.

:3 Still fair?

Arendella wrote: Mowing my Neighbors backyard makes more money than this crap

Noortje wrote: If it was 90% then MAYBE I would consider purchasing on steam. 25%? Are you f*#@ing kidding me? Mod authors deserve 100% not f*#@ing 25%.

The most downloaded mod has 7.2 million unique downloads. The author would only receive 72000 dollars before taxes if EVERYONE who ever downloaded that mod bought it on steam. Long story short: The income mod authors will get from this is ridiculously low. If someone sells 7.2 million copies of something they don't deserve some asshole company stealing 75% of what they should have made.

Winjin wrote: When I see not-supporting guys saying that 25% is fair I start to think that it's either Bethesda or Valve sales reps. You know, guys who desperately try to pluck the shitstorm by trolling the community into thinking that it's TOTALLY FAIR.

Gaben is not love anymore. Gaben is not life.

Noortje wrote: Winjin that's a bit weird to say, Maverick has made two outstanding mods. Not everyone has to give back to the community by supporting.

Maverick11 wrote: @TheLine

This coming from a guy who has never made a single mod. I have never received a single donation for anything I provided from this site nor do I expect a single dime. To say donations is even a viable solution to make money is nonsense. Whats even more nonsense is saying that modders should accept this as a hobby and nothing more. Some of us actually do this in hopes that one day we can make a career out of it.

To me, making money doing what I love is better then making nothing at all. Perhaps the 25% is arguably low but as person who simply downloads mods as opposed to actually making them... that doesn't concern you at all. Not in the slightest.

The platform to host these mods cost money. The platform to create these mods cost money.

icecreamassassin wrote: I will say 25% is pretty low, but it's not far off the mark of the industry norm for consignment of products like this. In the indie table top RPG world there is a PDF seller that gives 30% and takes 70% with a $100 payout threshold. This is fairly common. same with amazon's create space at one point. The PDF seller even wanted you to send people to their sure from your own which is absurdity if you already have the customer yourself. The trade off is promotion, but frankly I don't think what steam offers in that area is worth their cut.

The best way to combat this? Show your financial appreciation to modders you like and give them no reason to defect. Think about it this way; you volunteer with an organization you believe in and does good things and one day they say that they have a paid position doing just what you volunteer doing and they are offering it to you. Nobody in their right mind would turn that down. This is very similar.

@Maverick11

As a person who has made mods, in my opinion, this is a very bad idea. Without the community, there is no modding. You can make the most amazing mod ever, and if people aren't behind you, it will go nowhere. Put your work on steam behind a paywall and you will alienate yourself from the community.

The modding community is about collaboration, and finding a common interest. There is no 'milking' going on. We all do this of our own free will, in our FREE time. The platform we created these mods on would exist whether we modded or not. We are all gamers here.

You want money from your hobby, get into game development and get a real job. Trying to make money off of mods is counter productive to the modding scene.

Trust me, there will be little acceptance of this change.

[Terramaris]

In response to post #24592274. #24592619 is also a reply to the same post.

xgkf wrote:

DocCopper wrote: I'd watch it! Just to see if the modding community, in its rage, would bring about the apocalypse by summoning Cthulhu or something. I'a I'a.

With the fire that is being thrown on the Workshop, I doubt the summoning of Cthulhu would make things any worse. We have passed the Godzilla threshold.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GodzillaThreshold

[metaphorset]

ppl, that's horrible news. Let's all hope that they leave the nexus untouched.

 

Throughout the last couple of years I figured that the guys from Bethsoft/Zenimax aren't the same type of lobotimized braindead idiots that parade the corridors of other game companies. So if it turns out that I was wrong on that account I will not hesitate and put them on my blacklist.