Donation Points system now live for mod authors on Nexus Mods

[Arthmoor]

In response to post #60322236. #60322816, #60323086 are all replies on the same post.

HadToRegister wrote:

First Nexus thinks that Skyrim SE and SKyrim VR are so much alike, (even though they Require different versions of SKSE), that they insist on clustering them together in the Skyrim SE section of the site (Like they did with Morrowind and Oblivion back in the day, and realized how bad that was), DESPITE how many people have suggested it's not a good idea, and now they've introduced an incentive program to steal mods.

This plan is not good, just wait, but what do I know? The Nexus is going to ignore it's older and experienced users and implement stuff that doesn't work

The Nexus is going to continue going ahead with bad ideas (Website redesign, mixing Skyrim SE with SkyRim VR, and Fallout 4 with Fallout 4 VR) while pretending to ask for User Input, while ignoring 100% of it.

Man, and I thought only Bethesda had bad ideas.

Arthmoor wrote:

now they've introduced an incentive program to steal mods

I think you're being overly dramatic about it. If a wave of mod thefts happens, a wave of banned users will follow shortly after. This ain't the Steam Workshop where we have to fight to stop this sort of thing from happening.

HadToRegister wrote: OK, I'll give you that.
I need to draw it in a bit anyway, I'm dealing with a family death and personal issues, and I'm letting it bleed over into the internet.
My apologies to all for falling for the "Cable News" type hysteria

No worries, and sorry to hear about your family issues. That's gotta suck :|

[DaedalusMachina007]

Hello. Newly-minted mod author here on the Nexus. My 'mods' are barely a drop in the ocean compared to the amazing (programming/coding) work that others have done on far more complex titles.

That said, I don't want to completely dismiss my contributions to the public internet community. I've done work and put real effort into the mods I've made for The Zodiac Age as well as several other game titles (mostly retro ones). I keep an updated list of them on my Discord server (FreshGaming).

 

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

 

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period. Nexus has no damn idea what modding is about (which surprises me) considering the absolute PR nightmare that Bethesda and Valve went through a short while ago when it came to the 'Creators Club'. That thing that nobody cares about, everyone laughs at, and which has probably generated next to nothing for the modders participating since the mod are already freely-available and the Creator Club is just reskins and stuff.

 

It is an INSULT to real modders to think we do this for money. No, we don't. We sure as hell don't. Those that do are not representative of the true spirit of modding. From the days of Doom 1 WAD files all the way to DSFix for Dark Souls and fairly recently with the Final Fantasy Zodiac Age modding going on (as well as countless others on a near-daily basis for Bethesda and non-Bethesda games).

 

There is ONE good thing I see from this entire system. Someone was smart enough to include options to spend on premium membership and donations to charity.

So I propose an alteranative: Those who have X amount of threshold in activity on their mods (comments, downloads, etc) uniquely from users will receive a free premium membership for X amount of time as long as they remain actively doing mods for the community. Just a thought, since CurseForge already does something similar.

 

Or just drop all the fluff and have 100% of the 'DP' earned go to charity without mod authors needing to do anything. Automatic opt-in and I don't believe there's a single modder that would object to their modding activity being Nexus-monetized to give 100% of the money raised to charity.

 

TLDR: Remove the Paypal/Premium options, keep the charity options, and have an automatic opt-in for all mod authors to help charity. Easy. Done. Great PR for Nexus as well.

[steve40]

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

 

How difficult is it for you to do some basic research before making stupid accusations? Dark0ne announced the DP system back in Dec 2017 and sought mod author feedback - the thread is 42 pages long (edit: it was actually discussed even earlier in this thread, as Reneer correctly points out below). You had plenty of opportunity to give feedback. The charity and premium membership options were among the many suggestions posted by mod authors.

Edited May 23, 2018 by steve40

[Reneer]

In response to post #60324731.

DaedalusMachina007 wrote: Hello. Newly-minted mod author here on the Nexus. My 'mods' are barely a drop in the ocean compared to the amazing (programming/coding) work that others have done on far more complex titles.
That said, I don't want to completely dismiss my contributions to the public internet community. I've done work and put real effort into the mods I've made for The Zodiac Age as well as several other game titles (mostly retro ones). I keep an updated list of them on my Discord server (FreshGaming).

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period. Nexus has no damn idea what modding is about (which surprises me) considering the absolute PR nightmare that Bethesda and Valve went through a short while ago when it came to the 'Creators Club'. That thing that nobody cares about, everyone laughs at, and which has probably generated next to nothing for the modders participating since the mod are already freely-available and the Creator Club is just reskins and stuff.

It is an INSULT to real modders to think we do this for money. No, we don't. We sure as hell don't. Those that do are not representative of the true spirit of modding. From the days of Doom 1 WAD files all the way to DSFix for Dark Souls and fairly recently with the Final Fantasy Zodiac Age modding going on (as well as countless others on a near-daily basis for Bethesda and non-Bethesda games).

There is ONE good thing I see from this entire system. Someone was smart enough to include options to spend on premium membership and donations to charity.
So I propose an alteranative: Those who have X amount of threshold in activity on their mods (comments, downloads, etc) uniquely from users will receive a free premium membership for X amount of time as long as they remain actively doing mods for the community. Just a thought, since CurseForge already does something similar.

Or just drop all the fluff and have 100% of the 'DP' earned go to charity without mod authors needing to do anything. Automatic opt-in and I don't believe there's a single modder that would object to their modding activity being Nexus-monetized to give 100% of the money raised to charity.

TLDR: Remove the Paypal/Premium options, keep the charity options, and have an automatic opt-in for all mod authors to help charity. Easy. Done. Great PR for Nexus as well.

There was ample discussion of the need / design implementation of the donation points system done back in August of 2017 in the Mod Author Nexus Feedback and Talk forum (link). I don't know if you were able to access that forum at the time, but many mod authors who participated in the discussion were in favor of the system (some were / are against, of course).

More importantly: You don't get to dictate who is a "real modder". You don't get to tell others what the "true spirit" of modding is about. People mod for many reasons and those reasons are their own. Whether or not their reasons align with your "real modder" concept is irrelevant. If you are that upset at this "insult" you can simply not participate in the donation points system. Or take your mods to another hosting site. Edited May 23, 2018 by Reneer

[Lisnpuppy]

<snip>

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

 

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period. Nexus has no damn idea what modding is about (which surprises me) considering the absolute PR nightmare that Bethesda and Valve went through a short while ago when it came to the 'Creators Club'. That thing that nobody cares about, everyone laughs at, and which has probably generated next to nothing for the modders participating since the mod are already freely-available and the Creator Club is just reskins and stuff.

 

It is an INSULT to real modders to think we do this for money. No, we don't. We sure as hell don't. Those that do are not representative of the true spirit of modding. From the days of Doom 1 WAD files all the way to DSFix for Dark Souls and fairly recently with the Final Fantasy Zodiac Age modding going on (as well as countless others on a near-daily basis for Bethesda and non-Bethesda games).

 

 

I am just going to assume you haven't gone back in the mod authors section where donations, pay mods and anything and everything evolving this issue has been discussed before ad nauseam. Though this final product may not have been an idea taken directly from a mod author, these things have been discussed and this was not created in a vacuum.

 

Also Dark0ne has a line he has to dance upon when it comes to money, mods and mod authors. He can't just do whatever he wants. He can't say, start something like a sell mod system like Beth has.

 

Finally no one is insulting mod authors by saying the only reason they do it is for money. If you think that you haven't been paying attention. But saying the ONLY reason someone makes mods is to give a gift of their work is also incorrect. I will be eternally grateful for those modders that have chosen to share their work with us, with usually not even a thanks for their hard work. But for some mod authors, the reason they have always done this for free is because there was no choice to gain any kind of financial compensation for their work. To think that no mod authors here wish to be compensated in some way for the work they do is a false pretense. Many mod authors want compensation in thanks, kudos, endorsements and/or donations. We have had a donation system here in the past that went just because you wanted to help an author. It wasn't tied to specific mods. Now a donation system has been created with an eye to that. Some mod authors want to use this. Some won't be interested and will keep just sharing stuff without worrying about the rest.

 

Now this system is new and is sure to have some growing pains. I have no doubt that there will probably be some tweaks or possibly changes to this. Heck, if it all goes to hell in a hand basket then who knows. Maybe it would just not work out. I been here 10 years now and things change, things come and go. Hopefully all moving for the better.

 

Now you seem to have some ideas that you think would improve this. Well by all means do share. Again, this maybe can be made better, maybe more options or whatever. But to think all mod authors think like you, that no one else differs in opinion of why they mod or what they hope to get from it seems that you are the pot calling the kettle black here.

[Zaldir]

In response to post #60323101. #60323591, #60323716, #60329741, #60332106, #60333001, #60340401, #60340836 are all replies on the same post.

mrjack900 wrote: So the onus is on mod authors (or in my case, former mod author) who have generously allowed their work to be used in other mods, to search the site to find out which ones have opted into the DP system and then report the mods making money from our work.

I wish I never gave open permission for my work with the caveats of credit given and no money made because the one time I had to report another modder for using my assets without credit, I was ignored repeatedly by Nexus staff and specifically your community manager. The whole ordeal was a nightmare for me and I ended up taking my mods off the Nexus because of it. Obviously 300 000 downloads is chump change to you guys.

And NOW I have to go looking for more modders making money off my art work and go through the whole stressful and ineffectual process again?

Will we even be able to see if a mod author has opted the mod into the DP system or will it be up to us to contact every author? Because that worked out so well for me last time... Jesus.

axonis wrote: I think I have found a better solution than deleting my mods. A year ago I've started developing (and switching my mods) under this license:

You are free to include this work, modified or not, in your work as long as you offer others the same freedom by including this paragraph in your work’s license without any modifications or restrictions.

That means anyone can use my mod to profit, but they'll also need to allow everyone else the same freedom. This will keep all gold diggers away because gold diggers don't want to allow anyone else access to their gold ;)

On the other hand, I have no problem with the Nexus giving money to some authors, especially those who are in really dire financial straights.

Lordkabal26 wrote: Hopefully Nexus realizes that they may need to introduce a percentage split option for mods that make use of other mods.

Besides if you yourself don't want to earn money, you can choose instead to donate the DP to three charities that are listed on the store page.

SirSalami wrote: @mrjack900. I'm unsure why you feel this way as there was discussion and administration based on our previous conversation. I'll be PMing you soon in case you wish to discuss. Thanks.

dikr wrote: So how's that tumblr page and the 21 likes working for you?
I prefer an open & free, dedicated platform like the Nexus where I get to download tons of mods for free and get a ton of exposure on my own which I mainly upload to contribute to the community, while not worrying too much about missing out on appropriate "credit" here and there or a couple of cents lost through 'stolen' DP.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: there ain't nobody going to make money from your assets.. or anyone's assets.. there would only be a few people that receive money from this and those that support this DP system have Stockholm syndrome. The Nexus has always been about parlor modders and this donation system is only going to cause more fighting within the community.. But I guess the Nexus believes in divide and conquer so they can keep all the control for themselves and own financial gains. .

mrjack900 wrote: @dikr - I don't even think I have 21 likes on a single tumblr post and I don't give a sh-t. If you think I was looking to become Internet "famous" through modding, you don't know me at all. I started sharing because I wanted to give back. I'm still doing that. So what exactly is your damage? Actually don't answer. I don't care.

mrjack900 wrote: @SirSalami - I'm not going to discuss everything here in the open forum but I'm also not going to leave it at "there was discussion and administration" as if your ignoring my PMs for weeks or months at a time didn't happen.

@Lordkabal26: Such a split option is already present. Edited May 24, 2018 by Zaldiir

[Zaldir]

In response to post #60319021. #60320551, #60321006, #60321391, #60321416, #60322086 are all replies on the same post.

Corsafire1 wrote: Mod authors who convert a lot of mods like one guy who ported 100+ follower mods to special edition are not working as hard to earn money. Some people will point that out over and over and like a dog never let go their teeth because we are stubborn. I just want to tell you that this is a very dangerous step like opening pandora's box. My intuition tells me this is dangerous, just wanted to let you know. If money gets into the modding community it will create a lot of tension in my opinion. The act of charity will be merged with selfish intentions and this uncertainty might separate us. It's controversial as well. The concept is good but it's unnatural. Donations are good enough in my opinion and it makes it even more special when someone gives his own money to you by kindness. I love the modding community and I fear making this service anything other than altruism would break the magic, the secret sauce. What about meme mods, fake mods, personal saves? I sense upcoming spam.

saurusmaximus wrote: I agree. As much as I love this website, and it's associated community, I fear this will only lead to an increase in low-effort garbage (and there is plenty of that already), rather than encouraging the creation of quality content.
I get rewarding the mod-makers; after all they are the bread and butter of this site, but I believe monetary rewards is the wrong way to go about it.

Hopefully, I'm wrong.

BlahBlahDEEBlahBlah wrote: You both have looked over the conversion rates, points to money, right?
...I feel like maybe not...

UWShocks wrote: I've ported a few mods; I refuse to add them to the Donation System as it seems to be a very scummy thing to do. However, mods I made myself I will add to the new system. Of course, I don't expect to make much, that's why I work for a living.

endgameaddiction wrote: "The act of charity will be merged with selfish intentions and this uncertainty might separate us."

Hate to break it to you but Beth modding has been tainted for a long time now. It's way too deep in the rabbit hole and there is no saving it.

Arthmoor wrote:

Donations are good enough

Unfortunately the stats we can all gather for those of us who get any tells a vastly different story. Sure, a lot of people SAY that they'd prefer to donate rather than pay outright or contribute to a prize pool, but this inevitably turns out to be all talk.

It is also possible to give 100% (or any other split) of the DP to the original author, which would be a nice way of giving back to them.

[DoctorKaizeld]

 

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period.

The Sims franchise.

 

Also no I do not support a system where I would be auto-enrolled into a charity donation program by uploading my mods here for rather good reasons that I do not wish to disclose as this isn't the place for it.

[Dark0ne]

In response to post #60324731. #60325251 is also a reply to the same post.

DaedalusMachina007 wrote: Hello. Newly-minted mod author here on the Nexus. My 'mods' are barely a drop in the ocean compared to the amazing (programming/coding) work that others have done on far more complex titles.
That said, I don't want to completely dismiss my contributions to the public internet community. I've done work and put real effort into the mods I've made for The Zodiac Age as well as several other game titles (mostly retro ones). I keep an updated list of them on my Discord server (FreshGaming).

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period. Nexus has no damn idea what modding is about (which surprises me) considering the absolute PR nightmare that Bethesda and Valve went through a short while ago when it came to the 'Creators Club'. That thing that nobody cares about, everyone laughs at, and which has probably generated next to nothing for the modders participating since the mod are already freely-available and the Creator Club is just reskins and stuff.

It is an INSULT to real modders to think we do this for money. No, we don't. We sure as hell don't. Those that do are not representative of the true spirit of modding. From the days of Doom 1 WAD files all the way to DSFix for Dark Souls and fairly recently with the Final Fantasy Zodiac Age modding going on (as well as countless others on a near-daily basis for Bethesda and non-Bethesda games).

There is ONE good thing I see from this entire system. Someone was smart enough to include options to spend on premium membership and donations to charity.
So I propose an alteranative: Those who have X amount of threshold in activity on their mods (comments, downloads, etc) uniquely from users will receive a free premium membership for X amount of time as long as they remain actively doing mods for the community. Just a thought, since CurseForge already does something similar.

Or just drop all the fluff and have 100% of the 'DP' earned go to charity without mod authors needing to do anything. Automatic opt-in and I don't believe there's a single modder that would object to their modding activity being Nexus-monetized to give 100% of the money raised to charity.

TLDR: Remove the Paypal/Premium options, keep the charity options, and have an automatic opt-in for all mod authors to help charity. Easy. Done. Great PR for Nexus as well.

Reneer wrote: There was ample discussion of the need / design implementation of the donation points system done back in August of 2017 in the Mod Author Nexus Feedback and Talk forum (link). I don't know if you were able to access that forum at the time, but many mod authors who participated in the discussion were in favor of the system (some were / are against, of course).

More importantly: You don't get to dictate who is a "real modder". You don't get to tell others what the "true spirit" of modding is about. People mod for many reasons and those reasons are their own. Whether or not their reasons align with your "real modder" concept is irrelevant. If you are that upset at this "insult" you can simply not participate in the donation points system. Or take your mods to another hosting site.

As Reneer said, a consultation did take place with all mod authors last August who wanted to participate in the mod author forums and a public announcement thread was created back in December. I've also had plenty of discussions with mod authors via Discord servers and Skype as well as sat back and read the myriad threads and posts made by mod authors on this very subject over the past several years. To think this was done with little or no thought is silly. Edited May 23, 2018 by Dark0ne

[DoctorKaizeld]

 

In response to post #60324731. #60325251 is also a reply to the same post.

 

 

 

DaedalusMachina007 wrote: Hello. Newly-minted mod author here on the Nexus. My 'mods' are barely a drop in the ocean compared to the amazing (programming/coding) work that others have done on far more complex titles.

That said, I don't want to completely dismiss my contributions to the public internet community. I've done work and put real effort into the mods I've made for The Zodiac Age as well as several other game titles (mostly retro ones). I keep an updated list of them on my Discord server (FreshGaming).

 

I'm deeply disturbed and angry at some of the options presented here that were done WITHOUT asking the very modders you proclaim to be helping. WHY!? How difficult is it to do a survey via Google Forms and ask mod authors to complete it? Or maybe just a survey here on the site? Is that too much work?

 

REAL MODDERS HAVE ALWAYS DONE OUR WORK FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAMES AND NOT FOR PERSONAL PROFIT/BENEFITS. This is true of every single noteworthy modder in every single game that I've seen modded. Period. Nexus has no damn idea what modding is about (which surprises me) considering the absolute PR nightmare that Bethesda and Valve went through a short while ago when it came to the 'Creators Club'. That thing that nobody cares about, everyone laughs at, and which has probably generated next to nothing for the modders participating since the mod are already freely-available and the Creator Club is just reskins and stuff.

 

It is an INSULT to real modders to think we do this for money. No, we don't. We sure as hell don't. Those that do are not representative of the true spirit of modding. From the days of Doom 1 WAD files all the way to DSFix for Dark Souls and fairly recently with the Final Fantasy Zodiac Age modding going on (as well as countless others on a near-daily basis for Bethesda and non-Bethesda games).

 

There is ONE good thing I see from this entire system. Someone was smart enough to include options to spend on premium membership and donations to charity.

So I propose an alteranative: Those who have X amount of threshold in activity on their mods (comments, downloads, etc) uniquely from users will receive a free premium membership for X amount of time as long as they remain actively doing mods for the community. Just a thought, since CurseForge already does something similar.

 

Or just drop all the fluff and have 100% of the 'DP' earned go to charity without mod authors needing to do anything. Automatic opt-in and I don't believe there's a single modder that would object to their modding activity being Nexus-monetized to give 100% of the money raised to charity.

 

TLDR: Remove the Paypal/Premium options, keep the charity options, and have an automatic opt-in for all mod authors to help charity. Easy. Done. Great PR for Nexus as well.

Reneer wrote: There was ample discussion of the need / design implementation of the donation points system done back in August of 2017 in the Mod Author Nexus Feedback and Talk forum (link). I don't know if you were able to access that forum at the time, but many mod authors who participated in the discussion were in favor of the system (some were / are against, of course).

 

More importantly: You don't get to dictate who is a "real modder". You don't get to tell others what the "true spirit" of modding is about. People mod for many reasons and those reasons are their own. Whether or not their reasons align with your "real modder" concept is irrelevant. If you are that upset at this "insult" you can simply not participate in the donation points system. Or take your mods to another hosting site.

As Reneer said, a consultation did take place with all mod authors who wanted to participate in the mod author forums. I've also had plenty of discussions with mod authors via Discord servers and Skype as well as sat back and read the myriad threads and posts made by mod authors on this very subject over the past several years. To think this was done with little or no thought is silly.

 

can you add a feature though that would allow us to donate money/DP to the staff? that'd be kinda cool.

 

also Nexus Bucks > Donation Points